yDLCmWXw

1
2Evo02/16/2019
3This is the typing channel for the anonymous Scorpion. Any input is appreciated!
4https://docs.google.com/document/d/1lmYWR2Afp5EAGafAhBVYgL4DX0tSJyBdJh8EgJO4ljI/edit?usp=sharing
5Google Docs
6Scorpion
7Your Enneagram Plus Questionnaire Results 12/02/2018 The following are the results from your Enneagram questionnaire. We will use the answers collected to create a type me channel for you on Discord. Our process is entirely anonymous at first to remove any biases people w...
8
9Evo pinned a message to this channel. See all the pins.02/16/2019
10Rasa02/16/2019
11:blobblush: will review
12Evo02/16/2019
13same
14bye02/16/2019
15me2
16bye02/16/2019
17im so intrigued by this person
18that i cant focus on typing them
19lol
20The people I'd most want to answer this about, though...... they've all described me as some version of: has a calming presence, creative, but weird in a way that means I'd make a good surreal horror protagonist.
21who are you i love you please let's hang out
22feels very 1ish though
23this whole thing
24whole good/bad dichotomy, holding oneself to extremely high standards. seething anger issues etc
25 For a very long time I'd go between holding too much in and exploding in rage. I don't typically get that outwardly angry anymore and am now often able to hold it in until I can channel it away from myself somehow, but might still seethe for hours. I still hold too much in because I expect my behavior to set implicit lines, eg. if I don't want my things touched by someone, I'll pointedly refuse to touch their things even if those things are very much in my way. I tend to set aside the smallest space possible for my own use out of what is available (ex. half a shelf out of a whole fridge, between 2-3 people), unless I am explicitly offered more, but this is with the expectation that I'm using so little space that no one will encroach... but if they do I get really pissed because at that point they're either stupid or doing it intentionally. 
26It's kind of a mix of this and the first one? Usually I'll keep it to myself because I'll feel worse if I talk about it, especially if it's fresh.
27
28this sounds 4ish
29Something about the reactions I get is... satisfying? Validating?
30 
31yeah 4
32On the other hand, the right responses can get me to let down my guard too fast, in which case I'll end up pulling back or feeling uneasy after a while.
33sounds very sp/sx
34ah anyway
35moving on
36My immediate response is to flare in anger. Typically, I'll shut it down pretty rapidly, pulling it inside until most of it doesn't show - like an iceberg made of being upset and pissed off. I'll hold it inside, leaking out, for hours or longer, trying and being unable to stop thinking about it. After that I'll definitely want to avoid the person - if it's a situation where I can, I will; if it's a situation where I can't, I deal with it. Maybe make myself apologize first to settle things, taking all the blame. Maybe doing something out of spite just so I can tolerate their presence.
37big mix of 1 and 4 lol
38On one hand, "the promise of happiness" sounds like a good thing. I wouldn't mind being happy more often. But the phrasing implies a constant, permanent happiness. I wouldn't want that. I want to be able to feel the full spectrum of my emotions, even when they sometimes suck to experience. There are things that I presently enjoy which I would lose the capacity to experience if I was always happy, and I wouldn't even be able to miss them. Enjoyment and happiness aren't necessarily the same thing, after all.
39
40I'd give up the promise of happiness instead. 
41fooooourrrr
42I've had a strong internal sense of right and wrong ever since I was a little kid, which has maintained more-or-less the same form this whole time, and I'm unable to go against it without a great deal of self-recrimination. 
43and 1
44this seems 1>4>5
451w9, 4w???, and 5w4
46actually idk about the 1 wing, calming presence and more withdrawn sounds 9ish tho
47Rasa02/17/2019
485, 4, 1, some 9 some 8
49mostly big 5w4 energy
50Masokissed02/17/2019
51big 5w4 energy :heart_eyes::heart_eyes::heart_eyes::heart_eyes:
52bye02/17/2019
53where :kittyhypethonk~1:
54Masokissed02/17/2019
55Idk I just saw big 5w4 energy and got excited
56:heart_eyes:
57izz02/18/2019
58i'm not saying this person is a core 9 (probably not), but can we please crown this the 9ist thing anyone has ever done in the history of 9dom: 
59Once I injured myself and x-rays didn't show anything so I endured the pain and increasing inability to walk for 3 years - turned out I'd dislocated my knee.
601-800-BULLY-ME02/18/2019
61lemme read this :eyes:
62izz02/18/2019
63 I don't even bother. If it's a factual matter, I'll google it and if they don't accept the answer that's not my problem. If it's a matter of opinion/taste/worldview/etc, I might explain where I'm coming from, but I don't expect my thoughts to convince anyone. It's enough if they accept that's my opinion and respect my right to have that opinion. I don't need agreement.
645w4. LOOK BITCH, THESE ARE THE FACTS, YOU EITHER ACCEPT THEM OR CONTINUE BEING WRONG. I'LL CONTINUE BEING COMPETENTLY FABULOUS.
65also can we change 5w4 official title to Competently Fabulous
66izz02/18/2019
67On one hand, "the promise of happiness" sounds like a good thing. I wouldn't mind being happy more often. But the phrasing implies a constant, permanent happiness. I wouldn't want that. I want to be able to feel the full spectrum of my emotions, even when they sometimes suck to experience. There are things that I presently enjoy which I would lose the capacity to experience if I was always happy, and I wouldn't even be able to miss them. Enjoyment and happiness aren't necessarily the same thing, after all.
68
69I'd give up the promise of happiness instead. 
70 4s smh
71MUST. FEEEEL. ALL. EMOTIONS. or else what will i write in my diary :sob: :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:
72Jules02/18/2019
73I think that dislocated knee story is more SP blind than anything
74bye02/18/2019
75Or weak Si lol
76cyкa?02/18/2019
77dude can i kin you @scorpion
781-800-BULLY-ME02/19/2019
79hmm
80
81first question deffo gives off sp dom vibes, 
82The slight physical discomfort is part of what makes that entire sort of out-of-the-ordinary outdoors experience special, it's part of the whole and shouldn't be avoided.
83
84gives off sx but not sx dom
85
86Limbo due to my lifelong sense of having some home to return to which may or may not exist on this world, my sense of existing in the realm between human and not 
87
889+4 ? vaguely
89
90Next are Anger and Violence. I've had a tendency to throw, break, and destroy things when angry since I was a small child (I don't do so nearly as often now, but...), and a tendency to become angry easily which was very difficult to overcome. 
91
92awareness of anger crashes out core 9 tho
93
94I hope to avoid being an evil person and losing my innate sense of morality entirely. I've long had a war between good and evil going on inside me, and it's only been in the past several years that the two have come to an uneasy truce. Though I've been told I hold myself to standards no human could achieve, told that by my own moral standards I'm a 100% good person, I am incapable of viewing myself that way. I can't accept myself as a human with both in me. If I'm not entirely good, I'm bad - and I am well aware I am not entirely good.
95
96hmmm 1w9? 9w1? coupled with the awareness of, and repressed anger, manifesting into self-criticism
97
98I only have so much idea how anyone specific in my life sees me, and I could not answer with any depth. I've heard many different combinations of "weird" "intense" "eccentric" "creative" "cool" "intimidating" "honest" "complex" "mysterious" "chill" and so forth as adjectives, in a general sense. The specifics depend on who's talking. Which is fine I guess? Besides which, whoever I pick is going to have a totally different view from anyone else. Everyone's their own person, and I can't expect people to have exactly the same views of me or of anything else.
99
100Internalized image, points to 4
101Second is... I suppose the way I assert my desires, though I'm unsure of the rest of that response. For a very long time I'd go between holding too much in and exploding in rage.
102
103deffo crashes out 8 even for a wing, and gives more points to 1
104
105B) I don't like when my emotional state is upset by others,
106
107:eyes: hmm interesting that you use emotional state tbh, rather than aligning the world to values. 4 over 1
108
109Historically, this one is more accurate. When I was younger, I would never show fear because I expected it to be used against me (and if I did show it, it would be).
110
111??? cannot tell if internalized shame or externalized anger but based on previous answers, lean to former
112
113#10 is 4 af
114
115i'll process the rest for now so uwu
116bye02/19/2019
117good point on 4 over 1
118i didnt catch that
1191-800-BULLY-ME02/19/2019
120:weary: umi acknowledges me
121:weary: :weary: :weary:
122bye02/19/2019
123?? I always acknowledge you sis
1241-800-BULLY-ME02/19/2019
125i have an exercise for u
126every time i use this emoji
127:weary:
128think in ur head my whore sounds
129xoxo
130bye02/19/2019
131thx u ruined my life
1321-800-BULLY-ME02/19/2019
133but omg ty :heart: :heart: :heart: lubyu too siszt
134bye02/19/2019
135gay
136:kitopup~1:
1371-800-BULLY-ME02/19/2019
138:heartato~1:
139Jules02/19/2019
140That first part you quoted @1-800-BULLY-ME says they go outside because it’s uncomfortable so still SP blind lol
1411-800-BULLY-ME02/19/2019
142rebuttal based on low/unvalued si
143tbf could work but
144that seems more in the realm of socio at that point imo anyway
145Jules02/19/2019
146I don’t know socio enough :GWoooTohruWeary:
147Mikhail zmivh02/20/2019
148oooooo im actually gonna start typing people again probably :eyes:
149In terms of balancing opposites, I seek out liminal spaces and states, as well as the tension between opposites, the pull which exists between both sides - this exists in situations as varied as the dichotomies of nature vs civilization, dawn vs dusk, life vs death, awake vs dreaming. The feeling of being between worlds, on the edge of passing into another dimension most people don't willingly enter, being someplace which feels forbidden yet peaceful. There's also the internal sense of how I experience either very strong emotion or very little emotion with the section of the scale in-between missing.
150 whew I must say this is phrased so beautifully and I wanna say 4 bc of that but that's memeing
151In terms of creating internal peace, this often means quiet solitude where I can work on whatever I wish, frequently both for myself and for some goal (though said goal varies greatly in magnitude). Sometimes that just means going off to think someplace dark and quiet where the moon and stars hang above and there's no one else nearby, or exploring a new place alone, or going to be near water.
152 uhh idk withdrawn tri?
153Going for a walk in the rain with no jacket or umbrella and allowing myself to get soaked if it's warm enough, or going out for hours to an isolated area while it's snowing if it's cold enough. The slight physical discomfort is part of what makes that entire sort of out-of-the-ordinary outdoors experience special, it's part of the whole and shouldn't be avoided.
154 i feel like theres some sx in here yeah
155Treachery not because I am a particularly treacherous person, but because if Dante's Satan deserved it, I likely do as well (never minding that I sided with Milton's Lucifer, and have had to play the role of the only one willing to speak up when something feels wrong, regardless of risk, on many, many occasions)
156 this strikes me as reactive tri or something..  6-ish? but that depends on how do you  "speak up when something feels wrong"? what does usually feels "wrong" that creates such compulsion to speak the truth?
157Next are Anger and Violence. I've had a tendency to throw, break, and destroy things when angry since I was a small child (I don't do so nearly as often now, but...), and a tendency to become angry easily which was very difficult to overcome. One of my earliest memories is of hatred to the point of wanting someone dead, when I was barely 4 years old. Hate's been kind of a theme in my entire life, and though it's lessened a great deal as I've become older, it hasn't entirely vanished and likely never will.
158 yeah would agree this isnt 9
159but again, i think depends on what you hate? why do you hate them?
160I hope to avoid being an evil person and losing my innate sense of morality entirely. I've long had a war between good and evil going on inside me, and it's only been in the past several years that the two have come to an uneasy truce. Though I've been told I hold myself to standards no human could achieve, told that by my own moral standards I'm a 100% good person, I am incapable of viewing myself that way. I can't accept myself as a human with both in me. If I'm not entirely good, I'm bad - and I am well aware I am not entirely good.
161 this is very 1...I wonder if this is related to that "hate" thing and "speaking up when things are wrong" thing
162I hope to avoid losing my sense of self, to avoid being forced to conform to societal or others' expectations when they don't fit my own preferences. If forced to do so I feel discomfort like I don't even belong in my own skin. It feels horrendous and disgusting. I'd rather be punished than do something which isn't me.
163 yeah 4
164The specifics depend on who's talking. Which is fine I guess? Besides which, whoever I pick is going to have a totally different view from anyone else. Everyone's their own person, and I can't expect people to have exactly the same views of me or of anything else.
165 this is a weird way to answer this question to me... just me making note of it.
166the second part of #5 about the holding in anger thing is kinda 1
167I still hold too much in because I expect my behavior to set implicit lines, eg. if I don't want my things touched by someone, I'll pointedly refuse to touch their things even if those things are very much in my way. I tend to set aside the smallest space possible for my own use out of what is available (ex. half a shelf out of a whole fridge, between 2-3 people), unless I am explicitly offered more, but this is with the expectation that I'm using so little space that no one will encroach...
168 with  a dash of 9
169but this whole part is defo gut fixation
170and kinda sp
171For pt 1, I compensate through a combination of staying distant and getting close way too fast. Which one will happen really depends on the person and circumstance. There's always one or two people in my life that I talk to a lot, though recently that's felt less necessary.
172 this sp/sx
173B) I don't like when my emotional state is upset by others, partially because if I show a reaction - and I can't help but show a reaction - they'll get upset at me and things just escalate from there and it's a pain, partially because A) once I'm upset I can't work on anything, no matter how important, because all I'll do is stew for hours on end. As for C) ....I just don't do this a lot. It's kind of stressful. 
174 again, lotsa 1 here.. reactive tri though in the beginning
175Historically, this one is more accurate. When I was younger, I would never show fear because I expected it to be used against me (and if I did show it, it would be). Out of fear of my emotions being used against me, I refused to show any emotion whatsoever. Out of fear of my opinions being used against me, I refused to show liking or attachment to anything, refused to say when I disliked things. If I didn't show anything about myself, no one could know more about how to hurt me. I still had opinions, still felt the emotions I hid. It was just all kept inside where no one could see.
176 finally an inkling on a head fix! this 5
177this barely comes up in the previous questions tho..
178I chose this answer because I had to choose SOMETHING, and with the anger issues I had growing up, and the fact that I can still react in anger rapidly, it seems the closest (though I was never quick to move on, and don't really enjoy confrontation). That said, they're all true in different situations. When I can't openly express anger, I sometimes passive aggressively snipe at people or have a harsh tone. Sometimes I hold in my anger so much that it's scared people because I SHOULD have gotten angry at them by now, because they know they're transgressing - but for the right person, I can let a lot slide until I'm given a reason to hate them.
179 again, 1, but theres defo reactive tri in here lol
180Internally imposed external stress: I can put up with this for YEARS, only venting to one or two people when I need to, until I finally collapse under the pressure I've put on myself. Usually when I do this people later tell me I'm insane for putting that much pressure on myself to succeed, but hey, even if I partially destroyed myself in the process? I did it and they couldn't have. I have a tendency to push myself way too far in this regard, though.
181 again 1... I thin @Evo had talked about the pressure thing before?
182or can also be any competency tri, but theres not much of that previously so I'd assign it mostly to 1
183I've been trying to find purpose, meaning, and the reason I exist since I was in single digits. Every time I think I have one, it slips away again.
1844
185I typically make some form of effort, though the situations determines if it's overt or subtle. If I try to get what I need and any obstacle arises, I just give up and experience the lack internally without saying anything. This generally results in resentment, but I don't feel like I can say anything at that point.
186 withdrawn AF 9 or 4 I guess.. the resentment thing is connection to 1 again..
187Once I injured myself and x-rays didn't show anything so I endured the pain and increasing inability to walk for 3 years - turned out I'd dislocated my knee. Had untreated 3rd stage Lyme for a few years. Etc.
188 how do you feel about having to endure the pain?
18915 is just withdrawn
190again, 16 is just super withdrawn
191My immediate response is to flare in anger. Typically, I'll shut it down pretty rapidly, pulling it inside until most of it doesn't show - like an iceberg made of being upset and pissed off. I'll hold it inside, leaking out, for hours or longer, trying and being unable to stop thinking about it. After that I'll definitely want to avoid the person - if it's a situation where I can, I will; if it's a situation where I can't, I deal with it. Maybe make myself apologize first to settle things, taking all the blame. Maybe doing something out of spite just so I can tolerate their presence.
192 so far this seems to fit for both 1 and 4... its a flip between these 2 imo
193brb
194I don't even bother. If it's a factual matter, I'll google it and if they don't accept the answer that's not my problem.
195 it starts with a 5 and ends with a 4....
196same with 19
197I don't relate to most people well at all. IRL I exist on the outskirts of wherever I am, and generally don't want to get close to anyone anyway. Online I lurk a lot and tend to not feel close to most people. For the people I AM able to relate to, it's a mix of adapting to them and contributing my own gifts. 
198 more points towards 5...
199On one hand, "the promise of happiness" sounds like a good thing. I wouldn't mind being happy more often. But the phrasing implies a constant, permanent happiness. I wouldn't want that. I want to be able to feel the full spectrum of my emotions, even when they sometimes suck to experience. There are things that I presently enjoy which I would lose the capacity to experience if I was always happy, and I wouldn't even be able to miss them. Enjoyment and happiness aren't necessarily the same thing, after all.
200lol 4
201I've had a strong internal sense of right and wrong ever since I was a little kid, which has maintained more-or-less the same form this whole time, and I'm unable to go against it without a great deal of self-recrimination. This sense of what's right applies only to myself - I'm much more lenient when it comes to others. However, I've occasionally gone against it on purpose to experience, observe, and analyze my own mental and emotional reaction to doing something I consider wrong.
202 idealist tri, or 1 again..
203so far I
204'd say 1 core or 4 core, 145 tri
2051w9 or 4w5 I guess
206theres only some 5 that I can see, not enough to be core imo, but perhaps its just bc of the questions
207theres too much of a 1-4 connections for 5 to be convincing tho
208sp/sx maybe
209ok now im back to 6 months being inactive again :waves:
210
211Evo02/23/2019
212LOL
213but yea i agree with umi haha
214i'm gonna go with 4w5, 1w9, 6w5 tentively
215and i could see any of them as core but the 4w5 sounds best for right now
216gonna read some more though
217the wing on the 1 could be 1w2 s well
218Evo02/23/2019
219Internally imposed external stress: I can put up with this for YEARS, only venting to one or two people when I need to, until I finally collapse under the pressure I've put on myself. Usually when I do this people later tell me I'm insane for putting that much pressure on myself to succeed, but hey, even if I partially destroyed myself in the process? I did it and they couldn't have. I have a tendency to push myself way too far in this regard, though.
220
221Internally imposed internal stress: I overreact but I keep it to myself and it's pretty likely no one will have any idea what I'm experiencing.
222
223Environmentally imposed stress: I kind of shut down after a while and need to be in a quiet area with dim lighting, no people, preferably a lock on the door, and possibly some other form of sensory help (soft things, incense, hot tea, etc).
224
225i think it's funny that you went from "stress" 
226to lol it sounding like how you deal with shame
227:kittyhypethonk~1:
228which makes me think 1) frustration triad  |  2) possibly 4 because of the way that you've categorized this lol
229my thinking being that 2s are not really always super in touch with this and neither are 3s, not to this degree of like categorizing it :Think:
230there are parts of this, and parts of #10 that seemed like maybe 4w3? but idk about all that
231Something about the reactions I get is... satisfying? Validating?
232like this part
233made me think either like 4w3 or 2
234lol can't tell
235i don't necessarily see 2 core though
236pretty much not at all lol
237but that bit about the "categories" made me actually think that
238well it is making me curious if there's potential for a new triad
239like one that's feels the vice of the head heart or gut triad so much that they make "if X happens, then Y will be the reaction"
240because i do that with anger
241anyways
24214) How do you see to your needs?: 
243-I just go after what I want. I don't feel like I need to earn them.
244-I do this by earning them. I prove that I am deserving.
245-I do without.
246
247Answer: I do without.
248
249Please tell us why you chose this answer:
250Explanation: I typically make some form of effort, though the situations determines if it's overt or subtle. If I try to get what I need and any obstacle arises, I just give up and experience the lack internally without saying anything. This generally results in resentment, but I don't feel like I can say anything at that point.
251
252yea this still seems like 4>1
253and also
254D: lyme disease
25515) + 16)
256both withdrawn af
25717) How do you deal with conflict?: 
258-I get worked up.
259-I avoid them.
260-I detach from my emotions.
261
262Answer: First two.
263
264Please tell us why you chose this answer: 
265Explanation: My immediate response is to flare in anger. Typically, I'll shut it down pretty rapidly, pulling it inside until most of it doesn't show - like an iceberg made of being upset and pissed off. I'll hold it inside, leaking out, for hours or longer, trying and being unable to stop thinking about it. After that I'll definitely want to avoid the person - if it's a situation where I can, I will; if it's a situation where I can't, I deal with it. Maybe make myself apologize first to settle things, taking all the blame. Maybe doing something out of spite just so I can tolerate their presence.
266
267okay yea i mean i think we can just stop here
268lol
269it you don't have an incredibly strong 4 fix i'll be very shocked lmao
270l'appel du vide02/23/2019
271why are we stopping :sob:
272Evo02/23/2019
273lol
27421) If you had to give up one thing for the promise of happiness it would be:
275-My awareness of who I am and what I desire.
276-My current object of intrigue.
277-My sensitivities and the attempts by others to help me.
278
279Answer: It's complicated
280
281Please tell us why you chose this answer:
282Explanation: On one hand, "the promise of happiness" sounds like a good thing. I wouldn't mind being happy more often. But the phrasing implies a constant, permanent happiness. I wouldn't want that. I want to be able to feel the full spectrum of my emotions, even when they sometimes suck to experience. There are things that I presently enjoy which I would lose the capacity to experience if I was always happy, and I wouldn't even be able to miss them. Enjoyment and happiness aren't necessarily the same thing, after all.
283
284I'd give up the promise of happiness instead. 
285
286this is so cute
287and also
288i've been looking to like um
289revise this question
290because many people interpret it this exact way and it's meant to represent fulfillment i suppose, or yes enjoyment
291l'appel du vide02/23/2019
292ooooo yeah that makes more sense
293Evo02/23/2019
29422) How do you gauge your values?: 
295-I attach to things that I perceive as good and try to remain consistent.
296-I engage the things that show promise and move on when they don’t bear fruit.
297-By seeking out things that do not demand more than I am willing to give.
298
299Answer: I attach to things that I perceive as good and try to remain consistent.
300
301Please tell us why you chose this answer: 
302Explanation: I've had a strong internal sense of right and wrong ever since I was a little kid, which has maintained more-or-less the same form this whole time, and I'm unable to go against it without a great deal of self-recrimination. This sense of what's right applies only to myself - I'm much more lenient when it comes to others. However, I've occasionally gone against it on purpose to experience, observe, and analyze my own mental and emotional reaction to doing something I consider wrong.
303
304yea this is also 4, along with the one above it lmfao
305the first sign of 4 i found was like
306I don't relate to Fraud, and in fact I despise lying and highly value honesty. This can make me offputting to others, but it's also offputting to me when I discover others have been false to me. My dedication to honesty is a shortcoming in that I feel fully bound to abide by honor systems and sets of rules unless I can justify breaking them, and typically cannot lie even when it would be to my benefit (excepting when it's a joke).
307this^
308because lol 4s are more 1ish than 1s ngl
309what i mean by that is like hm
310LOL idk how to say this any other way but don't take offense it's not supposed to be offensive
311but i feel like 4s look like tryhard 1s
312:smile:
313which tbh, makes sense why microburst is a 4 now that i think about it :Think:
314l'appel du vide02/23/2019
315that's pretty interesting tbh, i think that's why a lot of people were seeing so much 1
316Evo02/23/2019
317but i think it's funny how much more moral 4s are hahaha
318than 1s
319especially 1w9s
320bye02/23/2019
321Face reveal
322Evo02/23/2019
323yea is this you Heron lmfao
324i caught on at about like number 9
325hahaha
326Dark Green02/23/2019
327They have the same tag as heron
328bye02/23/2019
329I guessed from the q too :joy:
330And then deleted the messages with my guessing
331Evo02/23/2019
332number 9 for some reason :smile:
333bye02/23/2019
334Lmfao
335Evo02/23/2019
336: I chose this answer because I had to choose SOMETHING, and with the anger issues I had growing up, and the fact that I can still react in anger rapidly, it seems the closest (though I was never quick to move on, and don't really enjoy confrontation).
337this part
338i think the capital letters made me think Heron?? :Confused_Dog:
339l'appel du vide02/23/2019
340:uwu:
341Evo02/23/2019
342i honestly wouldn't have known otherwise though
343except the end
344for music and coding haha
345but also yea i think that 4s are very much like much more moral than 1s
346and i almost think
347it's because....
348they're more in tune? with their feelings?
349than a 1 ever will be lmao
350and because they identify with their emotions, much more than 1s ever will
351they sort of navigate the world by them
352so their emotional reactions to an immoral situation lol often looks like they're trying too hard to be a 1 or to be moral
353that's what i meant before haha
354but it's also interesting because they probably feel growth towards 1
355so they may in fact be trying to envelop their idealized self by being more like a 1
356lmao
357l'appel du vide02/23/2019
358makes sense, considering i lied once on a paper in 4th grade and felt so much guilt/shame/remorse when it was displayed at the parent-student day that i didn't lie again at ALL for over a decade
359because i could remember vividly how awful that was years later
360Evo02/23/2019
361oof
362yea
363i don't like to lie either
364but i had this one phase as a kid LOL
365where i would just LIE ABOUT EVERYTHING
366i was like 5 or 6 and i was just like "i'm gonna do whatever the fuck i want" LOL
367
368my mom: "who drank out of them milk carton????" 
369me: "not me>.>"
370next time it happened though i was dumb lol
371and i was playing with her lipstick LMFAO
372and left a mark
373on the carton :sadness:
374then i lied about having glass in my foot so i didn't have to go swimming but wouldn't let anyone look at my foot
375after that though i decided i didn't like that kind of life lmao
376being in trouble felt awful :smile:
377actually that makes me wonder
378about the difference in motivation between 1 and 4
379
380
381l'appel du vide02/23/2019
382:waves:
383l'appel du vide02/23/2019
384back, and back to myself again
385anyway, for that question - i knew because that was my ex, who told me because she got terrified that i couldn't tell lmao
386and that was less holding in anger and more not noticing whether i felt any?
387but that's a HIGHLY irregular situation
388which, coming to that - the way i've dealt with anger has actually changed enormously over the course of my life
389so the answers to those questions in the q are a great snapshot of me a few months ago, but a terrible image of the whole
390the problem with that is that my memories are biased and incomplete
391i'm also currently amused by you saying i seem more like 6 fix for head and
392from vc and chat on here, i could even see 8 fix, ngl
393because of the conversation a while back where i was talking about how i hate sitting with my back to people/doors/open areas and you said that sounded like 8 or 6 lmao
394l'appel du vide02/23/2019
395@Mikhail zmivh 
396 how do you feel about having to endure the pain?
397
398finally getting to this, sorry for the wait but i wanted evo to see before i revealed myself :smile:
399it's like, i've been in pain/physical distress in some form or another an alarming quantity of the time since i was 2 years old? :shruggie: so i know most forms are unlikely to kill me, i know i can deal with it for a really long time, and i think that was also the period of time where my doctor's office had a PA that i had a strong bond of mutual hatred with but the receptionists kept scheduling me with him for some fucking reason so i was like fine i won't go to the doctor if i can't get someone decent
400though tbh when i'm in a lot of pain i tend to end up like, lol, pretending i'm a character in a story where this is a tradeoff for something good
401Evo02/23/2019
402:thinking:
403:HyperThonkSpin:
404:hyperultramegathonk:
405Idk mang
406I could see either fix but
407Defo think there's compliant influence too
408l'appel du vide02/23/2019
409nods
410Evo02/23/2019
411I think the vigilance has more 8 to it
412Because expansive outlook
413l'appel du vide02/23/2019
414?
415Evo02/23/2019
416But i guess it could always be 6, idk
417l'appel du vide02/23/2019
418i'm wondering what you mean by it having expansive outlook to it
419Evo02/23/2019
420idk just like in general
421being um
422in control or like
423idk not control but
424being not erasing themselves i guess
425(side note did you want me to change the name of the channel to Type Heron?)
426(we usually do that)
427l'appel du vide02/23/2019
428(please lmao)
429Evo02/23/2019
430(kk)
431l'appel du vide02/23/2019
432(i think that'd be helpful at this point since i've revealed myself)
433Evo02/23/2019
434(it usually is :smile: )
435anyways yea
436not that you usually have an expansive vibe
437or whatever
438just saying
439the restaurant thing
440and like another example i'd give is something like how spacey says she wont fall asleep in like public places
441it's like an emphasis on "I'm here motherfucker" lmao
442as opposed to "don't mind me"
443lol
444it's like just an example of how that outlook can manifest
445l'appel du vide02/23/2019
446LMAO you know i'm kind of wondering if, after i transferred schools before, that's what the students (and some professors) picked up on that made me seem "intimidating" before they got to know me
447Evo02/23/2019
448doesn't mean everyone that's expansive sits in the chair at the table where they can see everyone walk through the door, but...
449there's definitely a likelihood that those types of behaviors and outlooks are from similar places
450also on vc
451you dont' seem super uhhh
452uhhhhhhh
453conflict avoidant?
454you actually seem the opposite haha
455not that you come off like you love it
456but that you're not bothered by it at all
457l'appel du vide02/23/2019
458i think i like, feel more conflict avoidant when i'm at home
459?
460Evo02/23/2019
461:thinking:
462mmm i see yea
463l'appel du vide02/23/2019
464i had move back in with my parents 2 years ago and my dad's like unpredictable af as for what he'll get offended/set off by
465Evo02/23/2019
466but for example i have felt quite a bit of "tension" sometimes when we're all in vc
467and if something bothers you
468you don't seem to mind it though
469l'appel du vide02/23/2019
470:open_mouth:
471Evo02/23/2019
472other than how it has affected your feelings
473ofc that's different though
474l'appel du vide02/23/2019
475oh like that one time i left for like 20 mins
476?
477Evo02/23/2019
478:thinking:
479yea sort of
480like me personally i feel an intense amount of tension sometimes LOL
481l'appel du vide02/23/2019
482weird.... i haven't noticed it
483Evo02/23/2019
484yes that's what i mean hahaha
485i'll try to think of an example :thinking:
486i don't know if the one you're speaking of is exactly what i mean
487it was sort of....
488the build up? to that
489not IT
490because something had been said previously to that, and even maybe previously to the previous thing lol
491and i felt like your recognition of it
492was more like
493"situational" and in the moment
494i can't think of the other time because i suck at remembering details :|
495l'appel du vide02/23/2019
496i can't help either :x
497i don't think i noticed
498not consciously, at least
499Evo02/23/2019
500yea it just made me think possibly 8 fixed
501how is it that you hold back at home?
502l'appel du vide02/23/2019
503it's like.....
504i've always been really angry at home? because (bad parental relationships)
505i've reached a point where i can deal with most of it by myself, or shut my reactions down in an argument when i have the sudden realization that being angry is just going to make things worse and accomplish nothing
506but like........ 13? years ago
507i'd probably legit like, throw a chair while yelling if i was mad lmao
508it was awful
509now the worst that usually happens is that i'll be annoyed and snap at someone
510but it's taken literally like 15 years of intentional inner work to get to that point
511when i was really little i'd have rage blackouts and like, wreck everything on my dresser and then not know who did it
512Evo02/23/2019
513yea i mean i'm gonna say lol that 8 fix is not out of the picture lmao
514l'appel du vide02/23/2019
515cause yeah i know i said i shut it down fast now but like
516Evo02/23/2019
517because it seems like you have an impulse to express it
518l'appel du vide02/23/2019
519that's because i know what it can become and i know it doesn't serve me well
520Evo02/23/2019
521but you've learned over time to try to control it?
522l'appel du vide02/23/2019
523yeah
524
525l'appel du vide02/23/2019
526shit that's why things are so much harder at home
527Evo02/23/2019
528and with that
529it seems like your anger "expresses" that outlook for you
530like
531at least with the emotion anger
532l'appel du vide02/23/2019
533because the entire emotional state of "home" is geared towards accommodating my dad's whims
534Evo02/23/2019
535with other emotions it may be way different
536yea LOL
537that sounds like lol
538completely opposite environment for you to be fostered in then
539although there's a time and place for everything
540it's probably not always 100% the best solution
541to like
542actively put a stake in the ground and yell  "i'm here bitch, now what?"
543LOL
544l'appel du vide02/23/2019
545yeah like he'll say his opinion, i'll disagree, he'll get upset i disagreed with him and be like "why did you have to say that, can't you just go along like your mom", and i'm like
546if you can say what you think why the actual fuck can't i
547Evo02/23/2019
548just like how it's not always good for someone to comply :neutral_face:
549yea
550well i mean he probably doesn't recognize that he's inviting it
551lol who knows
552l'appel du vide02/23/2019
553i don't think he does, he's outright stated he doesn't like introspecting and actively avoids it so
554¯\_(ツ)_/¯
555Evo02/23/2019
556yea :/
557rip af lol
558for fear do you feel you do something different?
559l'appel du vide02/23/2019
560lol i'm wondering two things now
5611) if the 4-8 combination is why i wound up identifying with the idealized image of knights from arthurian legend
5622) if that's why you saw 2 in me once, due to the lines
563and for fear uh.......
564i need to collect my thoughts before i can give something coherent there
565Evo02/23/2019
566well i think you probably have some compliant influence
567my guess was 6fix because of that
568but i don't know
569could just be Fi
570l'appel du vide02/23/2019
571can i ask why? i'm curious
572Evo02/23/2019
573¯\_(ツ)_/¯
574hmmmm
575just that like
576well like i was describing expansive outlook
577compliant outlook is completely opposite
578where instead of being like "this is me, all of me, and i'm not just going to make room for you"
579compliant types self erase quite a bit
580in order to compliment, complete, subordinate, comply, get along, get closer, have smoother interactions, etc
581l'appel du vide02/23/2019
582:thinking: yeah, i "make room" for people sometimes
583really depends on situation
584Evo02/23/2019
585yea you mentioned that in the q too
586that's really the only reason though
587that you come of compliant type in say...chat
588because you do seem to give people a lot of leeway
589but like i said that could just be an Fi thing
590not sure
591l'appel du vide02/23/2019
592i find using the word subordinate interesting, too
593because something i've found - which i think i've mentioned elsewhere - is that i work best under someone
594but specifically, directly under
595Evo02/23/2019
596how come
597l'appel du vide02/23/2019
598as in, the only one entrusted with important tasks that no one else can be trusted with
599...
600yeah i said i was gonna think about fear so
601let me just add that to it and
602give me a bit
603Evo02/23/2019
604okie
605l'appel du vide02/23/2019
606okay so answering fear first - since getting meds which took care of a lot of the general anxiety, i.... basically don't experience a lot of fear. i'm not convinced the amount i experienced before is really representative of "me", either. 
607the primary forms i still experience are:
6081) occasional social anxiety (lessened, manifests mostly as taking a while to warm up to new people)
6092) occasionally getting really freaked out by the thought that creaking house = monster in the walls/thinking i saw movement out of the corner of my eye = someone's there and they're avoiding me oh god/feeling like someone's behind me, can't help but check, there's no one = must be a scary ghost/itchy ear = oh god a bug is in there (i can trace this one back to an episode of House, and i am very prone to ear infections, so :\ ). - like, this is basically transient semi-delusional anxious thoughts
6103) i'd put ocd symptoms in here but they're a cross between anxiety and disgust tbh. but they get way worse under stress
6114) uh, expecting people to treat me as terribly as i was treated by my parents during my teens a decade + later? including my parents, who no longer act like that (99% of the time). i'm only not dx'd with ptsd on a technicality, though
6125) oh yeah because i got this real bad before my endoscopy - going into things without a really good idea of what to expect and what they entail and what the risks are
613i'm not 100% sure that's comprehensive, but it should give a decent overview
614also i'm looking at my 5 categories vs "don't experience a lot of fear" and kind of laughing at myself
615because i can't tell if that's just comparative
616l'appel du vide02/23/2019
617so - subordinate. in my case, this means the person who's able to calm the leader down, and the person who's able to point out when others' ideas are stupid without repercussions. the person who's most trusted by the leader to have valuable input. i specifically mean the second-in-command position, whether it's an official or emotional position. 
618
619why is. fuck this is hard to talk about in a publically viewed channel. but. sometimes i like losing myself in others' goals and desires. the others have to be carefully selected, of course. alignment of goals and dreams. something i can admire. maybe even that elusive, incandescent presence i've never been quite able to put my finger on, that i think you once described as sx chemistry. 
620
621the point is that i can lose myself in the intentions of someone else, given the right feelings/relationship/connection. and it feels good to do so, even when it means i forget myself.
622anyway that's both those questions responded to, barring further questions (which may well arise)
623l'appel du vide02/23/2019
624reading back up and, evo, am i the cause of the vc tension :sob:
625izz02/23/2019
626damn ya'll got deep here
627l'appel du vide02/23/2019
628but that will hopefully mean a better typing :smile:
629though tbh
630@izz evo talking about me in vc causing tension reminded me of how you said something similar about how i communicated when i first joined
631izz02/23/2019
632oh?
633l'appel du vide02/23/2019
634though if you don't want to go back into that/don't recall that's okay :sweat_smile:
635i don't recall the particulars myself
636izz02/23/2019
637no i do remember
638
639l'appel du vide02/23/2019
640yeah i'm not like, entirely sure it's relevant to this
641but if you think it might be useful that's fine (if not then that's also fine)
642izz02/23/2019
643no i can see how it's connected
644i had not thought of that before
645l'appel du vide02/23/2019
646nods
647i guess i kind of figure, like, if i'm embarrassing myself anyway why not go the full amount :sweat_smile:
648izz02/23/2019
649well i dont know that you're embarassing yourself
650l'appel du vide02/23/2019
651eh i mean like, with the response about subordination i gave
652anyway, how embarrassed i am about any part of this process is irrelevant
653the important part is getting an accurate type
654Evo02/23/2019
655:thinking:
656izz02/23/2019
657i'm confused, i dont see any of what you said as something embarassing
658Evo02/23/2019
659Ok i still think 6 lol
660As a fix
661izz02/23/2019
662maybe i missed something though
663Evo02/23/2019
664Because of all that you listed
665l'appel du vide02/23/2019
666yeah it's just my own internal processing, i may not have communicated it well
667don't worry too much about it
668and yeah that seems fair
669Evo02/23/2019
670I once read something about like lol "if you hear a noise in the house at night and think a worst case scenario or it's someone coming for you, you're probably a 6" lol
671l'appel du vide02/23/2019
672LMAO
673me
674Evo02/23/2019
675And i get that all the time, it's the reason i used to type as 6 core
676l'appel du vide02/23/2019
677can't leave the bathroom door open while brushing my teeth or else a demon is gonna eat me
678Evo02/23/2019
679Lmao
680Yea :thinking:
681izz02/23/2019
682what is 6 core issue
683Evo02/23/2019
684That doesn't sound very uh...like
685Competency with regards to fear
686I could see either wing for the 6fix though
687l'appel du vide02/23/2019
688like i said, i've struggled identifying my head and gut fixes :stuck_out_tongue:
689heart i am 99% confident in
690Evo02/23/2019
691Yea i mean
692If youre triple reactive then I'd say defo wing 5 lol
693l'appel du vide02/23/2019
694i think at some point in the past i rejected the possibility of being triple reactive lol
695yeah i'd guess 6w5 over 6w7
696though i wonder what the 8w? is
697Evo02/23/2019
698Although triple reactive doesn't seem like you unless in vc, because then the 8 seems more apparent
699You don't seem to have much 9 imo
700But that doesn't mean it's not w9
701l'appel du vide02/23/2019
702yeah like
703idk
704Evo02/23/2019
705I think a bigger difference between w7 and w9 is like
706l'appel du vide02/23/2019
707when i'm with friends/so's, i get really chill, i've been told the reason i get on with my friend's cats that hate everyone else is bc i'm really chill and don't move fast or talk loud
708but discovering that side of me was a surprise
709izz02/23/2019
710you are different in text via voice but i assumed that was comfort level
711Evo02/23/2019
712w7 is slightly more outward and expressive 
713Like if they make fun of someone they really make an ass of them
714Vs w9 who might enjoy that but they're more like when it's called for
715The stimulation seeking is more apparent too
716Muuuuch more apparent
717Holy fuck
718izz02/23/2019
719like i assumed you were kind of uncomfy on voice or maybe had difficulties with the format of a lot of people talking without any sort of indication of whose 'turn' it is to talk
720Evo02/23/2019
721My one friend was 8w7
722She was so fucking stimulation seeking
723l'appel du vide02/23/2019
724lol i feel like
725Evo02/23/2019
726I was exhausted by it
727l'appel du vide02/23/2019
728izz and evo have gotten totally different impressions of vchat heron
729izz02/23/2019
730gib stimulation
731haha well i'd defer to evo, my impressions often involve my tendency to make up stories in my head about people
732l'appel du vide02/23/2019
733though tbf vchat heron varies wildly depending on how overloaded i feel otherwise
734Dark Green02/23/2019
735i will always see heron through the Lens of Yusuke +  Futaba :blobblush:
736Evo02/23/2019
737We'd go out to the to the club, til 4am...and afterwards she'd be like "what's next :D"
738izz02/23/2019
739lmao omg that's me
740l'appel du vide02/23/2019
741@Dark Green that is fair tbh
742see i'm like
743Dark Green02/23/2019
744funny enough both respectively are 4s and 5s
745Evo02/23/2019
746Which is fine and all lmao but I'm sorry i dont want to do molly with you and I'm probably gonna pass out if we haveva conversation longer than an hour LOL
747l'appel du vide02/23/2019
748sometimes we're out until 4 and i'm like CREPES
749sometimes we're out until 4 and i'm like, home :frowning:
750izz02/23/2019
751stimulation makes me want more stimulation tbh. lack of stimulation makes me tired
752anyway back to heron, izz stop talking about yourself
753l'appel du vide02/23/2019
754stimulation generally just
755makes me tired
756the question is
757how fast
758@Dark Green true
759izz02/23/2019
760i interpreted your reactions in vchat to be comfort based. is there any truth in that or was that me making up stories again
761Evo02/23/2019
762Yea the 8w7 was energized af when stimulated
763But even when not stimulated...if u mention anything...she'd delve right into planning it
764l'appel du vide02/23/2019
765on the yusuke front i've literally experienced so much emotion i've collapsed to the floor like he did that one time lmfao
766Evo02/23/2019
767It was utterly exhausting
768Dark Green02/23/2019
769that's a lot of emotions
770l'appel du vide02/23/2019
771yeah idr the circumstance
772i just remember i couldn't deal with it and my knees buckled and yeah
773Evo02/23/2019
774like i assumed you were kind of uncomfy on voice or maybe had difficulties with the format of a lot of people talking without any sort of indication of whose 'turn' it is to talk
775Hm
776I got more of the impression that they were just like hm...
777Wete looking for a specific thing
778Or something
779l'appel du vide02/23/2019
780slowly catching up to ppl other than spicy ... @izz what do you mean comfort-based
781izz02/23/2019
782like you seem more comfortable in text chat in voice. in text chat convos with you just tend to flow
783Dark Green02/23/2019
784wdym heron
785izz02/23/2019
786but on voice they feel more..... choppy? like more friction or something.
787l'appel du vide02/23/2019
788@Evo a specific thing?
789@Dark Green there are too many potential contexts now, please specify
790@izz interesting...... i've experienced both text and vchat both ways, at different times
791in this server, even
792izz02/23/2019
793yeah like i said i'm probably totally wrong
794Dark Green02/23/2019
795o nvm
796l'appel du vide02/23/2019
797@Dark Green np
798Evo02/23/2019
799Nah lol  @izz thats what i meant
800l'appel du vide02/23/2019
801yeah in another server, just tonight, i suggested the buzzsaws in hollow knight were "buzz"saws because they were made from bees latched face-first to the wheel and the saw part was their stingers
802which is 1) horrifying 2) not unimaginable for hollow knight 3) hilarious
803Evo02/23/2019
804I don't think YOU'RE the cause though Heron lmao 
805I think just the fact that we have so many different personalities in one vc, tension of s bound to happen :sweat_smile:
806l'appel du vide02/23/2019
807oh yeah that makes sense
808izz02/23/2019
809yeah text chat has a way of smoothing things out
810l'appel du vide02/23/2019
811maybe more that i'm prone to noticing the like
812idk
813differences between personalities in vchat
814Evo02/23/2019
815But the reason as to why i brought it up...is
816The tension itself
817Dark Green02/23/2019
818369 go with the flow gang
819Evo02/23/2019
820Doesn't seem to bother u
821It very much has an impact on me lol
822As a comparison
823l'appel du vide02/23/2019
824yeah like i think
825i haven't noticed it so far
826mostly
827so probably, i don't notice until it's immediately affecting me
828Evo02/24/2019
829Yea like the other night i don't even think there was even that much tension, if any
830Like with u me leon and cyka
831But i had to go
832izz02/24/2019
833im not bothered by tension in vchat, except when it's quiet and then i feel very uncomfy
834l'appel du vide02/24/2019
835that was such a good night
836
837Evo02/24/2019
838Because i got super drained
839izz02/24/2019
840which i realize now i shouldnt reveal cause ya'll will fuck with me on vchat
841Evo02/24/2019
842Yes very good convo, for sure
843Lmao izz
844l'appel du vide02/24/2019
845is even more silent on vchat :no_mouth:
846i'm kidding
847Evo02/24/2019
848:sweat_smile:
849l'appel du vide02/24/2019
850if i'm on vchat i wanna talk at least a little
851Evo02/24/2019
852But yea i think that this
853so probably, i don't notice until it's immediately affecting me
854
855Is what i meant by 8 fix
856izz02/24/2019
857there's a girl on another server who will just like, randomly talk about really bad shit
858like rape or something
859Evo02/24/2019
860How they can be "situational"
861izz02/24/2019
862and talk about tension
863l'appel du vide02/24/2019
864oof
865izz02/24/2019
866im like
867dude
868Dark Green02/24/2019
869i'll immediately stop talking mid sentences when izz joins
870l'appel du vide02/24/2019
871yeah i def do not do that
872izz02/24/2019
873lol
874TatsumakiBOT02/24/2019
875:up:  |  izz leveled up!
876
877l'appel du vide02/24/2019
878spicy why
879Evo02/24/2019
880Like until the conflict that involves them presents itself, it's not really a big deal to them
881l'appel du vide02/24/2019
882keep talking
883Dark Green02/24/2019
884congrats izz you leveled up
885izz02/24/2019
886wow i leveled up
887maybe i can finally beat the game
888anyway i dont know this girl's type but if i join vc there and she's actively talking i will usually disconnect because her talking style is so cringe i just cant
889Dark Green02/24/2019
890there was a girl like that exactly in my highschool
891Evo02/24/2019
892Oh lol spicy is just joking, he meant to provoke izz by making vc go silent lmao
893l'appel du vide02/24/2019
894yeah like i think that's a lot of why i have problems at home, tbh......
895Evo02/24/2019
896Yea i could see that
897Sounds like you just want to get it all out
898izz02/24/2019
899she always apologizes after as if she didn't mean to do it like bitch you knew what you were doing
900l'appel du vide02/24/2019
901it's like, a learned helplessness thing at this point
902Evo02/24/2019
903For me it's the exact opposite LOL 
904Getting it all out is very stressful for me :sweat_smile:
905l'appel du vide02/24/2019
906you want to say what the problem is! but lol if you say it you'll be cast into oblivion
907izz02/24/2019
908wait what problem i got lost
909type me over here on a personal tangent
910l'appel du vide02/24/2019
911any problem that arises, basically
912rather than a specific one
913Evo02/24/2019
914Hypothetical problem
915l'appel du vide02/24/2019
916^
917izz02/24/2019
918oh
919so you cant say what a problem is?
920Evo02/24/2019
921With herons living situation
922izz02/24/2019
923ohhh
924l'appel du vide02/24/2019
925not at home and like, like i said, learned helplessness has caused me to extrapolate that
926Evo02/24/2019
927Yea they can't get it out
928l'appel du vide02/24/2019
929and i know that's the issue
930izz02/24/2019
931hmm. yeah i could see how that could happen
932l'appel du vide02/24/2019
933it's getting around it that's horrible
934izz02/24/2019
935you seem like you are pretty able to speak up though
936Evo02/24/2019
937For me it's like i feel very stressed when i have to "get things out"
938izz02/24/2019
939but maybe that's just cause it's here
940l'appel du vide02/24/2019
941here? hell yeah
942home? bad roommates?
943no
944Evo02/24/2019
945Yea :|
946l'appel du vide02/24/2019
947because i expect things to turn awful
948Evo02/24/2019
949Yea that seems like 6 :thinking:
950Like worst case senario'ing
951l'appel du vide02/24/2019
952like tbh
953izz02/24/2019
954ah. i think i'm like that with my emotions. no space for them at childhood home etc etc. but when i identify something is wrong in a situation, i will voice it, get other people on board, have a full on brainstorming session complete with powerpoint
955l'appel du vide02/24/2019
956the reason i've rejected 6 so much is bc
957izz02/24/2019
958we. will fix this shit!
959l'appel du vide02/24/2019
960i don't do the worst case thing in most situations
961but also
962(see earlier post on anxiety)
963Evo02/24/2019
964Yea it might mean it's last fix for you though
965izz02/24/2019
966hence me today at this longass meeting going 'i am only going for a small part' turning to i am here all goddamn day and going up to the mic to voice things
967Dark Green02/24/2019
9686 fix last gang
969Evo02/24/2019
970Lots of people don't type as 6 fix because they don't feel fear a ton
971izz02/24/2019
972i feel like the middle types are the most elusive
973l'appel du vide02/24/2019
974@Dark Green though, to support your p5 typing schemata, i'm still 4w5
975izz02/24/2019
976is that the right word? what even are words
977Evo02/24/2019
978But it's what u DO in the moment when you do feel fear
979Dark Green02/24/2019
980relating to the Persona cast is now an accurate way to type ennea
981l'appel du vide02/24/2019
982yeah like
983Evo02/24/2019
984Yea they can be izz
985izz02/24/2019
986like 9s dont know they feel anger, 3s dont know they are egomaniacs, 6s dont know they're scaredycats
987Evo02/24/2019
988Lol
989l'appel du vide02/24/2019
990my mom has issues with me going out to bars/events/concerts/whatever at night
991cause she thinks i'm gonna get mugged/raped/etc
992Dark Green02/24/2019
993@izz then you have me who is 369 tritype :hyperjoy:
994izz02/24/2019
995right and you come off as super smooth
996
997izz02/24/2019
998middle fixes smh
999l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1000:open_mouth:
1001Evo02/24/2019
1002:sweat_smile:
1003l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1004also like
1005Evo02/24/2019
1006That is sooo relatable lol
1007l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1008i think i gave this example to umi after she guessed this was me but
1009Dark Green02/24/2019
1010i actually really like Fear to some degree. Although mostly in like non life threatening situations ofc
1011l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1012i have 2 phobias: 1) parasites 2) bees and wasps
1013Evo02/24/2019
1014Ugh
1015l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1016i know a disgusting amount about parasitic wasps
1017Evo02/24/2019
1018They're awful
1019l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1020but enough to know they only care about caterpillars
1021Evo02/24/2019
1022Ew
1023Lol nice
1024izz02/24/2019
1025i like my women like i like my fear: irrational and kind of shameful
1026l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1027aww, izz likes me :uwu:
1028izz02/24/2019
1029like i did my fears list recently and the only one on there that was a practical fear was a fear of being homeless
1030the rest were like... different variations of being alone/rejected/abandoned
1031i need to cultivate at least a good insect phobia, so i can relate to people's stories about that
1032Dark Green02/24/2019
1033yea i never understood insect phobia
1034if anything the insects should be scared of you
1035unless they're like venomous
1036snakes are pretty understandable as well
1037l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1038see i stepped on a bee (wasp? idk) when i was like 3, my entire leg swelled up, my mom freaked out, i almost wound up in the er
1039i'm probably severely allergic
1040Dark Green02/24/2019
1041ah
1042yes with allergies mixed in it's super understandable
1043izz02/24/2019
1044i guess i'm not super fond of snakes but its not like i'm often in a situation where there might be a bunch of snakes
1045l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1046snek :heart_eyes:
1047i want a ball python
1048izz02/24/2019
1049oh i am a bit phobic of aggressive seeming dogs, due to a childhood incident of being bit. i can get really weird about people's dogs barking
1050i dont like admitting that one because everyone loves dogs and i dont want to be labled a dog hater
1051l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1052yeah loud/large/aggressive-seeming dogs freak me out though
1053i love dogs but like
1054can they be like
1055Dark Green02/24/2019
1056hm yea maybe extremly aggro Rottweilers might put me a bit unease
1057l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1058smaller than me standing up
1059izz02/24/2019
1060i can get irrationally angry at people who just let their dogs bark at you
1061and say "oh he's just saying hello"
1062Dark Green02/24/2019
1063lmao
1064izz02/24/2019
1065FUCK YOU, GET YOUR CREATURE OUT OF MY FACE
1066Dark Green02/24/2019
1067growls aggressively 
1068
1069See he's smiling at you!
1070l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1071no :frowning:
1072izz02/24/2019
1073;p;
1074*lol
1075i become the i want to speak to the manager lady real quick when some fucknut has their dog off a leash
1076YOU ARE BREAKING THE LAW GODDAMNIT THIS IS INNAPROPRIATE
1077l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1078anyway, as much as i like talking about doggies :sweat_smile:
1079izz02/24/2019
1080oh sorry
1081l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1082this is my typing channel
1083izz02/24/2019
1084did they figure out yoru type
1085did lawd typologist evo use her powers
1086l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1087we're thinking 486....... i think?
1088izz02/24/2019
1089a secret 8 hmmmmm
1090l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1091yeah we talked about the gut fix a lot earlier and like
1092i didn't think that showed up well in the q, for a lot of reasons
1093izz02/24/2019
1094nod
1095l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1096past/ present, situational, etc
1097izz02/24/2019
1098makes sense
1099so the core is 4?
1100l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1101from what i've gathered
1102yes
1103100%, or nearly
1104izz02/24/2019
1105are you going to provide a PO box so we can all send you condolences
1106:stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:
1107l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1108LMAO
1109izz02/24/2019
1110does hallmark have a card for that yet...
1111"So, I heard you're a 4..."
1112l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1113isn't it enough that i've put in 15 years of work on my failings...
1114izz02/24/2019
11154s have the roughest life
1116l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1117but if you REALLY want to
1118i'll give you my address
1119special
1120just for you
1121izz02/24/2019
1122ooooh
1123l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1124:wink:
1125izz02/24/2019
1126maybe you could be the bridge between izz and the 4
1127really make an impact in this discworld
1128l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1129can try, anyway
1130since  you've said i seem like a self aware 4
1131and etc
1132izz02/24/2019
1133yeah
1134well you seem like a self-aware person in general
1135i'd be tthe 15 years of work helps with that
1136l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1137yeah like :blobsweat~1:
1138a lot of that's gone into dealing with the anger stuff? but not all
1139izz02/24/2019
1140nod
1141l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1142but also, getting a hold on that level of anger is like
1143you just
1144can't
1145be zero aware after that
1146lmao
1147izz02/24/2019
1148yeah anger is rough
1149cause it feels kind of good!
1150or better than other feelings sometimes
1151l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1152yeah tbh like
1153there was a period of
1154izz02/24/2019
1155and it's effective.
1156l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1157i'd say 5 years? but i'm guessing
1158where i wanted to be angry
1159because it felt good, and was the most positive emotion i ever got to experience
1160i..... frankly don't remember how i got out of that trap
1161izz02/24/2019
1162yeah i can relate
1163i think for me after awhile it just became exhausting
1164and then it was this weird thing where other people were angry on my behalf
1165l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1166i've dealt with both those so far, haha...... both also exhausting
1167izz02/24/2019
1168and then i was like wait, this isn't your fight. and it's not about me anymore, it's about some weird sense of justice that you have, about my life. but YOU DID NOTHING TO STOP IT
1169so then i was angry at them lol
1170l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1171oof
1172yeah i don't think i've had that part, but like
1173it makes sense to me
1174izz02/24/2019
1175it feels so good to not be so angry
1176its like, i have so much more energy
1177l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1178.....oh, weird, it's kind of satisfying to get people to engage about their problems in my channel
1179that's
1180super
1181weird
1182the fuck
1183izz02/24/2019
1184well thats good cause i also feel bad but i cant help but relate to my own experiences when people talk about theirs
1185Scirrus02/24/2019
1186qt
1187izz02/24/2019
1188so i'm sorry. and you're welcome.
1189l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1190it's no problem at all, and i mean that
1191i think the only reason i'm rejecting it is due to a hollow self-image of being incapable of empathy or caring
1192which like
1193izz02/24/2019
1194wait what
1195l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1196i know that comes from emotional training, and not reality
1197izz02/24/2019
1198how are you at all incapable of empathy or caring
1199l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1200like i said
1201it's
1202an internal image
1203based on what i've been told
1204izz02/24/2019
1205well
1206i'd like a word with this person
1207pls can i speak to the manager
1208l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1209ok
1210izz02/24/2019
1211yes i can hold
1212l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1213/dials up izz with my mom and dad but like 20 years ago
1214izz02/24/2019
1215hello sir and ma'am my name is izz and that's all the credentials i need. your offspring is both capable and quite skiled at both empathy and caring, and for you to say otherwise is, well, frankly, if you'll excuse the phrase, fucking dumb. perhaps it is you that lacks the skills of empathy and caring, and maybe should take a class at the local school for adults who project their shit onto their children on how to stop coming to fucked up conclusions about other people and then labeling them with bullshit. just so you know, this call is being recorded both for quality assurance, and for the lulz. good day.
1216l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1217i think the part that really got me was
1218just so you know, this call is being recorded both for quality assurance, and for the lulz.
1219and thank you :smile:
1220izz02/24/2019
1221hahaha
1222on a serious note i'm sorry that they infected you with that false belief. that's horrible.
1223
1224l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1225thinking of myself as human subjects me to human morals
1226izz02/24/2019
1227it seems t hey have a fixed idea of you, which is pretty common in dysfunctional family systems, unfortunately
1228l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1229so it's more painful than being like, fine, i'm not even human, fuck it
1230yeah like
1231i think they decided how to think of me a long time ago
1232izz02/24/2019
1233yeah i can  see how that would happen. i lowkey relate re: my "I'm trash" line
1234yeah. and it ultimately benefits them, in a sick way
1235it's much more difficult for a parent to say 'my kid is facing challenge xyz and it's up to me to help them through it' than it is to say 'my kid is not capable of xyz and there's nothign to be done about it'
1236l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1237yeah and like...... my thing with feeling like i don't deserve to be called human? originated with them
1238with my mom reversing my name, calling me a demon, and screaming at me to give back her child
1239because.... the earliest time i recall, i think i'd broken my brother's toy
1240i was like 6
1241izz02/24/2019
1242right, instead of saying oh my child is hurting and acting out, and i need to help them figure this out, she just labled you, and then she got to be the victim!
1243'woe is me i have this devil child'
1244l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1245yeah
1246i was always given the like
1247black sheep/scapegoat role?
1248izz02/24/2019
1249yup
1250my mom's thing with me was liar. she always called me a liar. i lied when i was little, so instead of helping me learn how to tell the truth, it was just IZZ IS A LIAR. POOR ME MY CHILD IS A LIAR
1251l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1252yeah my parents' thing with me like
1253when i was really small it was "demon"
1254when i got a bit older, "evil"
1255when i got a bit older than that, "crazy"
1256but it's like
1257how much of that could've been avoided from the start if like
1258you hadn't tried to convince me i was a monster and not human
1259when i was 6
1260izz02/24/2019
1261right of course!
1262it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy
1263l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1264yeah
1265izz02/24/2019
1266but it's all bullshit
1267l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1268and like, that started when i was 6
1269when i was 7 is like
1270izz02/24/2019
1271you werent evil as a kid. it was all based on bullshit. it was completely their lack of ability to deal with the situation. im sure you see that now as an adult
1272l'appel du vide02/24/2019
12731) i figured out what love meant, and realized i didn't love my parents/figured they didn't love me 
12742) my parents started trying to tell my brother he was adopted because he was "so smart", like they'd been saying to me for a couple years..... it just hurt and confused me, but i saw him in the hospital and remembered because he had been taking my place...... so i stood up to them at 7, despite still hating my brother, and was like
1275you don't get to tell him that. that's a lie. i know it.
1276and as far as i know that shocked them into never saying that to him again.
1277izz02/24/2019
1278jfc that is bizarre
1279they told him he's adopted because he's smart?
1280l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1281oh
1282they
1283izz02/24/2019
1284did they realize they were insulting themselves lol
1285l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1286started off
1287saying that to me
1288and it took me until i was 19 to figure out i WASN'T actually adopted
1289but that should like
1290show how much that fucked me up
1291izz02/24/2019
1292i mean it sounds like it mightve been the better option
1293l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1294and how much i wasn't gonna let them do that to him back then
1295izz02/24/2019
1296"maybe these assholes aren't my real parents!"
1297l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1298kinda feels like i protected him from that, still
1299even if i couldn't protect him from me
1300like
1301he was their perfect infallible kid
1302he could get away with anything
1303like i said
1304i was the scapegoat and black sheep
1305izz02/24/2019
1306yeah
1307its fucked up
1308but whattayagonnado
1309without our fucked up childhoods, what would we even talk about
1310l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1311yeah and like, considering what's already been discussed around fixes.... it was like, i've lived through this, i can withstand it, but he's like 3 years old, and i'm 7 but i know how much this has messed me up, so how dare they start doing this to him too
1312izz02/24/2019
1313ahh
1314lil heron over there having empathy and compassion from the jump
1315l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1316(i did not actually know how much it ultimately messed me up at the time, but you get the idea)
1317yeah it's like
1318weird
1319all of you pointing out my empathy and compassion as a kid as i've described things
1320when like
1321consciously, i don't recall experiencing empathy until i was 19
1322izz02/24/2019
1323honestly i dont think i'd be that empathetic at 7 i probably woulda been like lol yeah bro you adopted
1324l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1325but that was 1) towards my parents 2) i had to consciously work to reach that point
1326i mean like, lol, at some other point when i was 7 i like
1327finally realized what the term "love" meant, familially
1328and realized
13291) i didn't love my parents 2) they probably didn't love me either
1330izz02/24/2019
1331you had so much empathy and caring that you risked your own ass though
1332that's pretty remarkable for a 7 year olds
1333l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1334:grimacing:
1335izz you're fighting my self-image
1336izz02/24/2019
13377 year olds by default are pretty narcissistic
1338l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1339i appreciate it but
1340i think when i was like
13418 or 9
1342i saw my dad hitting my mom
1343and had the impulse to help
1344but knew i couldn't do anything
1345and it fucked me up
1346since when i was 7 my dad was mad at me for wanting to watch another 30 mins of tv and picked me up and threw me
1347and i landed close to the basement stairs and saw my life flash before my eyes
1348izz02/24/2019
1349i had a similar experience at 8ish and my sister made me be quiet
1350which is good cause like you, there's nothing i couldve done
1351l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1352yeah i didn't have anyone to talk reason into me
1353izz02/24/2019
1354how do you feel that manifests now in you - do you think it makes you more or less likely to speak up
1355l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1356depends highly on the situation
1357at home i'm like
135890% resentful, and generally feel like i can't say shit because like, my parents have also grown and changed but my dad's still an oversensitive baby who wants everything customized to his tastes but won't change himself for anyone
1359when i've lived alone/in apartments, and had more choices......... i think i've been more likely to speak up, though
1360izz02/24/2019
1361interesting
1362Fjord02/24/2019
1363Heroin
1364izz02/24/2019
1365my grandmother taught me to always speak up
1366but, she's a hypocrite
1367l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1368dolohov, do i know you
1369izz02/24/2019
1370cause she didnt do shit
1371nobody did
1372Fjord02/24/2019
1373now you do
1374izz02/24/2019
1375they just pretended like they didnt know, or just demonized my mother
1376l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1377yeah like
1378i didn't learn that from anyone, but
1379my dad was disowned from his family for not just going along with their  honestly fucked up takes on things
1380Fjord02/24/2019
1381Sorry to interrupt
1382Is this channel specifically to type certain people?
1383l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1384yes :smile:
1385izz02/24/2019
1386yeah it's a typing channel for heron
1387Fjord02/24/2019
1388mbti or enneagram?
1389l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1390it got a little off course, but yeah
1391izz02/24/2019
1392their questionaiire is pinned
1393l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1394ennea
1395izz02/24/2019
1396ennea
1397Fjord02/24/2019
1398Oh okay
1399l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1400this is my personal typing channel
1401
1402l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1403i mainly remember like
1404fear and confusion and not understanding
1405feeling misunderstood, knowing i didn't get Something that everyone else got
1406i think i placed it on something social
1407izz02/24/2019
1408yeah i mean maybe you had trouble sorting things out or maybe you were just in a fucked up situation that actually didnt make sense
1409l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1410and maybe both
1411izz02/24/2019
1412for me SO MUCH of the work i've done has involved realizing that it was the situation that was crazy, not me
1413l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1414bc like
1415even to this day i get the "yeah you're not normal but i don't quite know why"
1416izz02/24/2019
1417i dont think an adult would fare well in that situation, much less a child
1418l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1419from therapists/psychiatrists
1420izz02/24/2019
1421of course you're not normal. who would be normal after all that
1422l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1423lol i've been diagnosed with so much shit and like
1424the next person i see always overturns it and is like no it's this!
1425no it's this!
1426etc
1427izz02/24/2019
1428uggh, relate
1429i stubbornly refuse all diagnosis now. it's trauma. it's all trauma (and maybe adhd, but that's different)
1430l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1431i was dx'd with schizoid personality in my early 20s due to how much i refused to show/talk/express/etc
1432i'd respond monosyllabically, show no expression
1433but it was all from fear
1434izz02/24/2019
1435right
1436i think the impact of childhood trauma is vastly underappreciated
1437l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1438honestly i think my current therapist's take of reactive attachment is the best anyone has ever done
1439since there's anecdotal evidence for things being shit before i can remember
1440though otherwise she'd have gone for ptsd and it's like, well
1441i get flashbacks sometimes, from what i understand of them....
1442izz02/24/2019
1443right that makes sense
1444i mean all these things are just different manifestations of ptsd
1445l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1446basically
1447izz02/24/2019
1448attachment issues - ptsd with relationship issues; bpd - ptsd with self harm and impulsivity; ptsd can even look like adhd
1449l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1450lol i mean, if you phrase it that way, i could look bpd
1451though i've been dx'd with 3 personality disorders total over the years, so, you know
1452izz02/24/2019
1453like basically trauma in childhood fucks us up in so many ways and then we adapt behaviors to survive and then those behaviors are what is later diagnosed as somethingorother when they no longer serve us
1454l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1455yeah like
1456izz02/24/2019
1457at least that is my completely unqualified take
1458l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1459i don't think the current schema is like
1460ideal
1461man my typing channel both like
1462did and did not get off topic
1463:blobsweat~1:
1464izz02/24/2019
1465best typing channel tbh
1466exploring trauma with heron
1467l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1468lol
1469tbh though that's like
1470an undeniably huge factor for me
1471how much is type, how much is trauma
1472i need to know which is which :blobsweat~1:
1473izz02/24/2019
1474well true, though they do intertwine
1475which is why i like ennea
1476l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1477yeah like
1478that's part of why i've like, lol
1479been able to id with every part of most 4 descriptions
1480including parental orientation
1481izz02/24/2019
1482like your core type is really how you interpretted the trauma, and how it manifested
1483l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1484i feel bad for evo when she comes back and has to read all this lmao
1485izz02/24/2019
1486like when the dude on the podcasts was talking about 7 and the loss of love, i was like, oh god, stop saying these true things
1487l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1488which podcast
1489izz02/24/2019
1490you know the one where the dude wrote the songs about each type
1491l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1492o
1493yeah
1494the sleeping at last ones?
1495izz02/24/2019
1496yeah
1497l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1498i've been meaning to listen to the 4 one
1499been putting it off
1500idk exactly why
1501could come up with a lot of reasons, but idk if any of them would be true
1502though like
1503i spent a couple hours listening to the 4 one a day or two ago
1504and the more i listened to it the more i was like
1505accurate
1506healthier range, but accurate
1507i mean, i know part of the reason is that it's an hour 20 minutes long
1508and i have trouble following podcasts that long
1509part of the reason is that i've been listening to his song Neptune so much instead
1510but like
1511i think i'm also... afraid? somehow
1512idk
1513izz02/24/2019
1514it can be hard
1515i mean the shit is deep!
1516l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1517yeah it's like
1518izz02/24/2019
1519i didnt resist listening to the 7 one cause i naively thought there wouldnt be anything that would bother me about it lol
1520l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1521it's going to 1) affect me deeply 2) piss me off 3) be a waste of time
1522Evo02/24/2019
1523Lmao izz
1524Yea
1525Well
1526l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1527hi evo
1528we talked
1529a lot
1530so much
1531i am sorry
1532izz02/24/2019
1533its my fault, people can't resist talking to me
1534:sunglasses:
1535l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1536i really can't :sob:
1537Evo02/24/2019
1538Just like fyi heron, the first half of the podcast is like "what this type is like" 
1539Then he plays the song 
1540Then i usually stop listening...
1541Because then he goes on this INTRICATE EXPLANATION of why he chose the musical expressions....
1542l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1543LMFAO
1544Evo02/24/2019
1545That last part is too much for me lol
1546izz02/24/2019
1547oh yeah that part is boring
1548Evo02/24/2019
1549Like don't bother
1550Unless that really interests you
1551Like i did for the 1
1552l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1553god i'm so bad at podcasts in the first place
1554Evo02/24/2019
1555But that's literally it
1556izz02/24/2019
1557i mean i guess if i was a musician i might be interested in it? but yeah sorry dude i dont care about why you used the cello
1558l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1559..............
1560shit that
1561might
1562be interesting.................
1563i love cello...............
1564izz02/24/2019
1565i mean just put it on while you're doing something else
1566who knows
1567maybe you'll love it
1568Evo02/24/2019
1569Yea like there was one part in the 1's song, where he said he used glasses
1570
1571l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1572i'd have been more like
1573Evo02/24/2019
1574"But why wouldn't people want to be their best person they could be :puppydogeyes: "
1575Lol
1576l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1577everyone else is good, i'm irredeemably evil even though i can't understand why
1578izz02/24/2019
1579the rest of us are trash, as it turns out
1580Evo02/24/2019
1581:joy:
1582Yea i see
1583:hyperkittythink:
1584izz02/24/2019
1585ive always wanted to be good but never more than i wanted to feel good
1586Evo02/24/2019
1587Interesting
1588Hm yea lol
1589I used to be like very um...
1590Self...uh...
1591izz02/24/2019
1592were you that dude in davinci code
1593Evo02/24/2019
1594Self depricating?
1595Yes
1596izz02/24/2019
1597with the fuckin whip
1598Evo02/24/2019
1599LOL
1600Not that bad though
1601But very self depricating...
1602If i had no food for lunch in school
1603I'd just be like super stoic about it lol
1604And suppress any thought of hunger
1605izz02/24/2019
1606:open_mouth:
1607:frowning:
1608Evo02/24/2019
1609:P
1610izz02/24/2019
1611why not just be like 'yo can i get half your sammich im over here with no foods'
1612Evo02/24/2019
1613I dunno i didn't really think to do that lol
1614I wanted to embody what it meant to have will power lmao
1615And i did :P
1616Anywho
1617Makes sense, the difference
1618l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1619tbh i..... kind of like how my typing channel became "talk about your problems" channel
1620lmao
1621izz02/24/2019
1622you love it
1623goddamn 4s
1624Evo02/24/2019
1625Hehe
1626l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1627#feels-n-shit number 2
1628i do
1629izz02/24/2019
1630did you do without lunch heron
1631in this hypothetical scenerio
1632l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1633no
1634uh
1635izz02/24/2019
1636did you say nah ill just be stoic, or hey can i have half your sammich
1637where are you on that spectrum
1638l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1639hang on lemme read up for the hypotheticals
1640izz02/24/2019
1641you're at school, you have no lunch
1642WHAT DO YOU DO
1643l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1644if i was in like hs, and had no lunch, i'd just put up with it and like
1645probably process it as
1646ok, might as well go to the library and read on lunch
1647Evo02/24/2019
1648Yea that's what i did
1649I also wasn't super social though with people
1650l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1651i did that p often even when i did have a lunch, though
1652Evo02/24/2019
1653The cafeteria especially...always made me feel out of place
1654l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1655same
16561-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1657talk about problems? mood
1658spsx commiserating
1659izz02/24/2019
1660leon get in on this
16611-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1662yes
1663l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1664oh hey it's leon
16651-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1666i support
1667l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1668leooooon i'm out now
1669izz02/24/2019
1670go to library and supress hunger or ask for help
1671l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1672everyone knows i am heron
1673izz02/24/2019
1674this is a divisive issue
1675l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1676go to library and read about ebola
1677cyкa?02/24/2019
1678god i wish i could go to the library right now and read about ebola
1679izz02/24/2019
1680even like 'hey do you have an extra lunch ticket'
1681we had lunch tickets
16821-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1683??? out like
1684izz02/24/2019
1685you could buy them or if you were poor like me you got them for free
16861-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1687omg bless
1688congrats on coming out
1689Evo02/24/2019
1690Idk i feel like then I'd be responsible for putting them out lol
16911-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1692!!!
1693l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1694oh i've always been out in that sense
1695Evo02/24/2019
1696It'd be weird
1697l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1698you know what i mean
1699Evo02/24/2019
1700Even when people offered
1701I'd decline because it didn't feel right lol
1702Idk
1703l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1704we didn't have lunch tickets, at least as far as i knew
1705i think i just always
1706ate my packed lunch as fast as i could
1707so i could go to the library
1708Evo02/24/2019
1709Ah yeah my parents never gave me packed lunch lol
1710izz02/24/2019
1711i used to get corn dogs in middle school and eat all the weird shit on the hotdog and then throw the hot dog at the ceiling cause it made me laugh how it would bounce
1712this is not in any way related to typology i just think it's funny
1713Evo02/24/2019
1714Except kindergarten on one of the bus trips, because it was mandatory lmao
1715l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1716are you  sure it's unrelated bc i sure as fuck never did that
1717izz02/24/2019
1718lmao
1719cyкa?02/24/2019
1720is this 7 culture because i either had food fights or like
1721izz02/24/2019
1722next ennea test question: did you in middle school throw hot dogs at the ceiling
1723cyкa?02/24/2019
1724we made mixed food soup
1725"soup"
1726izz02/24/2019
1727yus food fights!
1728l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1729ew
1730ew
17311-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1732i think even since kindergarten i always had a sense of being alone so mood
1733l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1734ew
1735take that shit out of my channel
1736no food fights here
1737cyкa?02/24/2019
1738sorry binch
1739l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1740or gross "soup"
1741no
1742not here
1743cyкa?02/24/2019
1744it was hilarious ngl
1745l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1746take it to general
1747izz02/24/2019
1748also lol "7 culture"
1749cyкa?02/24/2019
1750i used to throw paper wads at my friend's hair
1751l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1752i'm sorry i'm just a particular ass bitch when it comes to food
1753there's a lot i can put up with but sometimes just
1754no
1755cyкa?02/24/2019
1756is that more channel safe idk
1757izz02/24/2019
1758how do you feal about condoms full of jelly beans tho
1759l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1760well this channel sure isn't
1761i
1762that's hilarious tbh
1763cyкa?02/24/2019
1764how about condoms full of lube and perfume?
1765from my purse?
1766l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1767that's less hilarious
1768izz02/24/2019
1769condoms on the doorhandle
1770l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1771unsure
1772why am i being quizzed on my comfort with condoms
1773is this my curse for putting lust last
1774
1775izz02/24/2019
1776this is important. we need to detect for 7
1777cyкa?02/24/2019
1778found out after baggage check in an airport is it funnier now
1779my condoms got destroyed
1780l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1781that just sounds unfortunate and like, lucky they didn't get destroyed
1782cyкa?02/24/2019
1783also i had a slutty shirt on i guess some guy commented i should have kept my spaghetti straps hidden with my coat mother fukcin lmao
1784l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1785oh :frowning:
1786sorry i'm like
1787izz02/24/2019
1788are you  sure it's unrelated bc i sure as fuck never did that
1789 can we pin that pls cause it still makes me lmao
1790l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1791uncomfy with my channel being turned into horny central
1792cyкa?02/24/2019
1793sp/so confirmed
1794jk
1795l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1796:frowning:
1797cyкa?02/24/2019
1798pin it tbh
1799l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1800no
1801cyкa?02/24/2019
1802) :
1803izz02/24/2019
1804ok ok i'm sorry i will refrain from other stories of my glorious middle school years
1805cyкa?02/24/2019
1806no izz ill die
1807l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1808i mean like
1809i want to hear more
1810i'm just
1811not sure
1812my typing channel
1813is the place for it
1814izz02/24/2019
1815we can type your reactions to it tho
1816it's all related
1817cyкa?02/24/2019
1818tru af
1819l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1820and i feel like i'm mimicking bba in saying "get out", which isn't what i intend
1821but also
1822still,
1823izz02/24/2019
1824i mean you got your type im not sure what more there is to say
1825i guess i can leave lol
1826cyкa?02/24/2019
1827heron's new man cave their type me channel ok park it or leave it
1828izz02/24/2019
1829i'll do it dramatically tho
1830lmao
1831l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1832;0;
1833izz02/24/2019
1834where is the door so i can slam it
1835cyкa?02/24/2019
1836bye izz ilysm ty
1837l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1838sorry
1839don't leave
1840izz02/24/2019
1841bye cyka bb....i'll... never forget you...
1842hehehehehe :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:
1843cyкa?02/24/2019
1844**leon sobs
1845izz02/24/2019
1846lmao
18471-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1848KCNDBE I AM
1849izz02/24/2019
1850omg i am using that for every situation from now on
18511-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1852observing also
1853chatting with my bestie so
1854izz02/24/2019
1855anyway would you say your reaction to my tales of hot dog throwing were more a manifestion of your 6 or your 8, heron
1856l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1857i can already hear the " :stuck_out_tongue:  so what do you want"
1858cyкa?02/24/2019
1859asdfaddfsdff
18601-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1861hmm actually
1862as an soc blind
1863how do you reacting to soc
1864l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1865i think they were a reaction from my 4 because i find that sort of thing disgusting and i can't help it
1866cyкa?02/24/2019
1867theyre crippled idk
1868l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1869@1-800-BULLY-ME fuck if i know
1870izz02/24/2019
1871interesting... does it seem inauthentic to you
18721-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1873:eyes:
1874l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1875how do i recognize soc in the first place
1876cyкa?02/24/2019
1877big oof
1878izz02/24/2019
1879i can tell you it was an authentic expression of my need to see what would happen if the rubbery hotdog hit the roof
1880l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1881@izz yeah like, i think that's the thing - your authentic expression vs mine
18821-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1883@izz pls respond
1884izz02/24/2019
1885(ok it was really just to make people laugh. you got me)
1886cyкa?02/24/2019
1887is fe authentic guys
18881-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1889im only soc variant
1890ur soc god tier
1891
1892cyкa?02/24/2019
1893tbh
1894izz02/24/2019
1895what is the question about soc
1896cyкa?02/24/2019
1897@izz
1898l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1899you needed to know how it'd react
19001-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1901nah not need but curious
1902l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1903the entire question disgusted me
1904both true, but dissimilar
19051-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1906i know sxsp can kinda? mimic soc but i have yet to fully encapsulate spsxs reaction to soc
1907izz02/24/2019
1908i needed to establish myself as funny as fuck and also needed to laugh at the hot dog bouncing off the ceiling. it's a double need
1909ohh i get a lot of smh's and also a lot of 'you are using people and you are fake'
1910l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1911there is literally no point in my life i would've found that funny
1912Evo02/24/2019
1913Lol
1914izz02/24/2019
1915the using people thing really gets me twitchy because WE ARE ALL USING EACHOTHER THAT IS HOW SOCIALIZING WORKS
1916l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1917i don't think that means you're fake
1918i think it's an incompatibility
1919izz02/24/2019
1920i mean... do i think it's funny now? well ok yes. yes i still think it's funny. i am trash
1921cyкa?02/24/2019
1922i only find it funny when i read exasperation and anger from another person's facial features what type is that
1923izz02/24/2019
1924but still we cant really judge a 12-13 year old me having middle school humor
19251-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1926same izz
1927sp blinds are trash
1928izz02/24/2019
1929we really are, leon. we really are.
19301-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1931actually i ask because i know how non sp blinds react to me being sp blind
1932Evo02/24/2019
1933Yea that's like strange though for me to think of it that way
1934It's like the same as saying i "use" a flower if I'm appreciating it ...
1935Seems off
1936cyкa?02/24/2019
1937valid
19381-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1939'WHAT ARE YOU DOING WITH YOUR LIFE'
1940l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1941THAT
1942izz02/24/2019
1943hahahah
1944l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1945THANK YOU, EVO
1946cyкa?02/24/2019
1947i tell myself this but it doesnt work
1948izz02/24/2019
1949i just dont have the negative connotation for 'using'
1950like i'm using ya'll right now
1951l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1952i have
1953a lot
1954izz02/24/2019
1955consider yourselves used
1956l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1957of negative connotations for that
1958izz02/24/2019
1959feel free to use me
1960l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1961no
1962cyкa?02/24/2019
1963i guess if you dehumanize that's basically the picture most will come up with
1964l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1965bye
19661-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1967hmm
1968lemme think
1969cyкa?02/24/2019
1970like they're gifts of presence rather
1971items
1972izz02/24/2019
1973ah i guess that's true
19741-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1975because i also share a similar sentiment though im fine with being used
1976cyкa?02/24/2019
1977of temporary importance and gratification
1978ye
1979Evo02/24/2019
1980Yea i mean i intellectually understand, but it's an unrelatable way of expressing what the experience is actually like :thinking:
1981cyкa?02/24/2019
1982i was expecting that leon sjhdfjhd god
1983izz02/24/2019
1984i mean okay to be FAIR there is a negative connotation and i do acknowledge it. HOWEVER simply extracting joy/conversation/networking/social from someone i dont think is the same as like leeching off someone or using them for sex or whatever. which is what people are usualy implying
1985l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1986i get lost every time you all talk about people like they're items in any channel :O:
19871-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1988woxjw :eyes: i mean
1989izz02/24/2019
1990so i'm just like yes i am using this person, they are using me, so the fuck what
19911-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1992i also mean that way but
1993being used in the sense that you have a projection of me in my head
1994but so long as i like you, im fine with that
1995l'appel du vide02/24/2019
1996this is my channel. why am i being ignored
19971-800-BULLY-ME02/24/2019
1998cjdjcbsd soz im trying to get to my point
1999cyкa?02/24/2019
2000sensitive i see
2001izz02/24/2019
2002type yourself thinking you are being ignored
2003cyкa?02/24/2019
20044 confirmed
2005jk ily heron
2006l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2007ily 2
2008izz02/24/2019
2009someone asked me to explain how people react to my so domness and i answered.
2010all further questions will be approved first
2011Cell B02/24/2019
2012over 1000 messages in this channel
2013izz02/24/2019
2014let's get it to 2000
2015Dark Green02/24/2019
2016Slow day
2017Cell B02/24/2019
2018:blobsweat~1:
2019cyкa?02/24/2019
2020heron one popular binch
2021we all stan
2022izz02/24/2019
2023brb writing heron fanfic
2024Cell B02/24/2019
2025i had a big feeling this was your channel heron
2026ahaha
2027cyкa?02/24/2019
2028hot
2029l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2030i mean
2031i'm glad you all like me this much
2032:heart:
2033Dark Green02/24/2019
2034i'm Heron's #1 Fan
2035cyкa?02/24/2019
2036:uwu:
2037l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2038how long did you have that feeling, cell
2039izz02/24/2019
2040i'm the problematic founder of her unofficial fanclub
2041i'll make you cringe with my fanfic and fanart, and i will call you out as a FAKE FAN if you disagree with my interpretations of their work
2042cyкa?02/24/2019
2043i am so fucking hungry i could eaty a whole ass right now
2044izz02/24/2019
2045a whole ass hmm
2046Cell B02/24/2019
2047I guess the serious tone, how 4 it was and you casually flexing your past troubles
2048:joy:
2049l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2050o yeah i guess i've done all that elsewhere here huh
2051cyкa?02/24/2019
2052was it flexing?
2053l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2054what is flexing, anyway
2055izz02/24/2019
20564s always be flexin their troubles
2057Cell B02/24/2019
2058Usually I don't guess but the idea just jumped at me
2059l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2060i don't really get it
2061cyкa?02/24/2019
2062hot
2063Cell B02/24/2019
2064I'm just kidding with the word flex lmao
2065l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2066o
2067i still don't really get what it is, but ok :heart:
2068cyкa?02/24/2019
2069nws
2070izz02/24/2019
2071one thing i notice with a lot of 4s is they seem to keep trying not to match up
2072cyкa?02/24/2019
2073ly
2074Cell B02/24/2019
2075But like a difference between you and me is you like to talk about them and I don't I guess
2076izz02/24/2019
2077like 4: i have this issue
2078me: oh i relate! i also have that issue
20794: hmm, yeah but mine is more like this
2080its like they dont reaaally want to relate
2081cyкa?02/24/2019
20824s be trying to do some unapologetic thing with their shame i wish i had the nuts to that
2083l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2084oh
2085fuck
2086you caught me
2087cyкa?02/24/2019
2088reactive ganggang
2089Cell B02/24/2019
2090Yea I don't do that lol
2091izz02/24/2019
2092what they seem to want, and ofc this is just observation from the outside, is someone to go, wow, your issue is truly yours alone, why dont you sit and go through it in painstaking detail
2093but that's just the unhealthy ones
2094hashtag notall4s
2095Cell B02/24/2019
2096My 4ness manifests like who wants to hear about my troubles no one cares
2097:sweat_smile:
2098izz02/24/2019
2099i do get frustrated though, because i want to relate! to me that's the whole point of talking.
2100
2101cyкa?02/24/2019
2102no typism in this ethical server thx
2103izz02/24/2019
2104lol
2105Cell B02/24/2019
2106And even if they want me to talk about it its hard for me
2107cyкa?02/24/2019
2108i relate tbh
2109Cell B02/24/2019
2110I just think it's neat how each type varies so much within it
2111cyкa?02/24/2019
2112which
2113l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2114idk where to go from here lmao :grimacing:
2115izz02/24/2019
2116well we can try to figure out how to get you to 7
2117cyкa?02/24/2019
2118is why i keep my shame wrapped up unless through ironic joaks
2119izz02/24/2019
2120since that is everyone's goal
2121or should be
2122Cell B02/24/2019
2123Idek what you guys talked about
2124Did you settle on 145
2125l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2126no
2127not
2128at
2129all
2130haha
2131cyкa?02/24/2019
2132ohmst?
2133l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2134yeah so like
2135so far as we've figured
2136i'm probs 4w5 core
2137with an 8 fix and a 6 fix
2138cyкa?02/24/2019
2139yO
2140reactive gangang
2141l'appel du vide02/24/2019
21426 fix is more likely 6w5
2143no idea on 8 fix
2144but
21458 fix is probs second
2146so i REALLY WANT TO KNOW THAT WING
2147cyкa?02/24/2019
2148what made you settle with 8 vs 1
2149i am so curious
2150or the type me channel
2151l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2152evo and me talked about 4 vs 1
2153and like
2154Cell B02/24/2019
2155Oh crap
2156Plot twist
2157cyкa?02/24/2019
2158right??
2159l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2160how the morals of 4 can look more 1 than 1
2161because of the like
2162emotional component, and holding on to that
2163which was like
2164yeah
2165i do that
2166like, 1 but more extra, lmfao
2167which is me
2168cyкa?02/24/2019
2169like reactive idealism
2170cause
2171l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2172yeah
2173cyкa?02/24/2019
2174thats 4
2175ye
2176l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2177yeah.
2178Cell B02/24/2019
2179Oh
2180cyкa?02/24/2019
2181u so valid :heart:
2182Cell B02/24/2019
2183That explains a lot
2184:sweat_smile:
2185l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2186yeah like
2187after rereading my own q i was kind of like
2188questioning my own potential gut fix
2189because of the context i was mentally providing
2190Cell B02/24/2019
2191468 tho
2192I have a close 648 friend
2193cyкa?02/24/2019
2194EII 468 tho
2195Cell B02/24/2019
2196He is intense
2197Yea and withdrawn core
2198l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2199part of it was like
2200i sound 8 fix in vchat and text chat
2201Evo02/24/2019
2202Yea i don't think 9 fix at the very least :sweat_smile:
2203l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2204@Evo help
2205Evo02/24/2019
2206But the 8 seemed to be...hm
2207
2208You seem to want to express the anger right out the gate in the moment
2209l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2210yeah, and i can even give examples
2211Evo02/24/2019
2212But realized you have to hold back and that's stressful to hold back for you
2213l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2214yes
2215Evo02/24/2019
2216Where for me it's opposite 
2217It's extremely stressful for me to express anger
2218Like a stew...and stew..and stew lol
2219And then stew some more
2220To make sure my anger is even justified
2221l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2222oh god like
2223i know i stew a lot
2224Evo02/24/2019
2225And then make a decision based on that
2226l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2227but that amount sounds awful
2228Evo02/24/2019
2229And even then..
2230l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2231it's justified if it feels justified
2232Evo02/24/2019
2233The fear of condemnation lol
2234Haunts me
2235l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2236:frowning:
2237Evo02/24/2019
2238Even when it's 100% justified
2239Lol
2240l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2241also i think my saying
2242"it's justified if it feels justified" is in and of itself a proof
2243Evo02/24/2019
2244Alsp the vc example is that you don't seem to be bothered by tension
2245l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2246i STILL don't get what you mean by tension
2247Evo02/24/2019
2248Yea that sounds off for me...the feeling justified thing lmao
2249That's some expansive outlook shit lol
2250l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2251LMFAO
2252
2253Evo02/24/2019
2254Yea, hm
2255Well
2256I suppose maybe i could try yo come up with some examples 
2257Over time, but I'm not sure i have specifics
2258Right now
2259l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2260nods
2261i mean
2262like
2263right now
2264i think the main reasons for opposition would be if you have reasonings opposing 4/8/6
2265and i'm also curious what wings you think
2266like i get that you think 6w5
2267but what about 8
2268:kittyhypethonk~1:
2269izz02/24/2019
2270evo anger stew
2271does 1 delay in expressing anger
2272generally
2273cyкa?02/24/2019
22741 just doesn't react to anger healthily at all
2275l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2276also evo, we talked a lot, and i am so sorry
2277cyкa?02/24/2019
22788s can be reallllyyy extra but ya gotta let the shit out
2279l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2280i've tried to say i'm extra and been shut down :frowning:
2281cyкa?02/24/2019
2282more people stanning 8 and not being an edgy meme is like bringing me joy idk
2283Evo02/24/2019
2284Hm yea i mean  @l'appel du vide i think 6 because i do think compliant is in there somewhere and wing 5 because you do seem to wantbto research to prepare 
2285
2286But hm 8 i could see either...but perhaps 8w9?
2287Part of me wants to say w7 though lmao
2288l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2289ya'll don't belIeve me
2290cyкa?02/24/2019
2291i do!!
2292:heart:
2293izz02/24/2019
2294hashtag justicefor8
2295l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2296i can't spell fuck me
2297cyкa?02/24/2019
2298you're doing so well bb
2299izz02/24/2019
2300i dunno man ive seen you 8 the fuck out of people on here
2301i just got up and got an orange and sat down and peeled it and ya'll are still typing
2302l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2303so ok i can't make an argument for 6w5 that i can agree with, but i agree that it's the most likely :hyperjoy~1:
2304have i :hyperjoy~1:
2305izz02/24/2019
2306still jealous because my typing channel was up for like 5 minutes
2307l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2308i am sorry izz
2309izz02/24/2019
2310it's not your fault i'm a simpleton
2311Evo02/24/2019
2312does 1 delay in expressing anger
2313
2314Anger feels very usually because you know it's irrational, you don't want to be rude, nor say something you'll regret, nor do you want to let the anger control your decision making ability...so walking away is usually what i personally do. I just will shut down and become cold abd responsive in a withdrawn way. Not giving much detail, not showing much expression, not letting the feeling of anger rise up in me...
2315
2316If it's someone not doing the more logical or right thing...then it usually comes out as frustration. Venting about how this needs to be done this other way because the way it's being done is less beneficial. And that frustration ultimately propelsthe 1 into improving things.
2317So yes
2318Probably lol
2319izz02/24/2019
2320ah so that's different than what heron has described which seems more like not expressing due to fear of reprecussions
2321Evo02/24/2019
2322I think that's the thing about 1s though, is they deliberate
2323Is that the word?
2324:thinking:
2325izz02/24/2019
2326yes
2327Evo02/24/2019
2328Like
2329They make choices based on the rules
2330izz02/24/2019
2331right
2332Evo02/24/2019
2333And look to see
2334izz02/24/2019
2335there's a lot of standards and 'shoulds'
2336Evo02/24/2019
2337Is X happening? Then do Y
2338Yes
2339l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2340i had something to say and forgot it :frowning:
2341Evo02/24/2019
2342So with the 8..anywho
2343Do u feel hmm
2344A sort of stimulation seeking? When you're angry?
2345Does that sort of uh
2346Get you going even more?
2347l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2348"when you're angry"
2349do you mean
2350Evo02/24/2019
2351Or does stimulus sort of numb u and calm you
2352And make you feel one with harmony
2353l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2354how the serving size for haagen dazs is like 1/2 cup and i ate at least that much in one sitting after finally buying some fucking good chocolate ice cream again
2355Evo02/24/2019
2356Because both 7 and 9 could be stimulus seeking
2357l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2358i wasn't angry but i was sure depressed
2359Evo02/24/2019
2360Hm
2361l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2362but those are related
2363Evo02/24/2019
2364:thinking:
2365Yea but what about
2366In the moment
2367The experience of anger
2368l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2369"what about" i couldn't fucking see
2370izz02/24/2019
2371wait you were raging because of the serving size of haagen dazs?
2372im confused
2373l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2374my glasses weren't meant for a lot of reading
2375Evo02/24/2019
2376I too am confused
2377:thinking:
2378l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2379and i got eyestrain so bad over 2 weeks i couldn't look at a computer most of the time
2380ah
2381i
2382might've misunderstood
2383sorry
2384try to recalibrate and i will adjust
2385Evo02/24/2019
2386The experience of anger
2387What's that feel like
2388When you're in the moment
2389l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2390it
2391shit
2392idk if i can say
2393it's bad
2394Evo02/24/2019
2395Sadistic?
2396What's bad lol
2397l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2398it feels like i wanna kill the person
2399Evo02/24/2019
2400It's anger :P
2401l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2402immediately after, anyway
2403Evo02/24/2019
2404Yea
2405Sadistic
2406Mine is too
2407Don't worry lol
2408I think i want to punish them tjo or something lol not sure
2409Anyways
2410Do u seek stimulus
2411
2412l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2413nothing to do with punishment
2414Evo02/24/2019
2415To distract you from that?
2416l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2417just
2418you've hurt me and/or x number other people
2419you don't deserve to live
2420Evo02/24/2019
2421Hm interesting
2422l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2423stimulus to distract
2424god i wish
2425when it's at that point i
2426can't
2427focus on anything else
2428izz02/24/2019
2429what if you use anger to distract
2430Evo02/24/2019
2431How do you calm down
2432Or do you not?
2433l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2434oh this is affecting me to where i started shaking lol
2435gimme a few
2436yeah so as for how i calm down
2437i assume i must, somehow
2438or else i probably would've actually murdered someone by now
2439but how?
2440i don't know
2441Evo02/24/2019
2442I see
2443Sounds like possibly w9
2444But not sure
2445l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2446i mean like
2447at this moment
2448i'm calming down by listening to Neptune by Sleeping At Last, on repeat
2449while answering these
2450though "calm" is still variant given the lyrics and personal interpretations
2451Evo02/24/2019
2452But hm i say that because 
24539s have anger amnesia just like 3s can have shame amnesia
2454And i highly relate to "not knowing how i calm down"
2455Lol
2456l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2457yeah.....mmm
2458Evo02/24/2019
2459Because i literally don't know
2460l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2461i'm like
2462it's possible that's why idk how i calm down but
2463i'm like
2464how much of it is from just not being given the experience to know how to learn to calm down
2465idk if it's built into me
2466Evo02/24/2019
2467Perhaps :thinking:
2468I mean i dont know either
2469So not sure
2470l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2471makes sense
2472Evo02/24/2019
2473There's only two exercises i know of that i can sort of feel the anger dissipate
2474l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2475i am very curious
2476Evo02/24/2019
2477I can teach you
2478l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2479please
2480Evo02/24/2019
2481When u are angry
2482Are u angry now?
2483l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2484no
2485Evo02/24/2019
2486It's much of a umm
2487In the moment exercise
2488l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2489ah
2490should i let you know next time i'm angry
2491Evo02/24/2019
2492Best to do it when you're feeling an intense feeling
2493Yes definitely
2494l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2495ok
2496Evo02/24/2019
2497Or upset
2498It works either way
2499l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2500mostly right now i'm finding myself wishing it was snowing
2501because if it was i'd want to go out in it
2502Evo02/24/2019
2503:3
2504l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2505but it's a pretty chill feeling overall
2506but also
2507thank you
2508because i could use the help
2509Evo02/24/2019
2510Yea, no problem
2511l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2512lol this channel went so many places
2513idek what to call the type determination
2514Evo02/24/2019
2515Yea lol
2516When we do the exercise 
2517Let's do it in feels or dms lol
2518So i dont have to log it ._.
2519Lmao
2520l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2521good idea
2522Evo02/24/2019
2523Yea idk i think it's a good idea to maybe reflect and revisit
2524Because enneagram is hard to do overnight :sweat_smile:
2525l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2526yeah and like
2527i can say honestly
2528i never fully read my ennea books
2529so maybe i should do that a bit more,haha
2530Evo02/24/2019
2531Yes that helps
2532Also have u read sx 4
2533From chestnut?
2534l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2535yeah i have chestnut's book
2536i uh
2537relate to both sx and sp from her descriptions of 4
2538not so though
2539Evo02/24/2019
2540Not that i condone her lol
2541But i do think there are parts to the sx 4 description she has that's accurate
2542Mostly that their feelings of disdain, expression, and sometimes withdrawal can be emphasized by the sx
2543Because the intensity is higher for them, the rawness
2544l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2545yeah, like
2546i think i have issues with all of those
2547and it took way too much effort to type that
2548Evo02/24/2019
2549Yea i could see the disdain lol
2550In the q
2551l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2552o :frowning:
2553idk how to feel about that lol
2554Evo02/24/2019
2555A 4w3 is like much more apt to be like
2556Shame amnesia plus idealistic
2557And trying to be productive with it
2558Comes up as more like "i want all these things, and ling for them...but i find ways to deal with it :cuwtie: "
2559Well i mean idk
2560I don't think it's a bad thing lol
2561It just stood out to me
2562I mean you're no Scar :P
2563Although lmao
2564He might be ur triad
2565:sweat_smile:
2566Not sure :thinking:
2567l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2568:sweat_smile:
2569i mean like
2570in things that
2571no one asked me about, despite the q
2572so like
2573one time
2574i was at IKEA with my ex, and said
2575"why do people decorate with things they hate?"
2576i didn't provide any context in that sentence but
2577i meant the wicker balls for sale in a basket on a table
2578because what actual person decorates with wicker balls
2579they're for magazine homes
2580who actually wants that
2581anyway that convo went the way of "you realize ppl exist that like them?"
2582and i later wrote a horror story on twitter where wicker balls absorbed every aspect of reality
2583(if anyone here likes wicker balls - i am not meaning to offend you, this is my personal opinion)
2584
2585Evo02/24/2019
2586hm
2587i'm sure that that's a good example of it, like a version of how it manifests
2588l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2589:sweat_smile: yeah, probably
2590Evo02/24/2019
2591also
2592question
2593do you
2594feel that you do
2595a mental process involving the creation of a gap between an unpleasant or threatening cognition, and other thoughts and feelings. By minimizing associative connections with other thoughts, the threatening cognition is remembered less often and is less likely to affect self-esteem or the self concept
2596
2597           The concept is illustrated with the example of a person beginning a train of thought and then pausing for a moment before continuing to a different subject. His theory stated that by inserting an interval the person was “letting it be understood symbolically that he will not allow his thoughts about that impression or activity to come into associative contact with other thoughts.” As a defense against harmful thoughts, isolation prevents the self from allowing these cognitions to become recurrent and possibly damaging to the self-concept.
2598
2599or
2600 the unconscious psychological attempt made by an individual to direct one’s own desires and impulses or pleasurable instincts, by excluding the desire from one’s consciousness and holding or subduing it in the unconscious.
2601either one
2602or both?
2603or neither?
2604l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2605yeah uh
2606i
2607think
2608neither
2609i can't relate to either of these
2610and i tried
2611to relate how i think to them
2612but
2613no
2614Evo02/24/2019
2615hm i see
2616l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2617i'm like
2618i half know what these were meant to reference
2619but not enough to actually say
2620Evo02/24/2019
2621yea
2622l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2623so
2624ok
2625i reread them both after a break
2626the first is still pretty ???? to me
2627the second kind of reminds me of how i wanted chocolate ice cream for 3-4 months but kept forgetting/telling myself i already had mango sorbet
2628and then finally bought a pint of chocolate ice cream and ate like 1/3 of it immediately
2629Evo02/24/2019
2630Yea i think that in general letting what we talked about here absorb is best
2631l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2632ok awake again..... i think i'm gonna reread this channel as i'm able today, see if that influences my thoughts
2633l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2634i've been kind of thinking about how the questionnaire, my state at the time i answered it, my internal framing of myself at that time vs now, etc............... affected a lot
2635though tbh i've been thinking about this a lot for a week+ :sweat_smile:
2636but it's interesting how the precise questions asked don't touch on important aspects of my experience, and therefore i didn't think of them at the time i was answering
2637like, an example i'm thinking of is a situation i was in where i was temporarily in this group where this was this phrase it was socially expected to use
2638and i was like
2639yeah please don't say that to me. it seems condescending and makes me pretty uncomfortable
2640(and then a few other people were like, "actually, same but i was afraid to say that")
2641which i think is like
2642if i was actually as withdrawn as the questionnaire made me sound, i wouldn't have done that?
2643l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2644which, related, i think i said this last night but a lot of my issues with my family are because I'm expected to self-erase and refuse :thinking:
2645same with people i don't really have a connection to
2646but when I'm with friends aka am actually relaxed, i don't feel that need as much?
2647i wonder if that's different fixes showing up in different situations
2648i think i always attributed that to 4 :joy:
2649l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2650also, i've been thinking about this for a while...... i don't mind relying on others for emotional support, but any sort of physical/financial/tangible/etc support i just, really hate?
2651i feel like i should be able to handle all that stuff myself
2652and don't like asking for help in those areas or relying on others at all
2653my family's an exception but i think i've mentally framed that as using them/repayment for the shit they're put me through :thinking: but i've also been thinking recently about how relying on them for anything has effectively made me weaker and less capable
2654this actually caused some issues with my ex after i fell while getting off an amusement park ride and hurt myself badly enough that i couldn't walk out of the park despite trying very hard to do so
2655because i basically couldn't walk the next few days and relying on her for anything was a miserable experience and i hated asking for anything
2656and she was like, you look after my needs all the time, why can't you let me do that for you?
2657l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2658@Evo ok..... i thought about it just now and i actually do know how i calm down from anger, but idk how to put it into ennea terms
2659sometimes I've put on really angry music, turned it way up, and painted until i calmed down
2660recently, calming down from anger has involved listening to songs with lyrics like "every day that you feed me with hate i grow stronger" or "i can feel the hate building up" while going out for a walk or going to the store to buy myself something
2661i think other times I've turned out all the lights and lit a candle and just like, thought about it? but while watching the flame, because eventually focusing on that is soothing
2662for a while when i was mad I'd get my woodcarving tools and just carve slices off a block of wood i designated for that purpose
2663sometimes I'll get a piece of paper and cut it into increasingly smaller pieces
2664etc
2665:thinking: most of these have the theme of doing something repetitive and unproductive?
2666StargazerOntan02/24/2019
2667very qt but probably not type related :GWvictoriaBolb:
2668l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2669that last part?
2670because i was responding to a question i was asked last night
2671StargazerOntan02/24/2019
2672the descs about how you calm down yeah
2673l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2674in that case i don't have an answer to the question :shruggie:
2675StargazerOntan02/24/2019
2676i mean i guess it's points against 8 but i don't think you were considering 8
2677l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2678we were considering it as a potential gut fix (but not core)
2679bye02/24/2019
2680heron 458 or 468? :hypethonk:
2681l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2682evo thinks 6w5 for head
2683bye02/24/2019
2684if 6 for head and 8 for gut that would make u triple reactive which i have a hard time seeing
2685I could definitely see 146 tho
2686l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2687yeah that was my ? about that one
2688StargazerOntan02/24/2019
2689same
2690i think 1 fix fits but i haven't been super engaged in this thread so take that with a grain of sugar
2691l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2692yeah the reason we started questioning 1 as a fix was partially bc i naturally react without thinking or consciously processing it first, and my good/bad stuff is 4-based
2693StargazerOntan02/24/2019
2694i mean if we take 146 as a running hypothesis that's double reactive anyway
2695l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2696yeah this is true :hypethonk:
2697i think i would believe some form of double reactive over triple
2698idk that I'm double compliant though
2699Evo02/24/2019
2700I think on vc i can easily lol see u
2701As triple
2702l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2703hahaha
2704maybe it's like, bc me irl and me on text definitely do not match up 1:1
2705StargazerOntan02/24/2019
2706valid
2707Evo02/24/2019
2708Woth the wing for the 8? :thinking: sounds like 9...
2709Possibly?
2710I guess a better question might be...
2711What is your natural reaction to anger
2712Meaning: do you usually want to ramp it up?
2713Or dim it down almost unconsciously?
2714l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2715naturally i want to ramp it up i think :thinking: but then it gets to where I'm like no, stop, i don't want to be angry anymore
2716but that happens more when like..... idk, when there's nothing i can do about a situation without digging myself a hole and i know it
2717that's usually when i can't stop thinking about it
2718i used to enjoy feeling angry like 13 years ago but now i kind of hate it because it takes away from my ability to act in a way that'll get the results i want
2719bye02/24/2019
2720Hmmmm vc in consideration yeah i could see it too!
2721l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2722:o
2723i think I've said before elsewhere that like, irl i intimidate people just by existing naturally in their vicinity
2724i am positive i do not come across that way over text lol
2725StargazerOntan02/24/2019
2726o this does sound 8
2727but like 8w9 probs idk
2728l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2729i transferred schools and the entire music department was scared of me and my voice teacher had a talk with me about it bc he was intimidated by me at first
2730but he was also considered intimidating by a lot of students so that talk was like "i think i get you now actually"
2731i loved him as a teacher, he was great
2732also once i transferred high schools and within two weeks there were rumors that i was a gang member :hyperjoy~1:
2733i scare dudes a foot taller than me who could probably pick me up when I'm angry
2734Evo02/24/2019
2735how come you want to ramp it up?
2736what sorts of things would you like to do if you gave into that natural impulse?
2737l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2738:thinking:
2739i had half an answer and forgot it, give me a minute
2740Evo02/24/2019
2741lol kk
2742l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2743so this is a little complicated because  - ok so my first thought was "the best defense is a good offense", but that was more true when i was a kid/teen (adding to that is that, back then, when i was angry it was usually the one pleasant feeling i'd experience, because i was never really happy back then). the reason i pull it back now is because i've learned that when i give in to being angry and acting impulsively i'm actually giving up my ability to influence the situation to go my way
2744
2745if i gave in to it :blobsweat~1:
2746when i used to give in all the time i'd like, scream and throw things as big as me and shit?
2747if i really gave in to it i'd probably kill someone but i definitely do not want to do that
2748Evo02/24/2019
2749yea hm i still dunno what the wing is haha
2750rip
2751l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2752:sweat_smile:
2753i'm trying
2754Evo02/24/2019
2755so i guess
2756it's like
2757the impulse to get ramp'd up is that
2758followed by something
2759where you kind of unconsciously want to suppress it a little
2760or not really
2761i could honestly see either wing my gut says 8w7 but who knows
2762¯\_(ツ)_/¯
2763l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2764i'm not sure if it's unconscious, subconscious, or conscious - i think it's more a conscious/intentionally learned thing
2765like i don't think i unconsciously want to suppress it
2766that's something i've had to fight myself to learn :sweat_smile:
2767because otherwise i don't think i'd do that at all
2768Evo02/24/2019
2769yea idk i feel like probably 8w7
2770i mean 8s in general though
2771might relate a little to that expression
2772of having the impulse to let is fly
2773l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2774i honestly like
2775lol
2776i do not think i have any 9 in me
2777if we'd gone with 1 i probably would've pushed 1w2
27781w9 is too detached
2779Evo02/24/2019
2780yea
2781same tbh
2782l'appel du vide02/24/2019
27839 is the one type that i've always been like, they seem cool! i am 100% not that
2784Evo02/24/2019
2785like the way my anger works for example
2786is someone says something incredibly rude or insulting
2787and i feel the anger in the moment rise up from my stomach
2788into my diaphragm and before it can even get to my chest
2789tbh i can't even describe it
2790:thinking:
2791it's like
2792some other reaction in me says "that's wrong, stop"
2793and then it gets blunted
2794
2795l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2796yeah i straight up don't have a "that's wrong" response to anger
2797Evo02/24/2019
2798as if there's a container holding it in my stomach
2799and that anger dissipates faster than i can say my full name lmao
2800and all of a sudden i'm like "i'm not angry, what do you mean?"
2801i literally forget
2802it feels like amnesia
2803l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2804i think i naturally do the opposite of that :joy:
2805Evo02/24/2019
2806yea haha
2807i've had to work on expressing my anger
2808because it's such a stressful thing to express
2809the only time i've expressed it is like
2810when there's some form of disillusionment
2811and i find out something or realize something
2812or when
2813the anger is some how too strong to contain anymore
2814for whatever reason
2815the thing that triggered it is so much stronger than the voice saying it's wrong, stop lol
2816so i can't see the 1 nor the w9 for ya
2817imo
2818if you're really like
2819watching your anger
2820l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2821like tbh
2822Evo02/24/2019
2823when it's happening and the internal natural processes that are happening
2824i had to wait for this type of instance to come up for me
2825and then watch it happen
2826and then i realized it's a combination of repression and suppression lol
2827the suppression from the 9 almost feels like a gust of wind came and blew the flames out
2828l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2829the reason i learned to shut it down fast when i get angry is bc i learned that gives me more control over the situation - especially if it's an argument because then i can just let the other person get tired of yelling and if i don't react they'll get bored
2830but it's definitely not 9 suppression
2831Evo02/24/2019
2832hm
2833well
2834that does maybe sound like w9 now though LOL
2835l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2836yeah but it's like, i still feel it
2837Evo02/24/2019
2838because they'll placate a little
2839l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2840i've just like, learned to turn off my external response
2841Evo02/24/2019
2842and "outlast" others
2843hm
2844l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2845and idk if it's that bc :joy:
2846this was a response to realizing my dad was intentionally provoking me into fights
2847and realizing i was being manipulated into it
2848so it's more of a huge "fuck you i'm not getting into this"
2849Evo02/24/2019
2850yea :thinking:
2851rip i can't tell now
2852lmao
2853l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2854i still don't think it's w9 haha
2855bye02/24/2019
2856Ofc you'll still feel it despite it being a w9
2857If the fix is 8 itself?
2858Or is that wrt the 1
2859l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2860:thinking:
2861umi you have an 8 fix
2862maybe you could help more
2863i think part of the issue with this particular categorization might be coming from like, talking to evo who does the exact opposite
2864StargazerOntan02/24/2019
2865i think 8w9 makes sense
2866l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2867tbh i could probably be convinced either way
2868StargazerOntan02/24/2019
2869w9 doesn't negate the 8 but it does add a more... stoic energy?
2870l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2871:open_mouth:
2872:thinking:
2873interesting
2874bye02/24/2019
2875Yeah
2876Rock in a river sort of energy
2877bigg pho energy
2878StargazerOntan02/24/2019
2879ya i always think of pho's vibe when i think of 8w9
2880l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2881i'm actually kind of like, mentally sitting with the "vibes" of 8w7 vs 8w9 for a fix
28828w7 doesn't feel right
2883but i can't describe why
2884:thinking:
2885actually i'm wondering if like the
2886Rock in a river sort of energy
2887is what people are picking up on when i'm relaxed and they say i seem really chill/have a calming presence
2888or as one of my friends put it, even her cats who hate everyone liked me because i'm very still and calm and quiet and move slowly around them
2889like there could be 3 cats who didn't get along in a room with me and none of them would fight bc of me being there
2890Evo02/24/2019
2891lol yea idk
2892but maybe
2893l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2894:sweat_smile:
2895maybe i'll look into the difference a bit and get back to this
2896as far as 4w5 + 6w5 goes, i think that actually makes more sense than having a 5 fix itself
2897bc i've always been like, i know i'm pretty 5, but am i really that much 5
2898Evo02/24/2019
2899the way you said you responded to fear
2900is how spicy said it
2901l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2902:open_mouth:
2903Evo02/24/2019
2904and that's pretty 6ish i feel like
2905l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2906yeah that makes sense
2907bye02/24/2019
2908god i wish i could respond to fear instead of just becoming it
2909l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2910solution: stop being a 6
2911Dark Green02/24/2019
2912i myself as a 6 don't normally get too fearful about things. Worst case scenario i'm Anxious about potential developments of situations and readily accept the worst case to happen not out of pessimism but as a way to prepare and handle it if it ever occurs 
2913Evo02/24/2019
2914yea that ^
2915lol
2916l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2917oh yeah haha that is basically what i said
2918Evo02/24/2019
2919it seemed to be something along the lines you were saying
2920and i highly relate to that
2921i probably become the fear though like umi said she does lmao
2922i think that's a bit of how 6 fixes can work though
2923some report "becoming the fear"  some report not really having much fear at all
2924lol just like 3s and shame
2925some 3s are highly aware of their shame even if they try to forget it
2926and others are like "what even is shame? :Think:  "
2927l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2928yeah when i think about things that scare me too much it kind of spirals so it's better to just
2929not
2930Evo02/24/2019
2931mhm
2932bye02/24/2019
2933Yeah ive been experiencing mroe often that "prepare to stop being anxious" thing
2934Like i go like
2935Well ive done all i can. If it goes to shit... :shruggie:
2936l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2937ok so
2938in-between talking, i did a bit of reading
2939and i'm thinking 8w9 for that one
2940bc the reading supported the "vibe" i was getting
2941l'appel du vide02/24/2019
2942:thinking: i wound up wondering if the reason that, when i think I've gone to 2, it's actually been in a positive way half the time (as opposed to disintegration)? is because of the double connection
2943Evo02/24/2019
2944hm maybe lol
2945l'appel du vide02/25/2019
2946i wound up thinking about the stuff that i used to think was 1, and that a lot of people who read the q saw as 1 - but how evo interpreted it as 4
2947and i'm like 90% sure it's all based on 4 reasoning and not 1 lol
2948like the feeling that i have to be perfect or else i don't deserve to even be called human - or maybe it's more accurate to say that it's a sense that i'm not human and that's the only way i can become one
2949like, when i was a kid one of my favorite books was the velveteen rabbit, and it's like i'm trying to become "real" like in that book
2950except that becoming "real" requires becoming infallible
2951a month or so ago i went through this sort of, hidden path i didn't know was there and it got me to think about things differently than my usual patterns
2952and i decided to stop trying to convince myself i'm human, because that was just causing me distress
2953and just accept myself as not-human :shruggie: because if i'm not trying to become human, i don't need to put so much pressure on myself
2954when i was in my teens thinking i was a changeling or something was kind of stressful, which was why i started trying to convince myself i was human in the first place
2955but it doesn't serve me anymore
2956l'appel du vide02/25/2019
2957I'm also thinking - regarding the anger stuff - usually it's only a problem at home?
2958because in other situations I've gotten comments on how patient i am, and tend to be the only one that's calm in stressful situations
2959and i don't think there's any secret resentment or anything building up at those times
2960though :thinking: the difference is whether or not it's personal, i think - specifically against me, my sense of privacy/boundaries, comfort, etc
2961i do feel resentment when i feel like i can't act/say anything
2962but again that's usually only when it's against me
2963l'appel du vide02/25/2019
2964like i had a professor i did work-study under, and he'd often be late, up to an hour late, and forget to tell me. so I'd just sit down with a book and enjoy the extra reading time bc that 2-hour block was marked off for helping him so it wasn't like i had anything better to do
2965and he was amazed because most students wouldn't have waited
2966:thinking: wondering if that sort of thing is a more concrete support for w9
2967l'appel du vide02/25/2019
2968:sweat_smile: kind of feels like I'm talking too much in here as i make potentially (?) related connections, but that's silly since this is my own channel and writing my thoughts out helps me process things
2969l'appel du vide02/25/2019
2970
2971i think I've been using this word wrong, actually - i don't experience this except in rare situations (or when living with shitty roommates)
2972most of the times i thought were resentment were more like... fleeting annoyance? loneliness when i felt I'd be rejected if i reached out? and such, but even when those built up over time it wasn't this
2973l'appel du vide02/25/2019
2974:thinking: i think my ex being convinced i was full of hidden resentment towards her and trying to get me to acknowledge it because she could ~empathically sense it, or whatever, really messed up my perception of it......... also I'm wondering if that was just her sensing something inside herself and thinking it was from me
2975
2976l'appel du vide02/25/2019
2977:superthink: if you want you could move this to pending, in case anyone else wants to comment + so a new person can exit queue
2978it'd be good if i let this settle a bit more before logging it, but i don't need to be in the typing section for that
2979Evo02/25/2019
2980yep was gonna
2981so that we can move the queue along
2982was waiting til today
2983so that it didn't seem rude :no_mouth:
2984lol
2985l'appel du vide02/25/2019
2986:spaceyirl~1:
2987l'appel du vide02/25/2019
2988also irt fear - i think i misrepresented that bc yeah, i may not feel a lot of fear but when I'm trying/thinking about contacting people to ask for something there's so much anxiety that i won't even check to see the response until i absolutely have to, a lot of the time - i mean, i think that's anticipating feeling a mix of anxiety and shame due to expected rejection/denial, but still
2989i experience more social anxiety than anything else
2990though when i have a really bad asthma attack or an allergic reaction I'm like oh god i can't breathe I'm dying....... in the latter case it's more justified considering i have to carry an epi-pen now
2991in the asthma case it's like, even when my ability to breathe is down to 1/3 normal, it'll be fixed with a nebulizer and steroids, and I've had asthma since i was 2 so???
2992though one of my earliest memories is being at the ER for asthma and thinking i was dying, and another is of having to stay in the ER overnight for asthma
2993on christmas eve no less
2994StargazerOntan02/25/2019
2995no idea how this relates to type but gigantic mood with the not checking responses bc anxiety thing
2996l'appel du vide02/26/2019
2997am i supposed to evaluate everything for "how much are others likely to think this potentially relates to type" or
2998if you really want context and need me to provide it, it's my mentally evaluating what was said about 6 vs 5
2999and please do not consider that a complete evaluation, because it's not
3000sorry I'm just, using this channel to sort out my thoughts at this point, mostly
3001so when every comment i get is "how does that even relate to type" it's like, okay, so what does relate to type if my experiences don't count
3002i feel like I'm being too emphatic but .-.
3003l'appel du vide02/26/2019
3004anyway I'm not trying to be hurtful or anything I'm just kind of :grimacing: about being criticized for attempting to process/evaluate instead of 1) blindly accepting or 2) automatically rejecting the outcome like I've seen most people do
3005StargazerOntan02/26/2019
3006didn't mean to criticize, i'm sure there's something in there that'll help someone else, just meant i personally didn't know
3007l'appel du vide02/26/2019
3008yeah that's fair
3009I'm not really going at my own typing trying to ultimately help others tbh lol
3010sorry i got annoyed, it wasn't really warranted :grimacing:
3011StargazerOntan02/26/2019
3012i just mean maybe someone else can discern 6 vs. 5 from that :whoapopcorn:
3013l'appel du vide02/26/2019
3014yeah maybe
3015it's still new to me to think of myself as a probable 6w5 fix
3016so who knows how much is confirmation bias
3017l'appel du vide02/26/2019
3018also i realized i misinterpreted what you were trying to say just now, so, uh, sorry about that too
3019l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3020okay. I've read quite a bit from several books about 6 (which i had somehow never actually read before?) and, yeah, that's more right than 5 even if 6 descriptions tend to be bad
3021i did that the other day, and am moving on to 8, and uh. first of all, i also somehow never read book descriptions about 8 before - or if i did, it was ages ago
3022so far, what I'm gathering is that
30231) the experience of 8 is more accurate than the experience of 1 and I'm not even that far in, jfc
30242) I'm like 90% sure I'd been mentally framing some of this as 5, to the point of potentially providing a biased account on the q
3025like my response to the question about fear, where i said i closed myself off externally for several years? i don't think that's 5
3026l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3027:blobsweat~1: yeah ok
30284w5 | 6w5 | 8w9 | sx/sp
3029i think the 8 is more visible more often irl, but it's not so visible on here, and the 8 and 6 flip depending on situation anyway
3030so whichever order is fine, as long as 4 goes in as core
3031daisuke02/28/2019
3032(triple reactive sx dom with no soc modulation...?)
3033l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3034we decided i was sx/sp instead of the other way around a while back
3035could still see that part either way
3036daisuke02/28/2019
3037Believable, the tritype however is surprising to me, then again I didn't follow the entire exchange
3038l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3039do you want a summary
3040daisuke02/28/2019
3041I'll scroll up
3042l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3043it's v long
3044daisuke02/28/2019
3045Keywords?
3046l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3047:thinking: a lot of the 6 and 8 came up from discussing how i experience fear/anger - the 6 from talking about how i don't experience a lot of fear but also get frequent flashes of things potentially going wrong in implausible ways; 8 involved a lot of discussion of how my experience of anger differs wildly from evo's 1, plus that nothing about the discussion of how i approach things irl sounds competency from discussion, and I've been reading to determine accuracy based on more than just that - it was also figured out early on that what looks like 1 in the q is from 4 motivations
3048the anger questions are a little sticky because i answered a lot of them at the time from looking back at the absolute disaster i was when i was younger, and I've developed a huge amount of self control since then in comparison, but it was out of necessity rather than like, thinking it was wrong - but there could be confounding influences being missed
3049there's also the fact to consider that i come off very different on here than irl
3050maybe start by going to the top and reading from evo's initial assessment?
3051tbh i do wonder a little how much the 4 is mucking up the ability to tell when it comes to the other stuff
3052daisuke02/28/2019
3053nothing about the discussion of how i approach things irl sounds competency from discussion
3054Oh, that's very interesting, I had different impressions and was surprised to see no competency in your triad
3055l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3056although i do kind of wonder about 6w5 vs 5w6, too
3057daisuke02/28/2019
3058If anything you do seem to have superego influence
3059Then again I don't know you
3060l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3061interesting :thinking: can you give am example
3062daisuke02/28/2019
3063I think you were talking about how you did things (not in your type me channel)
3064You seemed to have a focus on doing things right and getting things done, which struck me as either 1 or 6
3065A little more the doing and the doing it right part over planning it right which I associate with 5s, they overplan and overthink at worst
3066l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3067ah right that's something we actually didn't talk about at all in the channel, it didn't come up and i didn't think of it at the time
3068daisuke02/28/2019
3069So yes, I was surprised to see 8 over 1
3070l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3071makes sense
3072tbh I've been wondering whether that actually comes from 6 instead for me
3073daisuke02/28/2019
3074Could be. Depends on the why really
3075l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3076yeah
3077daisuke02/28/2019
3078ime they can appear superficially similar esp if you're just watching them on the field
3079bye02/28/2019
3080... Also, "archetypally" if you want to take that into consideration, in my head you fit 146 The Philosopher a lot more than 468
3081daisuke02/28/2019
3082Yeah, that ^
3083Overall how he behaves and carries himself, but that can be superficial
3084bye02/28/2019
3085Maybe it's just due to online tho who knows
3086I need to backread this whole thing later
3087l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3088that actually reminds me of another thing that came up - if i do have a 1 fix, it's specifically not 1w9
3089bye02/28/2019
3090Not 1w9?
3091:thinking:
3092daisuke02/28/2019
3093That's an iddy surprising because you have seemed more detached and withdrawn to me
3094bye02/28/2019
3095I think that's a lot of 4 influence
3096The withdrawn and detached
3097daisuke02/28/2019
30984w5 is detached, 4 alone not so much. Aloof, yes
3099bye02/28/2019
3100well 4w5 is withdrawn core + wing so makes sense
3101Mm but yea I'll need to backread the log later to have a better opinion
3102daisuke02/28/2019
31031w2 has struck me more of an involved activist and 1w9 a detached, impartial kind
3104bye02/28/2019
3105out of those 1w2 sounds more like heron tbh
3106daisuke02/28/2019
3107There it is, then
3108l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3109that's actually related to something I've been wondering about since passionate's thread
3110in that 1 sx is more aware of the anger component than the other 1 subtypes
3111therefore like... evo's 1w9 sp vs my theoretical 1w2 sx
3112would not have the same experience
3113daisuke02/28/2019
3114Not sure how much the wings would make them differ, but
3115:fishthonk: double gut and double superego
3116l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3117i think I'm half-falling prey to the "everyone has every type inside them" when it comes to the fixes (not core)
3118i could construct an argument for anything given the materials
3119and also the fact that any discussion of this is necessarily going to be incomplete by nature
3120though I'm also reminded of the conversations i had with umi before/at the start of this about 1 vs 4
3121daisuke02/28/2019
3122Eh, I wouldn't disagree, I think it boils down to preference, kind of
3123If I really wanted to I can construct an argument for any type, but some types I'll be more hardcore nitpicking over the others to even type as it
3124I think some traits can overlap and seem like others, it's kind of finding the combo that explains everything without contradicting itself
3125l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3126yeah that's the struggle I'm having, ultimately
3127tbh
3128i didn't say it in here before, because i wasn't thinking of it, but I've gone between 4 and 1 for core several times over the years
3129l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3130i think the other thing i have to consider is that if it wasn't for 8 being brought up i wouldn't have seriously considered it
3131l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3132I'm also thinking........ insofar as it pertains to anger, i answered those questions from the overarching standpoint of "at home/with parents", as that's been most of my experience
3133but in all other situations it's been very different, to the point of my looking like an entirely different person
3134but idk which one is more "real"
3135daisuke02/28/2019
3136...gently gives you 6 fix yeah that's attachment triad right there
3137Going and acting based off what is right to do (which is I assume is why you behave differently in different places)
3138l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3139that's part of it, plus like..... I'm way more relaxed literally anywhere else so i just. it's very rare i get angry outside of at home tbh
3140unless I'm on public transportation but i know how to tolerate that
3141bye02/28/2019
3142I mean i guess the question here is, in the end, not how often you get angry, but how your mindset is in regards to that anger
3143Whether you see it as something you'd rather subdue because it gets in the way with what you need to do, or a driving force to solve problems
3144l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3145yeah that's the issue - i can mostly only answer that from the standpoint of "at home"
3146unless I'm misunderstanding the meaning of "anger" in this context due to having a particular sense of what that is
3147but also how far back in my history should i be looking
3148because i used to try to solve problems with it, as an initial response, but that doesn't work, so now i try to subdue it because it gets in the way
3149yelling at someone who touched my book after i said I'd move it myself doesn't solve her not understanding boundaries, it just makes her cry and makes people mad at me
3150bye02/28/2019
3151well, i also feel that way towards my own anger, altho i think that's just maturity
3152in the end i always snap anyway lol
3153but tbf. im actually still unsure of my gut fix kinda :sweat_smile:
3154so i cant be of much help
3155l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3156that's fair :sweat_smile:
3157bye02/28/2019
3158in that vein if we assume im 8 fix, which is most likely, then just the fact that you subdue the anger because you don't want to hurt others is not essentially 1>8, you're just not an asshole
3159l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3160yeah like - so an example
3161after an event once i was waiting on the 14th floor of the hotel with 3 friends for elevators. the elevators were all utterly packed for like half an hour. one of my friends snapped at me. 10 years ago i would've snapped back, but i was able to be like, i don't care how long this takes but she's super stressed rn, don't make it worse. so i didn't say anything
3162l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3163i need to nap though
3164l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3165right so post-nap: later i'm going to look up one of the convos where one of my friends I've had for a few years described me a while back, and maybe ask my therapist today how she sees me, to like..... see if i can get a picture from a couple different viewpoints from people who've known me longer
3166l'appel du vide02/28/2019
3167oh i just remembered the incident from when i was a kid that started my tendency to explode that lasted for 10+ years after - i was like 7, recognized i was angry about something, and calmly told my dad that i was angry... and his response was "no you're not" :hyperjoy~1:
3168which led me to be unable to recognize anger unless i was screaming or destroying things for years
3169because that was the only way it'd be acknowledged for what it was
3170to this day, if my dad's yelling at me and i make sure i stay externally calm, he'll accuse me of trying to manipulate him/make him look bad/things he's made up and convinced himself are true
3171i wonder how much "remaining externally calm when angry" being unvalued by my family skewed my perceptions
3172Rasa02/28/2019
3173remaining externally calm when angry feels
3174l'appel du vide03/01/2019
3175ok so i've been thinking over 1 again all of today and my thoughts are still kind of scattered but
3176
3177- when i saw my therapist i discussed with her that i want to change the major for my 2nd degree to paralegal due to personal interest and realllly not being into a business degree that i don't need or even really want and was just convinced into, and she said i'd be excellent at it (she comes from a family where most people are some form of law professional) bc of how i enjoy organizing other people's things and am extremely data-oriented in my approach to a lot of things (to the point where it's weirded people out/gotten me told there's something wrong with me, and caused me to get lower grades on papers because i was told to include a human element and could not comprehend how to do that)
3178
3179- analyzing my general response to my mom not quite understanding that because i was the one cooking dinner for four people i needed her out of the kitchen 100% - i waited for her to leave, but afterwards my thoughts while i was chopping vegetables kept going between "if you come back in here you can do the cooking yourself" and "you should be grateful i'm even offering to do this so that no one else has to"
3180- i mentioned this elsewhere on the server before, but when i was asking people from my first time at uni for references, one of them included "You were always reliable and diligent, and we could always count on you to volunteer to special projects in the department" in her reply. by the end of my first semester i'd noticed that almost no students in the music department volunteered for anything, so i wound up feeling like i had to volunteer for everything because no one else fucking would and someone had to do it... plus i'd go out of my way to ask this reference (one of the office administrators) if she needed help whenever i had free time, because she always needed help, and she wound up entrusting me with tasks she wouldn't have given her assigned student workers because they wouldn't have taken the time to do them right but she knew i would. (this was while juggling 19-20 credits/semester, 2 hours of being a student worker/week, 8 hours of work-study/week, 12-13 concerts/semester, being the treasurer of a club, opera/musical theater practice, instrumental practice, and homework. i still managed to graduate with a gpa over 3.5)
3181i considered going full meme because there's something that's hilarious in the context of this consideration, but i decided not to
3182
3183
3184Evo03/06/2019
3185i don't see why :thinking:
3186l'appel du vide03/06/2019
3187because people keep telling me i sound more 1 and i am not convinced i know myself well enough at this point to argue because my resistance is being worn down :sob:
3188it's really confusing because like, idk how much i'm being thrown off by how i come off in this server + the question of how much my 1-ish aspects are from 4 reasons
3189like i think there needs to be a tradeoff in some place
3190like 4+6 = probably not also 8; 4+1 = probably not double competency in reality
3191that sort of thing??????
3192like IRL i could believe double reactive but not triple
3193the problem with how much i know myself is exacerbated right now because i've recently come to a lot of realizations and reframings of things that mean i have to rework my self-image
3194@Evo help me (sometime after vc)
3195l'appel du vide03/06/2019
3196it's especially hard because i can come up with evidence for multiple views
3197l'appel du vide03/06/2019
3198i should be asleep but like. I'm getting hit really hard at this point by the feeling I've had since i was a little kid that there's something everyone else knows that i don't? I've read part/all of uh... I'd say at least 8 enneagram books, but i still don't feel like i have a strong grasp on most of the types, and so when other people keep saying my (a) fix seems like (xyz), and they say that with certainty, it hits that sense of "you clearly know more than i do"
3199so when those views of others are conflicting but they're all expressed in a way that hits that "they know better than me", it's just like :sob:
3200because i want an answer but I've never been able to tell head/gut with any certainty, and with gut it's especially bad because it's like actually i don't relate to any of you!
3201Jules03/06/2019
3202this feeling I’ve had since I was a kid that there’s something everyone else knows that I dont
3203Mood
3204Evo03/07/2019
3205What " 1ish aspects"?
3206You're Fi dom plus idealistic triad...
3207It's gonna look 1 af lol
3208The biggest thing for me that we went into detail about is like
32091s usually want to justify their anger
3210You did not even for one second
3211Say that, nor do you come off like that
3212And justification
3213Is different than validation
3214Which are you seeking?
3215:thinking:
3216Also, idk
3217I have like been into enneagram for over a decade, majored in psychology my first time around in school, have read over 25 or so typology books
3218And i keep learning more and more about enneagram
3219Things that i see other people don't notice
3220So at this point i don't really give a shit if others agree on it
3221It's not really going to happen, especially with how fluid enneagram is to begin with
3222Plus tritype is just a theory
3223There are some people that believe your core and wing explain everything there is about you
3224I personally think typing by triads is easiest, so i do that
3225Many people type by descriptions
3226There's not really a right answer
3227Just whatever feels more accurate
3228Depending on what enneagram books you read tho
3229Some descriptions will be more biased against types
3230So i think that's important to keep in mind
3231l'appel du vide03/07/2019
3232whew, ok, thank you - i think i needed that reminder
3233very much appreciated
3234l'appel du vide03/07/2019
3235ok so given all that - what i want to know now is what you saw that prompted you to comment i might have 5 instead of 6 after all for head fix in vc the other night
3236
3237with that additional input, i think i'll be willing to make a conclusion within a few days
3238l'appel du vide03/09/2019
3239:thinking: i actually came up with a solid example of how i dealt with anger outside my family before i learned self-control at the level i currently have
3240
3241one time i was eating lunch and this guy like a foot taller than me stood behind me and kept trying to get my attention. it was incredibly annoying...
3242
3243...so after realizing he wasn't gonna go away, i turned around, grabbed him by the collar, and told him to go fuck himself
3244
3245he left after that
3246it was probably things like that that led to the rumors i was a gang member after i transferred schools, though i don't remember well enough to say  :sweat_smile:
3247l'appel du vide03/09/2019
3248anyway the fact is that for a long time i was just like that .... which i am 100% sure isn't communicated through text, but which people irl sense even if i (probably) wouldn't do that anymore
3249Evo03/09/2019
3250:blobhide:
3251Defo still think 8 fix
3252:ConcernedCoffee:
3253And yea idk it just seemed like what umi mentioned the other day hm
3254About uh
3255bye03/09/2019
3256Ya after this I think so too
3257also :eyes:
3258Evo03/09/2019
3259Like hm
3260Let me find quote
32611-800-BULLY-ME03/09/2019
3262hmm
3263what about 461?
3264Evo03/09/2019
3265Heron you have a 6 fix you suck up to authority typed
3266This made me actually go
3267:Bhinking:
3268Maybe it's not there
3269I forget if i asked you @l'appel du vide ...uh 
3270What's your relationship with security? :thinking:
3271I am more and more certain on the 8 fix tbh...less so on head
3272I do remember you saying something that seemed more 5ish possibly when we were trying to decipher pragmatic vs affiliative the other day...plus... systematic vs interest :thinking::thinking::thinking::thinking:
3273Actually
3274Systematic vs interest was pretty revealing
3275The fact that you were able to like "cut" through shit (especially as a 4 lmao) reminded me of the "swords" suit. Which i associate with 5s
3276Your answer seemed very competency oriented
3277Less like...um...
3278"Interested in which side your on"
3279Or whatever
3280bye03/09/2019
3281Lol I wonder Evo
3282Why did that make you doubt it
3283Evo03/09/2019
3284Because i don't see heron like uh
3285:thinking:
3286Idk
3287The authority thing i guess
3288But that doesn't mean it's not there
3289It just made me think "hm maybe not"
3290Heron seems to be like not swayed either way by authority
3291Doesn't seem like attachment i guess to me, idk
3292I can't really tell now lol
3293And i forgot their response to security, or if i even asked it
3294l'appel du vide03/09/2019
3295you didn't ask about security as far as i recall either :thinking:
3296but i'm not sure which way to interpret what you mean about my "relationship to security"
3297Evo03/09/2019
3298Any way
3299l'appel du vide03/09/2019
3300i can try to answer anyway, though
3301ok
3302Evo03/09/2019
3303Yea it's like hm
3304Well in general
3305There's like things people do to feel secure
3306And things that make them feel like they have no footing i guess
3307Or like
3308I guess maybe that might be a better question
3309Where do you feel like you get your security and grounding/footing
3310l'appel du vide03/09/2019
3311in that case.... so there's only a handful of situations where i can say i feel entirely secure, but they're easy enough to come across
3312
33131) being entirely alone on the physical level - like, texting or discord are a different matter, i can turn those off if i want to. when i live with other people i never feel entirely secure unless i'm not sharing my bedroom and can lock my bedroom door when i'm inside. but i can also feel pretty secure when i'm somewhere in nature that i'm alone, like in the middle of the woods, or if i'm at the beach in winter and i'm the only one down at the sand. at school this usually meant finding the places no one else went - tops of staircases near the roof access and stuff.
3314
33152) uh this one is less certain/stable, but i can sometimes feel okay or mostly okay having just one other person around, if we've formed a connection
3316
33173) every other situation i can think of is lesser so uh, otherwise idk
3318"grounding" is a difficult one to respond to because uh....... i never/rarely feel grounded, and when i've tried to ground myself i didn't enjoy it, it was weird
3319though we might be using the word differently, idk
3320the form of grounding I'm used to hearing about is the one where it's like, feel your feet on the ground, get in touch with your body, your presence in reality, etc
3321l'appel du vide03/09/2019
3322though, i just made food in the kitchen and felt pretty secure despite people in the living room, because none of them came in :sweat_smile: idk, this one is hard
3323
3324Evo03/09/2019
3325hmmmm
3326Interesting that u went there with the grounding thing
3327I don't like meditation that involves ""grounding"" myself
3328Is this what you're referring to?
3329Like feeling planted?
3330Because i don't think that's what i meant
3331I meant more like ...
3332l'appel du vide03/09/2019
3333oh yeah i misinterpreted that part then
3334Evo03/09/2019
3335If you hmmm
3336Let me think
3337If you focus your awareness in your headspace
3338And think about security
3339Like things that make you feel secure
3340And imagine those things being pulled away
3341How do you feel or react?
3342l'appel du vide03/09/2019
3343that feels like..... a physical vibrating tension + general irritation at everything
3344like metaphorically, if the barrier between "secure" and "not secure" was like, a sheet of paper, someone's using a knife to tear through that paper
3345Evo03/09/2019
3346:thinking:
3347Very interesting
3348And what if that feeling were to happen
3349What kinds of things/activities
3350Would you want to do
3351Or hm
3352I guess like
3353Would you "grasp" to something?
3354Feel and impulse to do something? Or :thinking:
3355Idk how to explain
3356I guess just what's your first impulse in response to that?
3357l'appel du vide03/09/2019
3358I'll have to retry the exercise later, I'm in a stream of The Guy Who Didn't Like Musicals and i won't be able to focus right now
3359l'appel du vide03/09/2019
3360i think i'd want to reestablish the sense of security/reestablish a feeling of equilibrium
3361
3362one way that'd work out would be by removing the sense of imbalance - removing myself from the situation, using hand sanitizer/washing my hands, brushing my shoulder off vigorously to replace/remove the sensation of someone touching me without permission, turning my music up loud enough on headphones that i can tune out everything happening around me, moving seats, etc. if someone else can get into my room/apartment, and does so without asking for permission, i feel a need to install a lock that only i have control over - a chain lock or something (i've never actually done this because it'd cause more trouble than it's worth). if someone touches a possession of mine or puts their things in an area designated for me without permission, it really pisses me off - prior case, immediate response is to go on a rant about "how dare you touch that", especially if i outright said "don't touch that" or "i'll move it myself" or if it was touched with greasy fingers or whatever; second case, i'm immediately and strongly tempted to just throw whatever was put in my space away. 
3363
3364if it's more on the level of say... so if something happened to Oscar Wilde, my stuffed unicorn, i don't know what i would do - if someone intentionally destroyed him, i'd want to destroy 5 times as many of their belongings, but if he was lost in a fire or something..... i guess i'd replace him eventually, but it might be a few years before i found one that called to me enough for that.
3365if it's an issue with money...  i have huge issues with owing money, or asking for it - if i owe money i pay it back ASAP, and i don't ask for it unless i'll literally starve or be stranded somewhere otherwise - but i try to plan traveling well enough to avoid that situation in the first place. that said, i was able to survive on like $80/month for food for a while, though, and it only bothered me because i didn't like using the kitchen when anyone was in it (though i no longer have any idea what i ate in that period aside from rice, bread, milk, instant coffee, and tap water). i think this relates to my physical security otherwise in terms of like, when i've injured myself...... i'll put up with leg injuries and stuff until i literally cannot walk another step without collapsing rather than ask for or accept offered help, even as recently as 2 years ago.
3366
3367there was one time, the winter after the first time i had pneumonia, that i was out with friends and wound up coughing so hard i literally could not stand, i could barely even stay kneeling. my friends were going to take me to the ER and i refused to let them and told them to just bring me back inside where it was warm. having to be carried was bad enough without getting hospitals involved
3368discord made me cut the message up because i typed too much :sweat_smile: i'm not entirely sure this is complete but it's all i've got right now
3369l'appel du vide03/09/2019
3370i wound up thinking of one other scenario while i was out of the house - one of the easiest ways to break through my sense of security is to try to force/coerce me to try new things before i'm ready, or to tell me there's something wrong with me for how i approach trying new things. this was a huge issue with my ex, who thought i should either never want to try new things or else be as indiscriminate as she was, rather than having a system which i couldn't quite verbalize. (we actually wound up getting into fights near the end about my refusal to try new things just because they were new, and she started feeling contemptuous of me over it and said so.)
3371
3372i could probably make a flowchart of the process, but that seems like a pain, so the general components/possible causes of my trying something new are:
3373
3374- have i been in proximity enough times to determine interest/slow acceptance of aspects of the thing?
3375- does it have components i already understand, and which i can imagine the blend of?
3376- is it within a general category i already have comprehension of, within which the details differ but the form is standard?
3377- is this a thing that was on a show i like and which i understand the origin of?
3378- have i read about it and now feel compelled to try it to get more of the experience?
3379- did i just happen to decide i want to?
3380
3381it doesn't have to be all of those, and often is just one.
3382
3383i think this is simple enough for how to get me to try something new without my being miserable/point-blank refusing due to expectation of such a negative experience that i will never recover; but basically, the expectation that i try something before i'm ready throws off my sense of security/safety/stability, and i'll resist and resist even harder the more it's expected
3384l'appel du vide03/10/2019
3385i'm also thinking about the authority stuff and :superthink: i identified the traits which determine whether i get along with authorities, but i think they apply to people in general:
3386
3387- confidence +
3388- competence +
3389- condescension -
3390like when i said i usually get along with teachers better than peers, it's because they're likely to be either more confident or more competent (or both) than peers - i'm drawn to confidence in people, and i'm drawn to people who know what they're talking about
3391but there are also insecure teachers who won't tolerate anyone who doesn't defer, incompetent teachers who can't teach worth a damn, and teachers who are confident and know their subject but are condescending assholes
3392and i don't even try to get along with those because there can't be a connection between us as people
3393bye03/10/2019
3394See i just
3395Don't approach teachers
3396Even if i like them as people
3397l'appel du vide03/10/2019
3398oh
3399bye03/10/2019
3400There's this rift
3401Of authority
3402l'appel du vide03/10/2019
3403if i like them as people i start making jokes with them in the classroom
3404bye03/10/2019
3405Yes i see people doing that
3406And ive tried lol
3407But
3408It's UNBELIEVABLy Awkward for me
3409l'appel du vide03/10/2019
3410it's more awkward for me when i can't do that
3411bye03/10/2019
3412Because in my head im like "but they're a teacher"
3413l'appel du vide03/10/2019
3414they're people like everyone else to me
3415bye03/10/2019
3416I obviously see them as people lol
3417But they're also a teacher
3418In a school context
3419StargazerOntan03/10/2019
3420this mindset changed between hs/uni for me!
3421bye03/10/2019
3422Possibly that too
3423It makes sense
3424Even the titles are different
3425In hs its student-professor, and in uni everyone calls each other "colleague"
3426StargazerOntan03/10/2019
3427in uni not only do the profs have more freedom to express their personalities, the students are also adults just the same
3428bye03/10/2019
3429the professor calls you your colleague
3430So ye that would make sense
3431l'appel du vide03/10/2019
3432i don't remember high school well enough lol
3433bye03/10/2019
3434Maybe try to think of you earlier in school in regards to authority :thinking:
3435O
3436Rip
3437l'appel du vide03/10/2019
3438i remember i didn't know what a GPA was and nearly failed out/dropped out
3439and uh.... that one time in 3rd grade i wasn't allowed to go to the restroom and i told the teacher fine, i'll pee myself right here
3440lmao
3441StargazerOntan03/10/2019
3442icon
3443l'appel du vide03/10/2019
3444i don't have a lot of memories of what school was like high school and below
3445uh :thinking: i do remember that i started liking math in high school because of the teacher who let me move ahead of everyone else in class because the pace was too slow for me
3446StargazerOntan03/10/2019
3447lov teachers like that
3448l'appel du vide03/11/2019
3449so in the feels channel tonight, izz was able to cut to what i think is the heart of what i think i was saying about security earlier - which is that i struggle when it comes to unknowns/uncertainty, and that knowing things ahead of time/predictability helps
3450izz03/11/2019
3451See i just
3452Don't approach teachers
3453
3454
3455lol yeah i would have never approached a teacher unless i needed something from them
3456Passionate03/11/2019
3457heron's cute
3458l'appel du vide03/11/2019
3459:uwu:
3460cyкa?03/11/2019
3461:uwuwu:
3462Evo03/14/2019
3463i think i'd want to reestablish the sense of security/reestablish a feeling of equilibrium
3464
3465one way that'd work out would be by removing the sense of imbalance - removing myself from the situation, using hand sanitizer/washing my hands, brushing my shoulder off vigorously to replace/remove the sensation of someone touching me without permission, turning my music up loud enough on headphones that i can tune out everything happening around me, moving seats, etc. if someone else can get into my room/apartment, and does so without asking for permission, i feel a need to install a lock that only i have control over - a chain lock or something (i've never actually done this because it'd cause more trouble than it's worth). if someone touches a possession of mine or puts their things in an area designated for me without permission, it really pisses me off - prior case, immediate response is to go on a rant about "how dare you touch that", especially if i outright said "don't touch that" or "i'll move it myself" or if it was touched with greasy fingers or whatever; second case, i'm immediately and strongly tempted to just throw whatever was put in my space away. 
3466
3467yea i mean lol @l'appel du vide that seems 5 fix, do you agree?
3468:ThinkFish:
3469like as a comparison
3470when i do this exercise personally?
3471i feel like security is being ripped from me like all the foundation is gone, and the attachment triad descriptions really fits me in this sense, only with security though
3472i'd probably take steps to rectify it by like
3473asking people for support and guidance
3474so i think the exercise can be quite literal in that sense
3475plus the other thing i think... is that :thinking:  you seem to do that "vigilant"  thing we talked about like 8s, but simultaneously you don't seem HYPER vigilant
3476do you feel that internally you're hypervigilant about security?
3477
3478l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3479and i tell very few people what parts are "me" and which are "fiction"
3480Evo03/14/2019
3481that'd probably be more 4w3 i suppose
3482since they'd have expansive influence
3483wew
3484yea
3485did we do your 8 fix btw?
3486:thinking:
3487l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3488i don't think we decided on that one
3489we were kinda going back and forth
3490Evo03/14/2019
3491Seeks influence by showing off their capability and courting positive, straightforward interactions
3492
3493vs
3494Seeks influence by being the nucleus/rock. The eye of the storm. The unmovable object. 
3495
3496with this one, you personally might want to substitute "influence" with like "control" or something :thinking:
3497there's probably a more fitting word for you
3498i was thinking of this earlier but didn't come up with a better substitute
3499for bba we substituted influence with "authority"
3500and that made much more sense
3501l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3502The unmovable object. omg so many times i've been in conflicts and they escalated bc the other person got increasingly upset i wouldn't back down
3503Evo03/14/2019
3504i see
3505l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3506even when i wasn't even mad
3507Evo03/14/2019
3508do you come off stubborn in that sense?
3509i suppose stubborness could be any type thing for different reasons tho
3510i hate to generalize like this lol
3511but it's only for wings on fixes
3512l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3513i guess also though that that one like :thinking: applies to other situations too, like i could give examples but idk if it's relevant for this
3514and yeah i'm stubborn af
3515sometimes to my own detriment
3516Evo03/14/2019
3517is seeking control more fitting for you?
3518l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3519it takes a LOT of willpower for me to stop externally stating my position
3520once i've said it
3521Evo03/14/2019
3522i was specifically thinking about the library example where you don't want to have your back to people
3523l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3524yeah "control" makes more sense to me than influence i think bc like
3525i don't care if i'm agreed with
3526Evo03/14/2019
3527yea again, i don't think you're super "overt" about the control
3528l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3529i want to maintain myself/my surroundings
3530Evo03/14/2019
3531yea
3532l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3533maybe kind of feeds into the 4 there
3534in terms of maintaining control over being myself
3535Evo03/14/2019
3536yes maintaining instead of like lol conquering :smile:
3537seems more fitting
3538influencing gives the impression of wanting to dominate or conquer
3539or whatever
3540ah i see
3541l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3542and also like :thinking:
3543when i became the person all the other music theory students would go to for tutoring/homework help, in community college, i wasn't showing off (my) capability
3544it was more like i consistently got top scores, and i was the one who made that one teacher actually teach us at our level
3545so the others just kind of came to me for help
3546Evo03/14/2019
3547i see
3548yea seems right
3549l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3550and i didn't mind bc lol
3551they were great instrumentalists but shit at theory
3552least i could do was help them with grades
3553
3554Evo03/14/2019
3555lol
3556yea
3557that's kool :3
3558l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3559so probably the w9 there?
3560Evo03/14/2019
3561yea probably :thinking:
3562honestly i could still see either wing for that one
35635w6 wing seemed easier to see
3564but the subdued part of w9 does seem fitting
3565l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3566yeah the 8 wing is a little hard
3567Evo03/14/2019
3568the 8w7s i know can very much be like izz i guess
3569l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3570lol
3571i'm wondering if that might actually be my weakest fix
3572Evo03/14/2019
3573like how izz will stir things up in chat and have like
3574positive convos
3575l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3576yeah
3577oh that
3578reminds me of something that's been happening recently
3579izz and i have occasionally been switching places :smile:
3580Evo03/14/2019
3581you seem to probably want that but like not in the same way as having to maintain positive convos
3582how so lol
3583l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3584like izz will be super down and i'll be full of energy and positivity
3585Evo03/14/2019
3586aw lol
3587i see
3588qts
3589and yea idk 
3590i feel that the 8 is strong with you
3591but i could also see the 5 so
3592¯\_(ツ)_/¯
3593i think that's up to you haha
3594l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3595hmm
3596give me a few minutes to think
3597Evo03/14/2019
3598sure
3599usually the theory goes something like
3600you use the one that's like
3601next in line
3602if you can't solve a problem with your dominant fix
3603then you use your second, then your third
3604and i personally think that the order of those 2 fixes can change
3605like i used to have such a prominent 6fix that i used to type as 6 core
3606now it's my last fix lmao
3607i also feel that when i was typing as that, i moved through quite a lot of that fixation's hiccups and such
3608l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3609yeah..... so memey psych territory aside (which i can say anyway if you want), i think my 5 fix has been strongest when i'm under stress
3610like, there's obviously still an influence since w5, but :thinking:
3611at this point in time it probably does go 4 8 5
3612though i'd guess the 5 fix itself is still p strong
3613as i've gotten older i've really like, idk
3614moved into my power/confidence?
3615which may not be type, but
3616like, i even walk differently than i used to
3617Evo03/14/2019
3618hm i see
3619so you think it used to be 458 and is now 485?
3620or the other way around?
3621l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3622the first, most likely
3623Evo03/14/2019
3624i see i see
3625l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3626though :thinking: dependent on situation, too
3627Evo03/14/2019
3628mhm
3629which are you most out of touch with?
3630fear or anger?
3631l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3632fear
3633i'm definitely way more in touch with anger lmao
3634Evo03/14/2019
3635lol
3636then yea i think 485 fits probably
3637do you have problems feeling secure?
3638over having problems from anger?
3639l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3640:thinking:
3641it's hard to say bc
3642usually when something unbalances me, my next-to-immediate reaction is anger
3643they go together a lot
3644and with feeling secure.........
3645usually i try to arrange things so that i don't have to feel insecure in the first place
3646though
3647hmm
3648i've also cut off things that made me feel more secure because i was angry at them :hyperjoy~1:
3649Evo03/14/2019
3650lol
3651i see
3652l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3653though when i got mad at my job coach she did contact me back eventually
3654Evo03/14/2019
3655i think
3656485
3657sounds bout right
3658only because
3659i do tend to see you rely on anger more
3660i think like
3661l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3662yeah that's like 90% of my vents in the feels channel lmao
3663Evo03/14/2019
3664mitigating insecurity in order to be able to like maintain meaning
3665is like
3666just the w5 as well
3667yea
3668i think it makes your personality slightly stronger than 458
3669which makes sense to me
3670l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3671:thinking: that makes sense........
3672especially bc like
3673how i said i tend to go into new groups irl and i scare people just by existing
3674Evo03/14/2019
3675lmao
3676:joy:
3677ye
3678that too
3679l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3680god that sounds so edgy but it's true
3681Evo03/14/2019
3682it's so funny to me
3683because you tend to simultaneously be that but the opposite at the same time
3684lol
3685l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3686the opposite?
3687Evo03/14/2019
3688yea like on here you don't seem like super uhh
3689working against self erasure
3690but i could see it in person
3691like vc
3692l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3693oh yeah like how several ppl thought i was triple withdrawn
3694Evo03/14/2019
3695yes
3696or  compliant gut fix
3697O_o
3698l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3699yeah
3700Evo03/14/2019
3701yea lol
3702l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3703yeah in text and like, when i'm relaxed (or both), i come off real chill
3704Evo03/14/2019
3705yee :3
3706definitely
3707i must go for a bit
3708want to leave this up for  another day for anything else?
3709l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3710i half want to say yes and half expect people to try convincing me i'm a 1 fix again
3711
3712Evo03/14/2019
3713lol
3714well you do come off 1 fix from the outside
3715i totally understand the argument
3716but you don't seem to naturally want to suppress anger or repress it at all
3717l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3718yeah, it's v much learned
3719Evo03/14/2019
3720i think your one story convinced people too
3721l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3722:joy:
3723Evo03/14/2019
3724i forget what it was though
3725l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3726"go fuck yourself"
3727Evo03/14/2019
3728probably the one where people thought you were in a gang
3729lol
3730o
3731l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3732that one too
3733Evo03/14/2019
3734yea
3735wew
3736that's not something Gus would say
3737for instance
3738l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3739who
3740Evo03/14/2019
3741he's about as 1 as 1 can get
3742the guy from breaking bad
3743the ultimate 1
3744lol
3745l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3746oh yeah you told me to check that out
3747Evo03/14/2019
3748i think you act competency security wise and expansive anger wise
3749this makes sense
3750plus not triple reactive anymore lol
3751l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3752i think i almost hit that point with the physics professor who told me i did problems wrong when i had the right answers before i was like (i need to pass this class to graduate) and pulled it back in after i started to yell
3753Evo03/14/2019
3754yea
3755wew
3756yea you know how you're
3757preemptive about security
3758well 1s are preemptive about anger
3759in a similar way
3760you seem like your anger is more based on like the situation
37618s re pretty situational about things in general
3762l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3763OH THAT actually makes total sense for it bc i learned to pull it back in for security reasons
3764Evo03/14/2019
3765ah
3766yes
3767okay so
3768i'll leave it open one more day
3769l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3770sounds good
3771Evo03/14/2019
3772and then prompt you for you conclusion tomorrow
3773:3
3774l'appel du vide03/14/2019
3775sounds good :catwave:
3776Evo03/14/2019
3777:waves:
3778Evo03/17/2019
3779After all the input, what would you like this logged as @l'appel du vide ?
3780l'appel du vide03/17/2019
37814w5/5w6/8w9
3782Evo03/17/2019
3783okie :3