TaVvRC3f

18 23 01:12:48 <golgi>	big penis
28 23 01:12:57 <golgi>	long discussion where i get sentimental
38 23 01:13:21 <golgi>	and then i make some anime oppai joke and suddenly Jimmyoshi appears
48 23 01:13:36 <golgi>	just summed up my interactions with savespam
58 23 01:13:45 <Jimmyoshi>	wow
68 23 01:15:11 <golgi>	man
78 23 01:15:36 <golgi>	jen texted me like 10 times this morning and i had no time to respond and then i finally did and i was like
88 23 01:15:41 <golgi>	"are you that desperate to see me"
98 23 01:15:46 <golgi>	and then she was like
108 23 01:15:51 <golgi>	"more like the other way around"
118 23 01:15:57 <golgi>	"So when R U coming to see me?"
128 23 01:16:25 <golgi>	so i had to take time out of my busy schedule to visit her for ten minutes because then i had to go to work
138 23 01:16:50 <Jimmyoshi>	wtf
148 23 01:16:59 <golgi>	i have to meet up with my other friend tomorrow afternoon and i kind of hope jen sees us hanging out so i can ask her if she's jealous
158 23 01:17:02 <Jimmyoshi>	you went to visit her...
168 23 01:17:06 <Jimmyoshi>	just for 10 minutes??
178 23 01:17:16 <golgi>	she was in the library
188 23 01:17:23 <Jimmyoshi>	o
198 23 01:17:24 <Jimmyoshi>	oh right
208 23 01:17:24 <golgi>	well i had to get my bike and ride it and it was kind of on the way
218 23 01:17:26 <Jimmyoshi>	you're back in school
228 23 01:17:29 <Jimmyoshi>	I keep forgetting
238 23 01:17:49 <golgi>	dude i figured it out
248 23 01:17:53 <golgi>	messing with girls is so fun
258 23 01:18:01 <Jimmyoshi>	wtf hahahah
268 23 01:18:24 <golgi>	like i keep being "mean" to one of my coworkers
278 23 01:18:28 <golgi>	who insisted she was gay
288 23 01:18:37 <golgi>	but she would always visit me in my department
298 23 01:18:51 <golgi>	and then because i cut one day of the week she kept being like
308 23 01:18:55 <golgi>	sherwyn we aren't friends anymore
318 23 01:19:10 *	pedipanol has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
328 23 01:19:23 <golgi>	and then i was being an ironic inspbj like my site
338 23 01:19:25 <golgi>	to her
348 23 01:19:32 <golgi>	but it was super obvious
358 23 01:19:34 <golgi>	i was like
368 23 01:19:36 <golgi>	you see 
378 23 01:19:38 <golgi>	us mean people
388 23 01:19:39 <golgi>	we are the same
398 23 01:19:43 <golgi>	we are both mean
408 23 01:19:44 <golgi>	but really
418 23 01:19:45 <golgi>	we care
428 23 01:19:47 <golgi>	deep down
438 23 01:19:48 <golgi>	lol idk
448 23 01:19:51 <golgi>	i like spiraled off
458 23 01:20:00 <golgi>	yesterday
468 23 01:20:14 <golgi>	and then today she just comes to my aisle and gives me a hug for no reason
478 23 01:20:22 <Jimmyoshi>	wtf lol
488 23 01:20:28 <brkman3>	"ironic inspbj" inspirational blowjob?
498 23 01:20:35 <golgi>	dude i'm going to get out of being a betamax
508 23 01:21:04 <golgi>	https://botb.club/~golgi/inspbj/
518 23 01:21:06 <golgi>	the best website
528 23 01:21:14 <golgi>	i'll just put this on my resume
538 23 01:21:16 <golgi>	dude hahah
548 23 01:21:19 <golgi>	my resume is so fucked
558 23 01:21:22 <golgi>	if i make it
568 23 01:21:29 <golgi>	the only nontrivial things i've done are shit like this
578 23 01:21:30 <golgi>	and aqua
588 23 01:21:30 <brkman3>	playing video games makes me depressed
598 23 01:21:41 <golgi>	dude like we have to get off the internet
608 23 01:21:44 <golgi>	we should break savespam
618 23 01:21:48 <brkman3>	and hurts my hands
628 23 01:22:05 <golgi>	i think we should like all just stop going on botb, irc, savespam, internet communities
638 23 01:22:17 <brkman3>	ah, i remember this website
648 23 01:22:21 <golgi>	i've never been in reality dude
658 23 01:22:22 <brkman3>	but what does the bj part mean?
668 23 01:22:31 <golgi>	inspirational blowjob
678 23 01:22:32 <golgi>	hahaha
688 23 01:22:35 <golgi>	that's literally what it is
698 23 01:23:01 <golgi>	man like the first half of my life i was in jehovah's witness hell and then i like transitioned straight into internet hell
708 23 01:23:01 <brkman3>	oh, cool
718 23 01:23:14 <golgi>	i mean i was so fascinated by internet communities because i was like
728 23 01:23:18 <golgi>	finally i can learn about cool shit
738 23 01:23:28 <golgi>	but as you get more into it, it's not the communities
748 23 01:23:29 <brkman3>	yeah, reality is where it's at
758 23 01:23:37 <golgi>	and most of them suck
768 23 01:23:46 <golgi>	i want to be in reality for once
778 23 01:23:58 <golgi>	i mean wtf
788 23 01:24:02 <golgi>	i'm gonna die in 60 years
798 23 01:24:06 <golgi>	or w/e
808 23 01:24:10 <golgi>	i'm not a disposable piece of shit
818 23 01:24:20 <brkman3>	this website is making me want to punch a hole through my screen
828 23 01:24:23 *	brkman3 ctrl+w
838 23 01:24:43 <charlotte>	golgi, you are going to come back ten years from now speaking about irl hell too
848 23 01:24:52 <golgi>	i don't want to be replaceable like every tool, selfserving jew, slut, mogul, king, whore, hedge fund manager
858 23 01:24:52 <charlotte>	everything in za warudo is worthless
868 23 01:25:17 <golgi>	all of these people exist and then just die off
878 23 01:25:21 <golgi>	just pawns
888 23 01:25:28 <brkman3>	lol, i like when people try to discourage others from getting out of their specific shithole
898 23 01:25:29 <charlotte>	you will go to the place where all the cool pyramids are, go "cool pyramids. that took 1000 years to build" and then just get really depressed
908 23 01:25:43 <golgi>	dude that shit amazes me
918 23 01:25:48 <golgi>	like 
928 23 01:25:53 <brkman3>	stop trying to bring people down man
938 23 01:25:56 <golgi>	haha do you know how i started trying to get involved irl more in the first place
948 23 01:26:08 <charlotte>	how'd u do it
958 23 01:26:10 <golgi>	i was like pretty depressed after i got back from india in 2014~2015
968 23 01:26:12 <brkman3>	at least let it happen in it's time instead of trying to predict and prescribe shit
978 23 01:26:15 <golgi>	because i legit had a lot of fun
988 23 01:26:21 <golgi>	it was in a controlled environment to an extent
998 23 01:26:26 <golgi>	but i was like missing it
1008 23 01:26:29 <golgi>	and then i like
1018 23 01:26:31 <golgi>	got into anime
1028 23 01:26:33 <golgi>	weeaboo
1038 23 01:26:35 <golgi>	and i was like
1048 23 01:26:36 <golgi>	wtf 
1058 23 01:26:39 <charlotte>	haha
1068 23 01:26:41 <golgi>	all these anime girls are having fun
1078 23 01:26:44 <golgi>	why can't i have fun too
1088 23 01:26:56 <golgi>	well you don't see anime girls on the internet all day
1098 23 01:26:59 <golgi>	kirino is a piece of shit
1108 23 01:27:00 <charlotte>	there might be more to ethnostatism than u thnk
1118 23 01:27:19 <brkman3>	yeah, anime fun really inspires me to want to get out and have that too
1128 23 01:27:22 <golgi>	so i was like shit i'll just start talking to people
1138 23 01:27:33 <charlotte>	teh indians are your people, everyone looks more like you than america, you get to live in an environment that your body is trained to exist in, cultural norms you have adapted yourself around
1148 23 01:27:34 <golgi>	and pretty soon people were just randomly inviting me to shit
1158 23 01:27:36 <brkman3>	you know charlotte, did you know that there are people who actually enjoy life?
1168 23 01:27:43 <golgi>	i do not like indian culture haha
1178 23 01:27:46 <charlotte>	hee
1188 23 01:27:47 <golgi>	to an extent i've kinda disowned it
1198 23 01:27:56 <golgi>	i do say i'm indian anyway tho
1208 23 01:28:00 <golgi>	because i don't want to lie to myself
1218 23 01:28:06 <golgi>	but i don't associate myself with the culture
1228 23 01:28:06 <brkman3>	and they're not all dumb clueless ignorant people eithe
1238 23 01:28:07 <brkman3>	r
1248 23 01:28:20 <charlotte>	i'm sure there are people that manage to find their way out of the abyss, yeah
1258 23 01:28:25 <brkman3>	man, you remind me so much of that sweeeeeet girrrrl in the netherlaaaaaands
1268 23 01:28:39 <charlotte>	just saying that it exists, there isn't some inherent sacred domain u have to find
1278 23 01:28:40 <brkman3>	there are people who don't even get as deep into the abyss
1288 23 01:28:48 <golgi>	codename: yuki "Slimeball "aka Dennis" from the Netherlands" chan
1298 23 01:28:53 <brkman3>	everyone has their own inherent sacred domain
1308 23 01:29:11 <golgi>	idk what my sacred domain is
1318 23 01:29:20 <brkman3>	i'm just bsing
1328 23 01:29:28 <brkman3>	i don't know if that's actually true
1338 23 01:29:39 <brkman3>	but i have to say something to counter the negative vibrations
1348 23 01:29:43 <golgi>	i guess i come here and act like some proselyte and dump whatever stream of conscioussness thoughts i was thinking about all day
1358 23 01:29:59 <golgi>	but yea like
1368 23 01:30:01 <charlotte>	neg vibrations is reacting to sacredness violation i think
1378 23 01:30:07 <golgi>	i really have never experienced reality
1388 23 01:30:13 <charlotte>	i mean, the idea of it
1398 23 01:30:14 <golgi>	i'm spoiled as hell
1408 23 01:30:23 <golgi>	honestly like
1418 23 01:30:28 <brkman3>	sacredness violation is negative vibrations
1428 23 01:30:28 <charlotte>	taht someone is pouring out Neg Vibrations
1438 23 01:30:29 <golgi>	[01:25:29] <charlotte> you will go to the place where all the cool pyramids are, go "cool pyramids. that took 1000 years to build" and then just get really depressed
1448 23 01:30:34 <golgi>	shit like this kinda actually motivates me
1458 23 01:30:46 <golgi>	it's like man i want one of my works to be known 1000 years from now
1468 23 01:30:49 <golgi>	idc if my name is there
1478 23 01:30:51 <charlotte>	hehe
1488 23 01:30:52 <golgi>	names are arbitrary
1498 23 01:30:53 <charlotte>	yeah
1508 23 01:30:56 <charlotte>	thats partially why i compose
1518 23 01:30:58 <golgi>	i want my work to be known, whatever it is
1528 23 01:31:06 <charlotte>	and partially why im so maximalist about it
1538 23 01:31:12 <golgi>	it's egotistical but i'm only human, and so is every human to an extent
1548 23 01:31:26 <brkman3>	every human is only human, except mutants
1558 23 01:31:29 <golgi>	actually honestly like
1568 23 01:31:34 <golgi>	i act exactly the same on irc as i do irl
1578 23 01:31:44 <brkman3>	that's awesome
1588 23 01:31:44 <golgi>	you can ask a-zu-ra
1598 23 01:31:47 <brkman3>	i wish i could do that
1608 23 01:31:49 <golgi>	he pointed it out
1618 23 01:31:59 <charlotte>	oh, me too tbh
1628 23 01:32:10 <charlotte>	i talk about wanting to put music on objective numerical ratings irl too
1638 23 01:32:24 <golgi>	people literally draw my face when there's a "draw golgi" ohc
1648 23 01:32:27 <brkman3>	i wish i had big aspirations 
1658 23 01:33:01 <brkman3>	the sweeeet girrrrrl in the netherlaaaaaaands also disowned her native culture
1668 23 01:33:15 <brkman3>	i forgot to sa that when i mentioend you reminding me of her earlier
1678 23 01:33:15 <golgi>	well i don't go around shitting on india
1688 23 01:33:19 <charlotte>	are we talking about slimeball
1698 23 01:33:22 <brkman3>	neither does she, neither does she
1708 23 01:33:26 <brkman3>	no, charlotet, lol
1718 23 01:33:33 <golgi>	lol yea i was making a joke
1728 23 01:33:34 <brkman3>	i was talking about this girl i talk to 
1738 23 01:33:53 <golgi>	man like
1748 23 01:33:55 <brkman3>	she disowned black dutch culture
1758 23 01:34:01 <golgi>	as soon as i graduate uni i just wanna get out of california
1768 23 01:34:04 <brkman3>	it's not her thing. she's a huge weaboo
1778 23 01:34:06 <golgi>	just go to another country
1788 23 01:34:27 <Jimmyoshi>	california is honestly depressing
1798 23 01:34:33 <golgi>	i'll have a degree so i'll be employable
1808 23 01:34:37 <Jimmyoshi>	I don't get why so many fuckin people want to live here
1818 23 01:34:56 <brkman3>	they probably want to live there because they aren't the you who thinks it's depressing, lol
1828 23 01:35:02 <golgi>	sometimes people try to tell me how to make a lot of money or something
1838 23 01:35:08 <brkman3>	california is objectively depressing
1848 23 01:35:11 <golgi>	wtf go see the world
1858 23 01:35:27 <charlotte>	golgi i think theres something depressing about wanting to make a mark on the world a lot of the time
1868 23 01:35:34 <brkman3>	lol
1878 23 01:35:48 <charlotte>	people could probably make a great pyramid or like a sphynx in like two months now
1888 23 01:36:06 <brkman3>	;yt 10 types of haters
1898 23 01:36:07 <Sylphy>	(brkman3) 10 Types Of Haters - length 9m 11s - 3,139 likes, 47 dislikes (98.5%) - 92,478 views - LamontHoltTV on 2016.04.11 - http://youtu.be/PW1E8ddHNm8
1908 23 01:36:15 <FozruciX>	Title: 10 Types Of Haters - YouTube
1918 23 01:36:18 <charlotte>	the only thing u get from putting ur heart and soul into making something that fits ur ideal most beautiful thing is ppl way more advanced than you will laugh at how silly you are
1928 23 01:36:25 <charlotte>	in the future
1938 23 01:36:30 <brkman3>	stfu FozruciX you slow molASSes
1948 23 01:36:36 <charlotte>	and then someone will go "think of the historical context"
1958 23 01:36:43 <charlotte>	and ppl will go "shrug w/e" and move on
1968 23 01:36:50 <Jimmyoshi>	I don't think people laugh at the pyramids
1978 23 01:37:10 <golgi>	even if they do who cares, they're stupid
1988 23 01:37:17 <brkman3>	#depression
1998 23 01:37:21 <charlotte>	think of how much more impressive it would have been to have built any skyscraper in 2000bc lol
2008 23 01:37:25 <brkman3>	#theabyss
2018 23 01:37:36 <charlotte>	it is a superior achievement in nearly every way
2028 23 01:37:46 <brkman3>	lol, you're taking the pyramid thing very literally
2038 23 01:37:48 <brkman3>	lmao
2048 23 01:37:52 <brkman3>	looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooool
2058 23 01:38:00 <golgi>	what if they built a,,,time machine in egypt
2068 23 01:38:08 <charlotte>	holy shit...
2078 23 01:38:16 <charlotte>	btw my i key doesnt work very well i have to bash on it SUper hard
2088 23 01:38:16 <golgi>	in 2000 bc
2098 23 01:38:17 <brkman3>	regume prosthelyte
2108 23 01:38:20 <regume-chan>	Golgi i have a crush on twilight princess link.
2118 23 01:38:29 <brkman3>	regume proselyte
2128 23 01:38:30 <Jimmyoshi>	whoa
2138 23 01:38:32 <regume-chan>	Is it okay if i come here and act like some proselyte and dump whatever stream of consciousness and edited each others shit.
2148 23 01:38:41 <charlotte>	golgi yeah lol
2158 23 01:38:59 <charlotte>	sometimes i think people are just super excited about... the top 1% of any given anything
2168 23 01:39:04 <golgi>	shit like the pyramids was honestly somewhat of a precursor to modern architecture tho
2178 23 01:39:09 <charlotte>	without comparing those things
2188 23 01:39:16 <Jimmyoshi>	tbh I don't like the idea of feeling obligated to *owe* the world anything
2198 23 01:39:19 <charlotte>	like cave paintings are the top 1% achievement of cavemen or w/e
2208 23 01:39:24 <Jimmyoshi>	but the idea of leaving a cool mark on the world does sound appealing
2218 23 01:39:26 <brkman3>	i'm excited about the shaggs
2228 23 01:39:36 <charlotte>	ppl are like wow, so cool. literally tho, u can just do that urself in 10 minutes
2238 23 01:39:36 <brkman3>	define "people"
2248 23 01:39:36 <golgi>	Jimmyoshi, well i for one am not just some animal
2258 23 01:39:44 <golgi>	i want one last thing to deny
2268 23 01:39:55 <brkman3>	charlotte: that's pretty litereally and objectively incorrect
2278 23 01:39:59 <golgi>	i wanted to be above biology first but i realized i'm not
2288 23 01:40:08 <brkman3>	depending on how you define "people" and "super excited"
2298 23 01:40:11 <Jimmyoshi>	all humans are animals
2308 23 01:40:15 <charlotte>	impressive things to me are stuff that i can't imagine anyone else being able to replicate
2318 23 01:40:33 <brkman3>	i thnk by people you mean "I"
2328 23 01:40:37 <charlotte>	shrug
2338 23 01:40:47 <charlotte>	if i could replicate it then someone else could, right? lokl
2348 23 01:40:50 <Jimmyoshi>	sure we're a lot smarter and have more potential than any other animal
2358 23 01:40:54 <Jimmyoshi>	and we've achieved a lot more
2368 23 01:40:57 <Jimmyoshi>	but at the end of the day
2378 23 01:41:00 <Jimmyoshi>	we're still animals
2388 23 01:41:01 <brkman3>	i mean, there are people who are super excited about some obscure crappy indie band
2398 23 01:41:07 <golgi>	charlotte, but that's like super subjective
2408 23 01:41:08 <brkman3>	they're certainly not the top 1% of anything, lol
2418 23 01:41:09 <golgi>	lol
2428 23 01:41:27 <golgi>	i mean i'm sure in 100 years a lot of things that we thought were impossible to replicate now might be trivial
2438 23 01:41:34 <charlotte>	yeah
2448 23 01:41:42 <charlotte>	and what is trivial would then suck
2458 23 01:41:55 <brkman3>	yeah but you've got 100 years of awesome
2468 23 01:41:56 <charlotte>	strong AI is going to obsolete every human thing ever made
2478 23 01:41:58 <brkman3>	before then
2488 23 01:41:59 <brkman3>	:D
2498 23 01:42:07 <golgi>	and ability to be replicated is like    
2508 23 01:42:08 <brkman3>	that's nothing to sniff at
2518 23 01:42:37 <brkman3>	who even still watches silent films unironically
2528 23 01:42:50 <charlotte>	art is already worthless the monment it is created online, because it can be copied and repeated endlessly
2538 23 01:42:54 <golgi>	i mean i could just make a script that splices together pieces of a set of wav samples i have in a random and haphazard fashion and pitch them at random frequencies and say wow this is so hard to replicate because it's random
2548 23 01:43:13 <golgi>	maybe you would get behind that though
2558 23 01:43:15 <brkman3>	but yet people still find worth in it, and enjoy it
2568 23 01:43:16 <charlotte>	think of how much important the hammerklavier sonata was when u could only ever hear from the fingers of like 3 pianists
2578 23 01:43:39 <brkman3>	and there are still people who pay for it on principle because they find it worth something
2588 23 01:43:43 <charlotte>	the only important thing in art now is the moment of its inception; a big bang that fizzles out to nothing the moment it is put online
2598 23 01:44:09 <golgi>	then why do you put your music online
2608 23 01:44:11 <brkman3>	lol, this is complete bs, though. Doesn't the ability for people to enjoy it bring it worth?
2618 23 01:44:15 <charlotte>	desperation
2628 23 01:44:28 <Jimmyoshi>	I strongly disagree with making art and not showing anyone
2638 23 01:44:30 <brkman3>	does people enjoying something not make it unworthless?
2648 23 01:44:31 <golgi>	or do you really have a master set of tunes superior to everything you actually release and your actual music is a cruel parody of the online music community
2658 23 01:44:35 <charlotte>	hehehe
2668 23 01:44:37 <charlotte>	i might do tbh
2678 23 01:44:42 <brkman3>	like, this makes no sense at all
2688 23 01:44:50 <golgi>	you said desperation before i made my outrageous proposition
2698 23 01:44:59 <charlotte>	yeah, i saw it coming
2708 23 01:45:19 <charlotte>	zanzan has a more mystical approach than i do, he creates and deletes entire albums
2718 23 01:45:30 <Jimmyoshi>	what a waste
2728 23 01:45:32 <golgi>	i think that just makes you yet even more replaceable
2738 23 01:45:34 <brkman3>	rip
2748 23 01:45:43 <charlotte>	ehh.
2758 23 01:45:46 <charlotte>	sand mandalas are a waste too
2768 23 01:45:50 <brkman3>	"my art is worthless so i'm goingto delete it"
2778 23 01:46:14 <brkman3>	meanwhile, dozens of people are listening to it over and over on their mp3 players once every blue moon
2788 23 01:46:14 <charlotte>	well, the act of creating/conceiving it wasn't worthless
2798 23 01:46:25 <golgi>	i think it will be really difficult to exist in reality soon
2808 23 01:46:31 <charlotte>	just putting it online. i suppose u could say that the impact of listening to something novel has value
2818 23 01:46:31 <golgi>	the internet and real life is starting to mesh
2828 23 01:46:32 <brkman3>	that's some bs rightthere, man
2838 23 01:46:36 <golgi>	from my perspective
2848 23 01:46:43 <charlotte>	but zanzan doesnt rly care about others
2858 23 01:46:49 <golgi>	the mainstream population talks about the internet
2868 23 01:46:54 <golgi>	the internet has become a social sphere
2878 23 01:46:58 <golgi>	instead of an informational sphere
2888 23 01:47:00 <charlotte>	once he's understood his art there is nothing more to be gained
2898 23 01:47:01 <brkman3>	i'm so glad he does have albums online that he hasn't deleted
2908 23 01:47:11 <Jimmyoshi>	ok like sure, I can get doing some things solely for practice so you get the benefit of conceiving it but not satisfied enough with it to show anyone
2918 23 01:47:14 <golgi>	so zanzan is just another replaceable pawn
2928 23 01:47:21 <Jimmyoshi>	like little random throwaway things that didn't take too much time
2938 23 01:47:22 <Jimmyoshi>	but like
2948 23 01:47:29 <Jimmyoshi>	if you put a lot of time and effort into creating something
2958 23 01:47:34 <Jimmyoshi>	and then just not show it to anyone
2968 23 01:47:39 <Jimmyoshi>	I consider that a huge fucking waste
2978 23 01:47:48 <golgi>	you will do this if you are a true narcissist
2988 23 01:47:54 <charlotte>	oh, i understand him. it feels gross having everything you say and do put online
2998 23 01:48:03 <charlotte>	just writhing there like a mass of dead husks
3008 23 01:48:10 <charlotte>	the great online refuse pit
3018 23 01:48:17 <brkman3>	i mean, if they're narcissociopsychopathic and don't care about anyone, can't really blame them
3028 23 01:48:21 <golgi>	then why not just release it in real life?
3038 23 01:48:28 <charlotte>	#neetlyfe
3048 23 01:48:33 <brkman3>	lol how do you release it in real life?
3058 23 01:48:37 <Jimmyoshi>	release it once and delete it forever after that
3068 23 01:48:40 <golgi>	not releasing is one thing but releasing and then deleting hahahaha
3078 23 01:48:49 <brkman3>	blast it on an stereo for a nhour?
3088 23 01:48:58 <charlotte>	well, he writes it and then deletes a lot of works hah
3098 23 01:49:02 <golgi>	you know honestly
3108 23 01:49:12 <golgi>	the creative arts are pretty replaceable themselves
3118 23 01:49:21 <golgi>	there's a reason why it's so hard to get an actual job in it
3128 23 01:49:28 <brkman3>	blowjobs from 1905 to 1930 look surprisingly similar to blowjobs in modern times
3138 23 01:49:35 <golgi>	everyone is trying to be the next hit artist
3148 23 01:49:35 <charlotte>	the spark of imagination, the synthesising of disparate emotional elements is the thing that is valuable
3158 23 01:49:53 <brkman3>	so
3168 23 01:50:07 <golgi>	do you vibe with zanzan's music because he is a fellow neet?
3178 23 01:50:10 <brkman3>	other people enjoying it over and over is worthless
3188 23 01:50:12 <golgi>	and you feel it?
3198 23 01:50:14 <golgi>	in the music?
3208 23 01:50:26 <brkman3>	there's no value in the enjoyment of the audience
3218 23 01:50:35 <charlotte>	but once its online the work is dead; no mystery there. unless it is an inexhaustible work, providing new insights on listening
3228 23 01:50:42 <charlotte>	but thats for an audience, not the composer
3238 23 01:50:53 <charlotte>	the composer understands the work, haha
3248 23 01:50:59 <charlotte>	unless they are naive in writing it
3258 23 01:51:11 <brkman3>	lol, it's "online" is this mystical existential entity
3268 23 01:51:27 <brkman3>	online is galactus
3278 23 01:51:31 <brkman3>	this is very fascinating
3288 23 01:51:43 <charlotte>	the online is important; its a place where the art can be copied infinitely and instantly
3298 23 01:51:53 <charlotte>	making it infinitely trivial
3308 23 01:51:54 <brkman3>	man, you'd be screwed if mozart was around
3318 23 01:52:11 <brkman3>	he could take one listen and then copy it down
3328 23 01:52:14 <brkman3>	rip
3338 23 01:52:19 <golgi>	charlotte, i completely understand your logic
3348 23 01:52:26 <golgi>	it only makes art itself more meaningless
3358 23 01:52:28 <brkman3>	never let mozart listen to your music
3368 23 01:52:55 <charlotte>	yeah. art is now no more mysterious than the parts or ingenuity used to construct it
3378 23 01:53:08 <brkman3>	was it ever?
3388 23 01:53:09 <golgi>	well i meant
3398 23 01:53:12 <golgi>	your point in general
3408 23 01:53:13 <brkman3>	was it ever more mysterious than that?
3418 23 01:53:20 <charlotte>	there is no narrative except "offered as a sacrifice to the internet rubbish pile and billions of rubbish pile scavengers"
3428 23 01:53:26 <brkman3>	just because it couldn't be "copied"?
3438 23 01:53:35 <charlotte>	well, sure. consider live concerts
3448 23 01:53:53 <charlotte>	there is mystery to chopin giving tiny secluded gigs in his house and at no other time
3458 23 01:54:13 <brkman3>	live concerts, everybody carries a little copy of it in their heads
3468 23 01:54:20 <brkman3>	everyone who attended
3478 23 01:54:31 <brkman3>	sure it's not infinite copies
3488 23 01:54:38 <charlotte>	sure. but it's an imperfect memory, personalised for each person, and non-transferrable to others
3498 23 01:55:03 <brkman3>	art having the potential to be copied infinitely doesn't mean that it will be copied infinitely
3508 23 01:55:07 <charlotte>	it mutates inside the people. copies of files don't mutate on the internet; an mp3 is an mp3 is an mp3
3518 23 01:55:11 <brkman3>	chances are it's still going to be obscure
3528 23 01:55:28 <brkman3>	copies of files maybe don't mutate on the internet, but within the mind of the listener, the music contained in those files still does
3538 23 01:55:47 <brkman3>	even if they listen to it over and over again
3548 23 01:55:51 <golgi>	do you see why the internet is not the answer to overcoming reality?
3558 23 01:55:54 <brkman3>	once they've stopped listening
3568 23 01:55:58 <charlotte>	if you made all those concertgoers shut up and not describe the concert to eachother, it having happened as a strange dream that each participant had no assurance if it was even real
3578 23 01:55:59 <brkman3>	the mutation occurs
3588 23 01:56:03 <charlotte>	that would make it even more mysterious
3598 23 01:56:35 <brkman3>	hmmm... i mean i guess i see where you're coming from
3608 23 01:56:46 <brkman3>	but i guess i just don't really put as much value into the "mystery" of something
3618 23 01:56:53 <brkman3>	as i do in the act of experiencing it
3628 23 01:57:16 <brkman3>	i guess coming from a non-creator standpoint
3638 23 01:57:17 <charlotte>	think of how spiritually lifeless it would feel putting that mystery dream (?) gig up on fucking, youtube
3648 23 01:57:33 <charlotte>	you know it is real, you know exactly what it is, and where it does everything. tedious
3658 23 01:57:47 <charlotte>	it is no more sparkling than any other object that you are 100% certain exists
3668 23 01:58:11 <brkman3>	i mean, eventually the memory of the mystery dream gig is going to fade away in your mind anyway
3678 23 01:58:11 <charlotte>	and have constant reassurance of, or an easy way to have constant reassurance of, every day. just look it up on youtube
3688 23 01:58:21 <charlotte>	we even have an address of it for you. it's at ____ ___ ____
3698 23 01:58:29 <brkman3>	the significance it once held will be forgotten and obsoleted by new experiences that push it out
3708 23 01:59:11 <brkman3>	and seeing a video of it on youtube, as the person who was there at the mystery dream gig... you know that the video does not do it justice at all
3718 23 01:59:20 <golgi>	yea this only makes art more meaningless than it already is
3728 23 01:59:32 <charlotte>	i wont pretend to know why i like zanzan; a lot of it is his music, a lot of it his philosophy and outlook
3738 23 01:59:50 <brkman3>	man, i must be a moron or something
3748 23 01:59:51 <charlotte>	there is a heroism about him, trying to maintain a sort of artist's dignity in the age of online
3758 23 02:00:19 <brkman3>	i hate when i don't quite get the significance of the point of view of a very very smart person
3768 23 02:00:31 <brkman3>	so i'm just gonna go fuck off, goodnight, lol
3778 23 02:00:37 <brkman3>	there'sobviously something wrong with me
3788 23 02:00:43 <Jimmyoshi>	nah, you're fine
3798 23 02:00:46 <brkman3>	nah
3808 23 02:00:54 <brkman3>	golgi gets it, and he is smart, so that makes me dumb
3818 23 02:01:03 <charlotte>	that it's ok to just try to rot the wires of the internet, hissing in its backstreets instead of offering his every treasure like a desperate courtesan
3828 23 02:01:07 <charlotte>	like everyone else does
3838 23 02:01:27 <golgi>	charlotte, to an extent it's like you agree and disagree with me at the same time
3848 23 02:01:30 <golgi>	haha
3858 23 02:01:31 <brkman3>	lol artist's integrity
3868 23 02:01:43 <brkman3>	the legendary myth
3878 23 02:01:43 <golgi>	or i think even
3888 23 02:01:47 <golgi>	you fully agree with me
3898 23 02:01:54 <golgi>	just putting a different pov on my general idea
3908 23 02:02:03 <charlotte>	i could be
3918 23 02:02:05 <golgi>	that the social internet sphere is bastardizing real life
3928 23 02:02:05 <Jimmyoshi>	I don't think that art is meaningless
3938 23 02:02:06 <Jimmyoshi>	at all
3948 23 02:02:39 <golgi>	in that experiencing art is very trivialized now that "anyone" can do it
3958 23 02:02:47 <golgi>	because it's all online
3968 23 02:02:50 <brkman3>	fucking hipsters
3978 23 02:02:53 <golgi>	and "anyone" can "enjoy it"
3988 23 02:03:17 <charlotte>	the inception of the art itself is still valuable; not everyone can do that of course
3998 23 02:03:21 <brkman3>	it's because the art you make isn't real
4008 23 02:03:25 <golgi>	i can't be sitting here pretending to know shit about real life because i've never lived in it, but this is what i think
4018 23 02:03:27 <brkman3>	it's made on fake instruments that you can't play
4028 23 02:03:32 <charlotte>	but listening to it, performing it, relaying it to others
4038 23 02:03:35 <charlotte>	all completely worthless
4048 23 02:03:38 <Jimmyoshi>	sharing it is just as valuable
4058 23 02:03:48 <brkman3>	how is it worthless?
4068 23 02:03:56 <brkman3>	what exactly makes those things worthless?
4078 23 02:04:03 <brkman3>	do you mean just worthless to you personally?
4088 23 02:04:16 <golgi>	as in, all those activities have nothing to do with the actual creation process?
4098 23 02:04:22 <golgi>	and they are just mere copies?
4108 23 02:04:39 <golgi>	and formalities
4118 23 02:04:46 <brkman3>	the creation process is the most insignificant part, imo
4128 23 02:04:59 <golgi>	as much as i've been preachy here about this, this kind of happens to me
4138 23 02:05:06 <Jimmyoshi>	a piece of music can potentially create a spark of inspiration in another musician who listens to it
4148 23 02:05:12 <Jimmyoshi>	stimulating their creation process as well
4158 23 02:05:14 <Jimmyoshi>	so I ask
4168 23 02:05:18 <Jimmyoshi>	how is sharing it worthless?
4178 23 02:05:20 <brkman3>	it doesn't matter, jimmy
4188 23 02:05:21 <golgi>	i just imagine some song in my head and then never try to actualize it
4198 23 02:05:26 <brkman3>	other people are non-important
4208 23 02:05:57 <brkman3>	stimulating someone else's creation process is ultimately meaningless
4218 23 02:06:07 <golgi>	Jimmyoshi, you have to consider the person who is self-servient
4228 23 02:06:10 <brkman3>	all you're doing is poisoning their self-expression
4238 23 02:06:23 <Jimmyoshi>	and even disregarding sharing it to other musicians, I think there's value in sharing it to the average joe as well
4248 23 02:06:36 <golgi>	[02:05:21] <golgi> i just imagine some song in my head and then never try to actualize it
4258 23 02:06:36 <brkman3>	well, no. if i think of it as like making a guitar hero hart
4268 23 02:06:38 <brkman3>	chart
4278 23 02:06:41 <golgi>	but anyone can do this
4288 23 02:06:50 <golgi>	the abstract musical ideas i have in my head are trivial
4298 23 02:06:53 <brkman3>	there is definitely a strong connection that is felt during the process
4308 23 02:06:55 <golgi>	replaceable
4318 23 02:06:58 <Jimmyoshi>	the piece expresses emotions that the listener can feel themself
4328 23 02:07:04 <brkman3>	that is lost after it is completed and put on the internet
4338 23 02:07:13 <Jimmyoshi>	don'tyou think being able to trigger that sort of response in somebody is valuable?
4348 23 02:07:18 <brkman3>	it's just.... okay... i'm done... here it is... i'll forget about this now
4358 23 02:07:24 <Jimmyoshi>	I mean sure maybe it doesn't matter in the """grand scheme of things"""
4368 23 02:07:25 <charlotte>	eugh. music is informed by more than just its "pure content" tho; it has context
4378 23 02:07:26 <Jimmyoshi>	but still
4388 23 02:07:39 <golgi>	making it into a real thing is a cool thing to learn to do
4398 23 02:07:47 <Jimmyoshi>	you could argue that everything is worthless anyway
4408 23 02:07:48 <brkman3>	conversely
4418 23 02:07:53 <charlotte>	i don't know. there is hardly any sentiment in linking someone a youtube video is there
4428 23 02:08:06 <Jimmyoshi>	after all, the sun will become a red giant and engulf the earth in 5 billion years, destroying all of humanity
4438 23 02:08:07 <brkman3>	music is informed by more than just its context tho; it has "pure content"
4448 23 02:08:07 <golgi>	but in charlotte's theory, the most valuable aspect is the abstract idea in your head
4458 23 02:08:08 <charlotte>	it is the sterile, abstract form of it. not wholly abstract, but if we could get there, we would
4468 23 02:08:11 <Jimmyoshi>	so why bother with anything, right?!?!?!!??
4478 23 02:08:17 <golgi>	haha
4488 23 02:08:23 <golgi>	we said the same thing at the same time
4498 23 02:08:23 <charlotte>	lol i'm not saying that
4508 23 02:08:35 <charlotte>	just that permanence bothers me
4518 23 02:08:48 <golgi>	this is where i part ways with you
4528 23 02:08:57 <charlotte>	nothing is fleeting. everything online blurs together into one horrible mushy present
4538 23 02:08:59 <Jimmyoshi>	well don't worry charlotte, humanity will be dead in 5 billion years anyway
4548 23 02:09:04 <Jimmyoshi>	so who cares, no permanence there ;)))
4558 23 02:09:17 <charlotte>	thats cool, but i want to be alive to appreciate the lack of permanence lol
4568 23 02:09:30 <brkman3>	so you have permanencephobia
4578 23 02:09:35 <Jimmyoshi>	god this is so depressing lol
4588 23 02:09:35 <brkman3>	that explains a lot
4598 23 02:09:45 <charlotte>	maybe i can say fuckings to online data and online art and just be in awe of my own skin cells rotting and growing
4608 23 02:09:49 <brkman3>	it's not depressing Jimmyoshi, because it's objectively untrue, lol
4618 23 02:10:00 <golgi>	i am not going to be yet another replaceable, selfish, narcopathic entity in this population saturated with such beings
4628 23 02:10:02 <Jimmyoshi>	I hope I never end up having this mindset
4638 23 02:10:20 <brkman3>	this is a deeply personal thing
4648 23 02:10:28 <brkman3>	that is not universally applicable at all
4658 23 02:10:37 <charlotte>	you'd be wrong, but okay
4668 23 02:10:39 <golgi>	because the ideas get so abstract, we can just generalize them all, rendering art meaningless
4678 23 02:11:13 <Jimmyoshi>	all art is Things
4688 23 02:11:14 <golgi>	because the point of it was self expression and bringing something cool to the table in the first place
4698 23 02:11:15 <Jimmyoshi>	game over
4708 23 02:11:46 <golgi>	but if we take this abstract point of view, we have basically gotten rid of any meaning in art
4718 23 02:11:49 <brkman3>	nothing is universally subjectively meaningless
4728 23 02:12:01 <charlotte>	even if i make a table or a statue, it'll look different in two years
4738 23 02:12:14 <brkman3>	hmmmm...
4748 23 02:12:15 <golgi>	the mind plays tricks
4758 23 02:12:23 <golgi>	sometimes you can listen to a song at one point in time
4768 23 02:12:24 <charlotte>	my shitty retard ohbs sound exactly the same now as they did back then and it drives me nuts
4778 23 02:12:25 <brkman3>	have you ever considered the impermanence of permanence?
4788 23 02:12:26 <golgi>	and then not like it
4798 23 02:12:35 <golgi>	and then listen to it a year later
4808 23 02:12:37 <golgi>	and somehow like it
4818 23 02:12:40 <golgi>	or vice versa
4828 23 02:12:58 <brkman3>	like what you were saying about the pyramids
4838 23 02:13:01 <golgi>	also charlotte that analysis is false in the first place
4848 23 02:13:09 <golgi>	even besides what i said
4858 23 02:13:13 <golgi>	it really isn't exactly the same
4868 23 02:13:21 <charlotte>	because people change? shrug
4878 23 02:13:21 <golgi>	there are too many external variables that would change it
4888 23 02:13:28 <golgi>	besides people changing
4898 23 02:13:44 <golgi>	change it, meaning the wave data
4908 23 02:13:56 <charlotte>	anyway i don't know what this argument was about. i was defending zanzan's view of it, not some hypothetical altruist
4918 23 02:13:56 <golgi>	the wave itself isn't changing
4928 23 02:14:11 <charlotte>	there is meaning in giving music to other people
4938 23 02:14:21 <golgi>	well i thought this was a good discussion
4948 23 02:14:21 <brkman3>	wow
4958 23 02:14:30 <golgi>	it supported a lot of my hunches
4968 23 02:14:35 <brkman3>	someone please kill me
4978 23 02:14:37 <golgi>	i have never discussed any of this
4988 23 02:14:38 <charlotte>	what are your hunches
4998 23 02:14:39 <golgi>	ever
5008 23 02:15:05 <brkman3>	i'm sorry that i said mean things :(
5018 23 02:15:17 <golgi>	i have this feeling that we just made up the term subjectivity to describe things we don't understand
5028 23 02:15:17 <Jimmyoshi>	when did you say mean things?
5038 23 02:15:22 <golgi>	and in the end, everything is objective
5048 23 02:15:36 <charlotte>	sounds about right
5058 23 02:15:43 <Jimmyoshi>	I... actually agree
5068 23 02:15:44 <golgi>	of course a discussion isn't going to *prove* anything
5078 23 02:16:03 <golgi>	but it kind of supported it a bit more (this discussion)
5088 23 02:16:04 <brkman3>	I... don't get it, once again
5098 23 02:16:17 <charlotte>	humans are sort of pre-understanding
5108 23 02:16:19 <golgi>	what's your favourite colour?
5118 23 02:16:39 <brkman3>	ultra-violet
5128 23 02:16:49 <golgi>	why is it not the same as my favourite colour?
5138 23 02:16:55 <brkman3>	because it's mysterious
5148 23 02:17:02 <Jimmyoshi>	because you two have different brains
5158 23 02:17:03 <charlotte>	they don't understand teh truth of how everything has come to be, of which nothing can logically exist outside of, except in tiny abstractions
5168 23 02:17:18 <charlotte>	so at most they can only say this thing causes that thing
5178 23 02:17:22 <Jimmyoshi>	your brains do not follow the same set of deterministic processes
5188 23 02:17:29 <charlotte>	and have an asymptotically approaching 100% trust in it
5198 23 02:17:30 <brkman3>	what if i see my favorite color the same way you see yours
5208 23 02:17:35 <charlotte>	without understanding why it causes it
5218 23 02:17:37 <Jimmyoshi>	brkman3's favorite color algorithm returns ultra-violet
5228 23 02:17:39 <golgi>	i've thought about that though itself
5238 23 02:17:42 <Jimmyoshi>	but golgi's returns differently
5248 23 02:17:58 <brkman3>	hey charlotte, i truly apologize. i'm really sorry
5258 23 02:18:02 <charlotte>	its cool lol
5268 23 02:18:08 <golgi>	one thing i get frustrated is with these biologists
5278 23 02:18:09 <brkman3>	i misunderstood
5288 23 02:18:12 <golgi>	who don't get anything i'm saying
5298 23 02:18:17 <golgi>	even though they know so much biology
5308 23 02:18:18 <brkman3>	that you were arguing zanzan's point of view
5318 23 02:18:19 <golgi>	and i don't
5328 23 02:18:29 <golgi>	no one has answered my question i've been asking for three months
5338 23 02:18:30 <Jimmyoshi>	wait
5348 23 02:18:34 <golgi>	sufficiently
5358 23 02:18:36 <brkman3>	it makes a lot more sense in that context
5368 23 02:18:41 <Jimmyoshi>	so charlotte doesn't hold those beliefs?
5378 23 02:18:43 <charlotte>	biologists dont understand much either
5388 23 02:18:50 <golgi>	well my question was
5398 23 02:18:57 <charlotte>	they're the same as us really, they just develop routines
5408 23 02:19:27 <golgi>	what factors cause DNA transcription errors and would the same transcription errors result in the same mutation
5418 23 02:19:27 <charlotte>	a dumb person will pick things with outcomes they can only predict 50% or less of the time, a smart person 90% or more
5428 23 02:19:39 <golgi>	the answer to the second one is an obvious yes
5438 23 02:20:11 <golgi>	but showing this actually happening would make shit like large scale eugenics possible
5448 23 02:20:12 <golgi>	haha
5458 23 02:20:19 <charlotte>	lol yeah
5468 23 02:20:22 <Jimmyoshi>	well the 2nd one might require some extreme finetuning of the variables to replicate the same mutation
5478 23 02:20:27 <Jimmyoshi>	but idk for sure
5488 23 02:20:40 <golgi>	i said same
5498 23 02:20:41 <charlotte>	i dunno. smartness as a fuckton of narrowing down the millions of process -> result trees
5508 23 02:20:42 <brkman3>	i will cope by telling myself that now i understand why my questions were unanswered: because i was asking the wrong person
5518 23 02:20:44 <charlotte>	to try and find predictable ones
5528 23 02:20:48 <Jimmyoshi>	well if 100% the same then yeah
5538 23 02:20:59 <charlotte>	but even then there is no understanding
5548 23 02:21:02 <charlotte>	there is just predictability
5558 23 02:21:14 <charlotte>	if that predictable pattern is subverted, the person will not understand why
5568 23 02:21:15 <brkman3>	the milkman
5578 23 02:21:17 <brkman3>	the paperboy
5588 23 02:21:19 <brkman3>	and evening tv
5598 23 02:21:28 <golgi>	all i get from biologists is "it just happens" and "it's like when you mess up or something that like...also hjappens in dna lol"
5608 23 02:21:29 <charlotte>	and will scrabble for more predictable patterns, like an addicton
5618 23 02:21:38 <golgi>	if you gave that bullshit in math guess what you're going to hell
5628 23 02:21:49 <charlotte>	yeah lol, they wouldn't know; they're just looking for patterns
5638 23 02:21:58 <golgi>	maybe i should ask a chemist, or even just a straight up mathemtician
5648 23 02:22:03 <charlotte>	node donkus causes man to have feeling bonkus
5658 23 02:22:03 <golgi>	fuck it, i'll just ask unabomber
5668 23 02:22:05 <charlotte>	why? i dunno
5678 23 02:22:18 <charlotte>	also secretion bonkus seems to cause man to have feeling bonkus
5688 23 02:22:19 <brkman3>	regume bonkus
5698 23 02:22:22 <regume-chan>	Also secretion bonkus seems to have feeling bonkus.
5708 23 02:22:27 <golgi>	maybe in 2 years pug will be the person who can sufficiently answer me
5718 23 02:22:37 <charlotte>	u just amass enough of these that you develop what looks like understanding
5728 23 02:22:38 <Jimmyoshi>	what's he majoring in?
5738 23 02:22:38 <brkman3>	how's pug doing these days?
5748 23 02:22:39 <golgi>	and it will make a mockery of biology because he is a chemist
5758 23 02:22:44 <Jimmyoshi>	oh
5768 23 02:22:47 <charlotte>	but its not, its a theory that can be completely destroyed by anything at all
5778 23 02:23:06 <charlotte>	like an octopus predicting a president; it only seems real because it seems correlated
5788 23 02:23:17 <golgi>	dude i want to make this thing that can analyze a dna sample and literally simulate the organism that would be generated from it
5798 23 02:23:18 <charlotte>	and when it is not, it is not
5808 23 02:23:19 <brkman3>	;yt mimick octopus
5818 23 02:23:20 <Sylphy>	(brkman3) Most intelligent Mimic Octopus in the world - length 1m 49s - 20,532 likes, 296 dislikes (98.6%) - 5,522,025 views - FullKanal on 2010.11.04 - http://youtu.be/t-LTWFnGmeg
5828 23 02:23:32 <brkman3>	;yt mimic octopus stevensteven
5838 23 02:23:33 <Sylphy>	(brkman3) Octopus Pie Christmas Special 2013 - length 1m 18s - 56 likes, 1 dislike (98.2%) - 1,225 views - alpha omega on 2013.12.28 - http://youtu.be/tUWorgIxUvg
5848 23 02:23:35 <Jimmyoshi>	golgi whoa that'd be amazing
5858 23 02:23:39 <FozruciX>	Title: Octopus Pie Christmas Special 2013 - YouTube
5868 23 02:23:43 <golgi>	do you know how cool that shit would be
5878 23 02:23:45 <golgi>	not just cool
5888 23 02:23:47 <golgi>	so useful
5898 23 02:23:48 <brkman3>	man... i think stevensteven is the most obscure music project i have come across, haha
5908 23 02:23:53 <Jimmyoshi>	dude yes
5918 23 02:24:00 <brkman3>	i guess their videos are unlisted on youtube
5928 23 02:24:06 <Jimmyoshi>	but I think currently no one really understands how dna works lol
5938 23 02:24:14 <golgi>	i mean the demo frontend would just be some blender animation export or something but ofc that wouldn't be the real applications of it
5948 23 02:24:26 <golgi>	and how it'd actually be used
5958 23 02:24:34 <Jimmyoshi>	dna is fascinating
5968 23 02:24:34 <golgi>	dude and if they somehow get like
5978 23 02:24:35 <Jimmyoshi>	it's like
5988 23 02:24:40 <Jimmyoshi>	literally the source code to create your body
5998 23 02:24:45 <golgi>	organic 3d printing
6008 23 02:24:54 <golgi>	you combine my shit with that and you can literally get perfect organs
6018 23 02:24:59 <golgi>	for a person
6028 23 02:25:02 <golgi>	cloning
6038 23 02:25:05 <golgi>	haha
6048 23 02:25:07 <Jimmyoshi>	and no one yet understands how that code translates into the correct sequence of chemical reactions
6058 23 02:25:28 <Jimmyoshi>	man
6068 23 02:25:39 <brkman3>	you know what's funny?
6078 23 02:25:41 <Jimmyoshi>	they should get more computer scientists involved in that haha'
6088 23 02:26:05 <brkman3>	ha, they should
6098 23 02:26:18 <golgi>	what's stupid is i'm sitting here at 2:25 am discussing it in some bullshit irc channel instead of trying to do it
6108 23 02:26:19 <brkman3>	maybe they do
6118 23 02:26:36 <Jimmyoshi>	they need more
6128 23 02:26:58 <brkman3>	i'm sorry im as stupid as i am. there's literally nothing i can do about it.
6138 23 02:27:15 <Jimmyoshi>	learn math
6148 23 02:27:16 <golgi>	i'm just throwing abstract ideas
6158 23 02:27:21 <golgi>	i'm replaceable as fuck right now
6168 23 02:27:26 <golgi>	anyone can come up with this shit
6178 23 02:27:33 <golgi>	and then go on and not do anything
6188 23 02:27:48 <golgi>	and be satisfied just for coming up with the idea in the first place
6198 23 02:28:05 <Jimmyoshi>	golgi, tell this to any of your bio/chem/phys friends
6208 23 02:28:12 <brkman3>	i've come up with that kind of stuff while being in a mindset of utter bs
6218 23 02:28:18 <Jimmyoshi>	your idea I mean
6228 23 02:28:36 <golgi>	i'm making a parallel to the discussion we had earlier about music
6238 23 02:28:41 <brkman3>	i've litereally argued for zanzan's point of view in another life
6248 23 02:29:09 <charlotte>	its anti-social, haha. but not everything has to be prosocial i guess
6258 23 02:29:13 <golgi>	but i changed the subject and made it more tangible
6268 23 02:29:31 <golgi>	so is prosocial bad now?
6278 23 02:29:41 <brkman3>	lol
6288 23 02:29:48 <charlotte>	i dunno, u tell me
6298 23 02:29:53 <golgi>	i think anti-social is bad
6308 23 02:29:59 <brkman3>	yes, because it perpetuates the system
6318 23 02:30:01 <golgi>	we're holding ourselves back as a species
6328 23 02:30:04 <brkman3>	and the system is wack
6338 23 02:30:06 <brkman3>	fight the man
6348 23 02:30:15 <golgi>	if we just decide coming up with an idea and leaving it at that is good enough
6358 23 02:30:20 <charlotte>	if we held ourselves back a little more we might not be dying from global warming
6368 23 02:30:23 <golgi>	and is the only meaningful part
6378 23 02:30:26 <golgi>	in fact
6388 23 02:30:36 <brkman3>	but our population is high....
6398 23 02:31:03 <charlotte>	my music sounds much more bafflingly cool when i am tired and cant concentrate on stuff
6408 23 02:31:04 <brkman3>	anti-social people are going to be anti-social regardless
6418 23 02:31:10 <charlotte>	is this how you guys hear my stuff
6428 23 02:31:14 <golgi>	i mean
6438 23 02:31:34 <charlotte>	does it just sound jerkingly fast and alien to you guys
6448 23 02:31:44 <Jimmyoshi>	pretty much
6458 23 02:31:46 <Jimmyoshi>	lol
6468 23 02:31:46 <brkman3>	we just have more means of supporting anti-social people now, instead of them just dying somewhere alone in and starving 
6478 23 02:31:52 <charlotte>	thats amazing i wish i had that
6488 23 02:31:56 <brkman3>	ifi say yes will that make you happy?
6498 23 02:32:04 <charlotte>	i feel as tho this imparts a completely different aesthetic to the way i listen to it. i can hear every detail
6508 23 02:32:17 <golgi>	of course you can
6518 23 02:32:19 <brkman3>	it sounds liek something i have to put forth effort to fully comprehend, and that i need more education to figure out
6528 23 02:32:25 <golgi>	you aren't just making random music
6538 23 02:32:44 <brkman3>	i aspire to be able to figure it out someday
6548 23 02:32:48 <charlotte>	if i listened to myself like this and couldn't comprehend what was going on i would think i was a genius
6558 23 02:32:54 <brkman3>	in the meantime i just appreciate the Sick Beats
6568 23 02:32:59 <charlotte>	this cured at least one tenth of my depression
6578 23 02:33:42 <charlotte>	wait, so why do none of your pastiches sound like this
6588 23 02:33:44 <charlotte>	apart from golgi
6598 23 02:33:47 <golgi>	charlotte my couple of impressions of your music were probably the most fun i had even if i don't actually like them
6608 23 02:33:47 <brkman3>	im really sorry, truly i am
6618 23 02:33:58 <charlotte>	hahaha
6628 23 02:34:02 <Jimmyoshi>	sorry I'm not good enough to imitate you
6638 23 02:34:10 <charlotte>	oh i dont mean like that
6648 23 02:34:19 <charlotte>	but why isnt it just a bafflingly horrifying mess
6658 23 02:34:19 <Jimmyoshi>	lol
6668 23 02:34:26 <charlotte>	if it is how people hear it... haha
6678 23 02:34:28 <Jimmyoshi>	idk it's hard to change my mindset
6688 23 02:34:34 <Jimmyoshi>	even in pastiches
6698 23 02:34:36 <brkman3>	is he capable of creating a bafflingly horrifying mess?
6708 23 02:34:38 <charlotte>	i feel that
6718 23 02:34:45 <golgi>	my entire pastiche of charlotte was deliberate
6728 23 02:35:36 <brkman3>	is one capable of accurately reproducing the bafflingly horrifying mess that is perceived in one's mind
6738 23 02:35:43 <charlotte>	come to think of it i feel it in razerek's early pastiches now
6748 23 02:36:02 <charlotte>	i didnt understand that music at all, and it must be what people sort of see it as
6758 23 02:36:19 <charlotte>	but he is maturing now, i'm slowly starting to sense coherence in his music
6768 23 02:36:27 <charlotte>	in the ones that sound like me i mean  ha ha
6778 23 02:36:55 <Jimmyoshi>	his style is like a tamed version of yours I think lol
6788 23 02:37:14 <charlotte>	listening to my music zoomed out like this is incredible
6798 23 02:37:25 <charlotte>	i can't find any sense of pulse, it just zooms right past me
6808 23 02:37:32 <charlotte>	like the music of an alien
6818 23 02:37:35 <golgi>	aren't you glad you released your music?
6828 23 02:37:40 <charlotte>	hahaha
6838 23 02:37:41 <charlotte>	you're right
6848 23 02:37:57 <charlotte>	but it would have been better if i had been baffled like this exactly once, never to rehear it
6858 23 02:38:05 <charlotte>	stuck in my memory
6868 23 02:38:21 <Jimmyoshi>	well i mean, this is the first time it's ever happened isn't it?
6878 23 02:38:33 <charlotte>	i suppose. but it'll overwrite when i come back
6888 23 02:38:35 <charlotte>	bc its the same song
6898 23 02:38:45 <charlotte>	maybe i can make a new folder (1)
6908 23 02:39:03 <golgi>	i like how there were like 5 pastiche ohcs of me or something
6918 23 02:39:08 <charlotte>	haha
6928 23 02:39:10 <charlotte>	your style is good
6938 23 02:39:20 <brkman3>	yes
6948 23 02:39:23 <Jimmyoshi>	^
6958 23 02:39:28 <golgi>	maybe we have a similar take on each other's music
6968 23 02:39:36 <charlotte>	pffff this explain's luaks as well
6978 23 02:39:37 <golgi>	we don't like it but we can get behind it to an extent
6988 23 02:39:43 <charlotte>	haha yes
6998 23 02:40:03 <brkman3>	to an extends levant
7008 23 02:40:20 <golgi>	of course more of my early stuff was i basically didn't have the skills to actualize what i was thinking or the quality control
7018 23 02:40:53 <brkman3>	am i the only one who was underwhelmed with the music of summer chip this year?
7028 23 02:41:04 <Jimmyoshi>	nah I kind of am too
7038 23 02:41:05 <golgi>	and then there were times i did an amazing job actualizing whatever idea i had but the idea wasn't that great in the first place
7048 23 02:41:12 <Jimmyoshi>	but I haven't heard all of them yet
7058 23 02:41:26 <Jimmyoshi>	I've been   rather disappointed in the music submitted to botb majors lately actually haha
7068 23 02:41:29 <golgi>	man i truly had some fun in that modshrine ohc i did last friday
7078 23 02:41:31 <brkman3>	i think i'm just kind of not feeling amateur computer music anymore these days
7088 23 02:41:33 <golgi>	that pug peer pressured me into joining
7098 23 02:41:38 <Jimmyoshi>	winter chip xi felt really disappointing too imo
7108 23 02:41:48 <Jimmyoshi>	my aura even turned dark blue from voting
7118 23 02:41:53 <brkman3>	i haven't listend to a botb major since usability i, lol
7128 23 02:42:02 <golgi>	i feel kinda bad for puke because botb honestly seems like a daycare for budding musicians
7138 23 02:42:04 <brkman3>	i still vote high, tho, out of habit
7148 23 02:42:04 <Jimmyoshi>	and it's that way rn actually haha
7158 23 02:42:10 <golgi>	and that's kind of how it's going to be
7168 23 02:42:14 <golgi>	considering how many toys it has
7178 23 02:42:23 <golgi>	he's set it up that
7188 23 02:42:24 <golgi>	way
7198 23 02:42:33 <golgi>	maybe he realizes it though
7208 23 02:42:38 <brkman3>	that's how i saw it when i first joined
7218 23 02:42:39 <brkman3>	no...
7228 23 02:42:40 <golgi>	this is why "botb drama" is a very common term
7238 23 02:42:42 <brkman3>	the year afteri first joined
7248 23 02:42:55 <brkman3>	the first year i joined i was like "waaaaaw"
7258 23 02:42:59 <Jimmyoshi>	when I first joined I remember thinking there were a lot of talented musicians here
7268 23 02:43:04 <brkman3>	and then i was like "gotta go faster faster fffffaster"
7278 23 02:43:08 <Jimmyoshi>	I think the budding musicians thing is a recent phenomenon
7288 23 02:43:08 <golgi>	i parodied all the solofest wanks that i hear in my last ohc song 
7298 23 02:43:19 <golgi>	at the end
7308 23 02:43:27 <brkman3>	lol nice
7318 23 02:43:35 <Jimmyoshi>	I think I know what's going on
7328 23 02:43:41 <Jimmyoshi>	botb has cycles in it
7338 23 02:43:49 <golgi>	nah it's literally always been budding musicians on the majority
7348 23 02:43:52 <brkman3>	like... there was golgi, uuni, fod....
7358 23 02:43:52 <Jimmyoshi>	people come in fairly new to music, get really fucking good, then leave
7368 23 02:43:54 <golgi>	people like moot are exceptions
7378 23 02:43:57 <brkman3>	pugl...
7388 23 02:44:03 <Jimmyoshi>	so now we're currently in the bad part of the cycle
7398 23 02:44:06 <Jimmyoshi>	where most of the good people left
7408 23 02:44:17 <golgi>	moot is an exception because he found music in an oldschool way
7418 23 02:44:19 <Jimmyoshi>	this is just a theory though
7428 23 02:44:26 <golgi>	sounds somewhat close
7438 23 02:44:28 <Jimmyoshi>	I haven't been on botb long enough so I can't say for sure
7448 23 02:44:36 <brkman3>	moot is an exception because he's a good musician who still comes back
7458 23 02:44:37 <golgi>	botb is literally a daycare and it isn't intentionally that way for sure
7468 23 02:44:42 <golgi>	but that's how it is
7478 23 02:44:58 <brkman3>	botb is litereally setup like an academy rpg, lol
7488 23 02:45:02 <brkman3>	i mean
7498 23 02:45:06 <golgi>	that's why it's a daycare
7508 23 02:45:14 <brkman3>	isn't "botb academy" wasn't that a url for something?
7518 23 02:45:14 <golgi>	you can't have a serious music site and have it be set up like a video game
7528 23 02:45:43 <golgi>	i don't mean to insult puke or botb in general
7538 23 02:45:47 <golgi>	i'm just saying what it is
7548 23 02:45:53 <Jimmyoshi>	yeah...
7558 23 02:45:56 <Jimmyoshi>	it's a shame though
7568 23 02:46:01 <brkman3>	i don't see how it can be perceived as an insult
7578 23 02:46:02 <Jimmyoshi>	I used to really like botb when I first came here
7588 23 02:46:05 <Jimmyoshi>	and I want to continue to like it
7598 23 02:46:07 <brkman3>	i dn't understand how these are bad things, lol
7608 23 02:46:17 <brkman3>	you can like it for what it has meant to you
7618 23 02:46:20 <Jimmyoshi>	but I find it increasingly difficult to
7628 23 02:46:22 <brkman3>	you dn't have to stay stuck to it
7638 23 02:46:24 <golgi>	well puke is a grown adult with a real life
7648 23 02:46:26 <brkman3>	to like it
7658 23 02:46:38 <golgi>	and he wants botb to be a fun place where musicians gather
7668 23 02:46:40 <brkman3>	hmmm...
7678 23 02:46:53 <brkman3>	well.. i don't like linkin park's "session" anymore
7688 23 02:46:59 <brkman3>	so i guess i get it
7698 23 02:47:16 <golgi>	puke did not intentionally try to create this system
7708 23 02:47:18 <brkman3>	yeah... musicians
7718 23 02:47:21 <brkman3>	not budding musicians
7728 23 02:47:31 <golgi>	but it's how it happened
7738 23 02:47:40 <brkman3>	how did it happen without him creating it intentionally?
7748 23 02:47:51 <brkman3>	what was it supposed to be if not this?
7758 23 02:47:59 <golgi>	because he didn't realize that making a music site like a video game meant people would be playing the game, not making music
7768 23 02:48:07 <golgi>	they get good enough to win the game
7778 23 02:48:16 <golgi>	but if they want to get better, they have to leave the game
7788 23 02:48:20 <brkman3>	ah
7798 23 02:48:33 <golgi>	it's good to an extent
7808 23 02:48:44 <golgi>	you end up drilling and honing your actualization skills
7818 23 02:48:48 <brkman3>	it's not like mario speedruns
7828 23 02:48:51 <golgi>	but only at a rudimentary level
7838 23 02:49:05 <charlotte>	the writing was on the wall from the start, like, null1024 was like top 10 lol
7848 23 02:49:05 <brkman3>	nvm, ignore that, lel
7858 23 02:49:25 <charlotte>	but it was kept in check by a miraculous outpouring from the vgmusic community, a weird black swan event that will not happen again in history
7868 23 02:49:26 <brkman3>	what does that mean?
7878 23 02:49:36 <golgi>	it's like expecting to be a master mathemetician from high school math
7888 23 02:49:46 <brkman3>	i don't understand
7898 23 02:49:52 <golgi>	yea you learn a lot of fundamentals which are necessary but you cannot get far just stoppign at calculus
7908 23 02:49:56 <brkman3>	all this historic talk
7918 23 02:50:18 <charlotte>	thgwe 
7928 23 02:50:20 <charlotte>	oops
7938 23 02:50:41 <brkman3>	can you eplain the meaning and context of this please? <charlotte> the writing was on the wall from the start, like, null1024 was like top 10 lol<charlotte> but it was kept in check by a miraculous outpouring from the vgmusic community, a weird black swan event that will not happen again in history
7948 23 02:50:44 <charlotte>	the site was always built to incentivise lazy musicians. its just we conveniently happened to be buried on an insane musician indian burial ground
7958 23 02:50:58 <golgi>	one thing incheoul always calls me out on is not actually putting any effort
7968 23 02:51:11 <golgi>	it's a good thing to be called out on
7978 23 02:51:13 <brkman3>	who tf is incheoul
7988 23 02:51:15 <golgi>	kajingsol
7998 23 02:51:20 <brkman3>	man
8008 23 02:51:25 <brkman3>	i'm just so confused tonight. goodnight
8018 23 02:51:28 <charlotte>	lunar, jayster, dhg2, lukeyboy, willow, tony thai, kungfufurby literally all come from the exact same forum
8028 23 02:51:36 <golgi>	which one?
8038 23 02:51:37 <brkman3>	wait
8048 23 02:51:38 <charlotte>	a website based around videogame covers
8058 23 02:51:40 <brkman3>	vgmusic.com?
8068 23 02:51:40 <golgi>	oh vgmusic
8078 23 02:51:41 <charlotte>	in mid
8088 23 02:51:44 <brkman3>	ah man...
8098 23 02:51:44 <Jimmyoshi>	huh
8108 23 02:51:53 <brkman3>	i kind of come from there too in a way, lol
8118 23 02:51:54 <Jimmyoshi>	I knew about lunar, jayster, and tony thai but not the others
8128 23 02:51:54 <charlotte>	yeah u thought ur super mario clique was big huh
8138 23 02:52:04 <Jimmyoshi>	I've recognized them from their midis lmao
8148 23 02:52:05 <brkman3>	i mean... i made a few midis there and made lke maybe 3 posts...
8158 23 02:52:21 <charlotte>	lemme find the people that took part in the sample contests, its almost a who's who lol
8168 23 02:52:26 <charlotte>	shnabubula and maxo have entries into them
8178 23 02:52:32 <Jimmyoshi>	charlotte: hey it's pretty reasonable size ;)
8188 23 02:52:36 <brkman3>	so
8198 23 02:52:45 <golgi>	what would be best for botb is for puke to either accept that the system as it is, is going to be a musical preschool
8208 23 02:52:45 <brkman3>	wow jimmlewdshi
8218 23 02:52:54 <charlotte>	basically my point is that rather than creating these musicians themselves, botb was probably more realistically just siphoning them off from other websites
8228 23 02:52:56 <golgi>	or he will have to leave botb permanently or tear down the whole site
8238 23 02:53:10 <brkman3>	yeah that makes sense
8248 23 02:53:15 <charlotte>	and these websites have since passed, and if new ones have popped up, botb is not near them in the online-navigational sense
8258 23 02:53:19 <brkman3>	noo please don't tera it down :(
8268 23 02:53:21 <golgi>	it's interesting that all these observations only work in this indirect, implicit sense
8278 23 02:53:31 <brkman3>	lol, i got real anxiety from that, fff...
8288 23 02:53:31 <golgi>	if he renamed botb to "music preschool" then ofc no one would go there
8298 23 02:53:45 <charlotte>	so it has no userbase to, pardon my sort of poor wording, parasite off of. hence we get the memer trash from youtube. no offense, golgi
8308 23 02:53:58 <golgi>	haha none taken
8318 23 02:54:05 <golgi>	actually to an extent i was trying to escape them
8328 23 02:54:09 <golgi>	not to an extent
8338 23 02:54:11 <charlotte>	(-:
8348 23 02:54:14 <golgi>	i was literally trying to escape them
8358 23 02:54:17 <golgi>	but they all followed me
8368 23 02:54:21 <brkman3>	heh
8378 23 02:54:22 <golgi>	i was also trying to escape my mom
8388 23 02:54:27 <golgi>	and jehovah's witnesses
8398 23 02:54:32 <golgi>	me joining botb was an escape
8408 23 02:54:38 <Jimmyoshi>	literally me with the mario hacking community
8418 23 02:54:46 <charlotte>	oh i forgot to add jrlepage, he has his roots in vgmusic too
8428 23 02:54:47 <Jimmyoshi>	I was sick of that community and wanted to escape to a new one
8438 23 02:54:51 <golgi>	it was an escape from online and irl
8448 23 02:54:54 <golgi>	for me
8458 23 02:54:59 <golgi>	i found solace in botb
8468 23 02:55:06 <golgi>	it helped me a lot
8478 23 02:55:11 <charlotte>	you could not think of a stranger confluence of extremely powerful musicians, almost by accident
8488 23 02:55:11 <Jimmyoshi>	charlotte: oh yeah you're right
8498 23 02:55:15 <Jimmyoshi>	I think I saw his name there too
8508 23 02:55:22 <charlotte>	yeah he used to go by "Shock"
8518 23 02:55:23 <brkman3>	are you saying null isn't very good? is that's what's being said here? <charlotte> the writing was on the wall from the start, like, null1024 was like top 10 lol
8528 23 02:55:26 <golgi>	but i came on botb acting like a "teenager" because it was the only way i knew how to act
8538 23 02:55:35 <golgi>	i didn't have other points of view or perspectives
8548 23 02:55:42 <charlotte>	i'm implying he has written the exact same song for about four years, that gets between 15 and 22 points in every single ohb
8558 23 02:55:47 <charlotte>	and he is about level 25
8568 23 02:55:55 <brkman3>	oh
8578 23 02:56:02 <brkman3>	lol, that's like me heh
8588 23 02:56:12 <charlotte>	tristendo also, tho he has his champions
8598 23 02:56:16 <brkman3>	except s/same song/same level of suck
8608 23 02:56:44 <Jimmyoshi>	I'm guilty of the same song thing too tbh
8618 23 02:56:48 <brkman3>	all my songs sound different, but they have one thing in common :)
8628 23 02:56:58 <charlotte>	basically "the more u stick around the more u level up" has been true since forever haha
8638 23 02:57:15 <brkman3>	lol it kind of blows my mind that i actually got like
8648 23 02:57:18 <charlotte>	my arena thing tried to rectify it with an SP rating, so ur status in a hierarchy can go either up or down
8658 23 02:57:27 <golgi>	you know
8668 23 02:57:29 <brkman3>	25-30 scoring entries when i first came
8678 23 02:57:39 <golgi>	if you literally try as hard as possible to win 
8688 23 02:57:41 <golgi>	you will win
8698 23 02:57:42 <golgi>	on botb
8708 23 02:57:45 <golgi>	lol
8718 23 02:57:47 <charlotte>	yea
8728 23 02:57:47 <charlotte>	haha
8738 23 02:57:51 <Jimmyoshi>	yup lol
8748 23 02:57:58 <golgi>	the reason you didn't win is because you didn't try hard enough
8758 23 02:58:03 <brkman3>	i can't believe i have like ohb medals
8768 23 02:58:09 <golgi>	and maybe it could be that you aren't even capable of trying hard enough
8778 23 02:58:13 <brkman3>	and like... entries that scored 29 and higher
8788 23 02:58:15 <brkman3>	lke wtf
8798 23 02:58:17 <brkman3>	kill me
8808 23 02:58:23 <brkman3>	burn botb to the ground
8818 23 02:58:29 <charlotte>	>:)
8828 23 02:58:34 <Jimmyoshi>	haha try getting a perfect 35
8838 23 02:58:40 <Jimmyoshi>	25-30 isn't too hard imo
8848 23 02:58:42 <golgi>	i actually liked entering more of the mod_shrine ohcs at some point in 2014 because i just kept getting hammered 
8858 23 02:58:43 <Jimmyoshi>	for ohbs
8868 23 02:58:51 <brkman3>	i want to burn botb because i got high scores and that's retarded
8878 23 02:58:53 <golgi>	because i couldn't pull half assed botb shit
8888 23 02:59:08 <charlotte>	mod shrine ohbs are about as tedious to me haha
8898 23 02:59:12 <golgi>	like i used to have the mentality oh i'll just submit everything
8908 23 02:59:14 <golgi>	yea i think
8918 23 02:59:18 <golgi>	ohcs in general are actually flawed
8928 23 02:59:20 <charlotte>	i wrote tumpet in 12 minutes and beat coda
8938 23 02:59:23 <golgi>	it's yet another game
8948 23 02:59:30 <golgi>	well coda didn't even try either
8958 23 02:59:34 <charlotte>	yeah hah
8968 23 02:59:37 <brkman3>	also, i'm sorry for letting you down charlotte. i know my "tell me for eal" song on cm.o or w/e made you like "hmmm promising" and i just haven't lived up to that at all, and i apologize
8978 23 02:59:40 <golgi>	i can tell he probably gave up after 20 minutes
8988 23 02:59:40 <golgi>	himself
8998 23 02:59:44 <charlotte>	haha its ok
9008 23 02:59:59 <Jimmyoshi>	I'm sorry for letting you down too kf
9018 23 03:00:02 <charlotte>	HAHA
9028 23 03:00:03 <charlotte>	its ok
9038 23 03:00:12 <brkman3>	i'm realyl more appoligzijgjn to myself
9048 23 03:00:15 <brkman3>	i guess
9058 23 03:00:19 <brkman3>	i just suck, lol
9068 23 03:00:23 <charlotte>	please don't worry. im not   jesus, unless you think i am
9078 23 03:00:25 <brkman3>	and i don't try to get better
9088 23 03:00:33 <Jimmyoshi>	actually I'm not sorry
9098 23 03:00:35 <brkman3>	so i'll just continue sucking
9108 23 03:00:36 <charlotte>	good
9118 23 03:00:39 <Jimmyoshi>	but still disappointed in myself slightly
9128 23 03:00:40 <brkman3>	it takes me like
9138 23 03:00:43 <brkman3>	like
9148 23 03:00:43 <Jimmyoshi>	lol
9158 23 03:00:45 <brkman3>	it took me like
9168 23 03:00:52 <brkman3>	12 hours or something to make tell me for real
9178 23 03:00:53 <golgi>	Jimmyoshi, i honestly think you know more music theory than me
9188 23 03:00:58 <golgi>	in terms of applying it
9198 23 03:01:08 <golgi>	do you know how much bullshit i just throw in sometimes and get away with it
9208 23 03:01:09 <Jimmyoshi>	haha idk
9218 23 03:01:14 <golgi>	the only person that calls me out on is slimeball
9228 23 03:01:17 <Jimmyoshi>	you're definitely way better at analyzing songs than I am tho
9238 23 03:01:23 <golgi>	and then i disagree with him on the rationale that it sounded cool
9248 23 03:01:25 <Jimmyoshi>	I'm shit when it comes to analyzing
9258 23 03:01:27 <golgi>	and his way is boring
9268 23 03:01:29 <charlotte>	haha i mean, i dont like your music because it tries to sounds like an elton john keyboard demo all the time, if that's your heart core then go for it
9278 23 03:01:31 <brkman3>	and that was me being "wild" and "idgaf about conventions" not being "myself" and 'what i want to be"
9288 23 03:01:43 <brkman3>	heh, heartcore
9298 23 03:02:11 <Jimmyoshi>	I wish I had better analyzation capabilities so I could replicate stuff better
9308 23 03:02:12 *	m9m (~m9m@86.125.205.63) has joined
9318 23 03:02:12 <TempleBot>	m9m: Welcome to the temple of the night. Being a heathen is perfectly just.
9328 23 03:02:20 <charlotte>	similar to ddrkirby who tries to sound like the main menu music of a newgrounds flash game all the time and azura who tries to sound lke the beatmania happy sky menu music all the time
9338 23 03:02:28 <golgi>	HAHAHA
9348 23 03:02:30 <m9m>	no
9358 23 03:02:32 <brkman3>	i've progressievly gotten worse at actualizing over the years since i joinedd botb
9368 23 03:02:37 <golgi>	why was that so funny
9378 23 03:02:45 <Jimmyoshi>	lmao
9388 23 03:02:54 <golgi>	yea ddrkirby's music really taught me a valuable lesson
9398 23 03:03:09 <golgi>	but charlotte said it more concisely than i could say it ever
9408 23 03:03:17 <charlotte>	if you can't analyse music in any meaningful way this is basically your grave site. you're just stuck trying to replicate some literally fucking random fond memory you have forever
9418 23 03:03:30 <golgi>	yea i mean
9428 23 03:03:31 <brkman3>	what is ddrkirby's music?
9438 23 03:03:38 <golgi>	a-zu-ra doesn't know any music theory
9448 23 03:03:41 <Jimmyoshi>	haha wow harsh
9458 23 03:03:44 <golgi>	other than prob basic shit like what a scale is
9468 23 03:03:48 <brkman3>	i thought azura was trying to sound like ddrkirby all the time
9478 23 03:03:49 <charlotte>	if you liked playing digimon world once when you were 6 and you don't understand music theory, you will just try to write file music (day) for the rest of your life
9488 23 03:03:49 <Jimmyoshi>	wait I thought he knew some
9498 23 03:04:03 <Jimmyoshi>	I swear he said he took some music class or something
9508 23 03:04:03 <golgi>	i actually like a-zu-ra's music more though
9518 23 03:04:07 <golgi>	nah
9528 23 03:04:10 <golgi>	that was me
9538 23 03:04:12 <golgi>	i took some music class
9548 23 03:04:14 <brkman3>	me too
9558 23 03:04:15 <golgi>	lol
9568 23 03:04:15 <Jimmyoshi>	same
9578 23 03:04:20 <charlotte>	thank fuck
9588 23 03:04:23 <brkman3>	i'm pretty sure i was never a huge fan of ddrkirby
9598 23 03:04:27 <charlotte>	it's not a trap, i promise
9608 23 03:04:28 <golgi>	i also tried to learn a lot of shit on my own
9618 23 03:04:47 <brkman3>	i'm not sleeping tonight
9628 23 03:04:49 <golgi>	i ended up learning more that way
9638 23 03:04:50 <golgi>	anyway
9648 23 03:05:01 <Jimmyoshi>	I kinda learned a bunch when I took music theory then learned a few more things but then kinda stopped haha
9658 23 03:05:08 <Jimmyoshi>	but once in a while I pick up a thing here and there
9668 23 03:05:09 <brkman3>	hey so like
9678 23 03:05:12 <golgi>	i like
9688 23 03:05:17 <golgi>	actively try to take apart songs or something
9698 23 03:05:17 <golgi>	haha
9708 23 03:05:22 <golgi>	and not just blind covers
9718 23 03:05:23 <Jimmyoshi>	yeah I need to do that more
9728 23 03:05:24 <golgi>	i actually suck at covers
9738 23 03:05:29 <golgi>	i can't do covers to save my life
9748 23 03:05:30 <brkman3>	tonight i tried playing "i want you back" in phase shift (free rockband)
9758 23 03:05:35 <golgi>	i do like 
9768 23 03:05:38 <golgi>	true analysis
9778 23 03:05:38 <Jimmyoshi>	I think doing 1:1 covers helps though
9788 23 03:05:43 <charlotte>	take an interest in learning theory formally. i promise it is not a trap
9798 23 03:05:47 <golgi>	well a robot could do it
9808 23 03:05:52 <brkman3>	and i got an 82%
9818 23 03:05:54 <brkman3>	the first time
9828 23 03:06:00 <golgi>	i do more of a        uhh qualitative analysis
9838 23 03:06:03 <brkman3>	then progressively got worse each time i replayed it
9848 23 03:06:14 <golgi>	charlotte, where do you start
9858 23 03:06:23 <Jimmyoshi>	well because like if you do a 1:1 cover it forces you to try and hear what's going on in the song and then you write it down in your DAW or w/e and you look at it and go "huh. that's interesting"
9868 23 03:06:23 <charlotte>	you might not like my music but i guaranfuckingtee you i do not just pull it out from about five different videogame songs every time
9878 23 03:06:24 <brkman3>	until finally i was liek "okay, let me actually... get this" and then i went up to 83%
9888 23 03:06:25 <golgi>	i think i was trying to learn about voice leading the last time i was trying to learn music theory
9898 23 03:06:36 <brkman3>	so i'm pretty like... i guess i have hope in my ability to actually improve....
9908 23 03:06:47 <charlotte>	having a proper grounding harmony and counterpoint should be essential haha
9918 23 03:06:52 <charlotte>	then tonality
9928 23 03:06:55 <golgi>	Jimmyoshi, well yea
9938 23 03:07:00 <golgi>	that just takes what i do a step further
9948 23 03:07:06 <charlotte>	not even slavishly trying to replicate what it is doing, but having the actual concepts there in your head
9958 23 03:07:13 <golgi>	but most people who do those covers do not do what i do
9968 23 03:07:18 <charlotte>	being able to optimise your understanding of what you are doing is not just something people are born with
9978 23 03:07:18 <brkman3>	fookn slav
9988 23 03:07:20 <Jimmyoshi>	yea
9998 23 03:07:29 <golgi>	i'm more like            well why do i like this thing
10008 23 03:07:31 <golgi>	why did they do this
10018 23 03:07:36 <charlotte>	right
10028 23 03:07:42 <golgi>	i don't leave at oh i just like this lol rip
10038 23 03:07:53 <golgi>	i'll like try to figure out some objective things
10048 23 03:07:59 <golgi>	and be like oh i get it
10058 23 03:08:01 <charlotte>	life would be meaningless if people didn't at least *try* to understand things
10068 23 03:08:03 <golgi>	and then mess around with that
10078 23 03:08:18 <golgi>	i do like semi-reverse engineering of a song
10088 23 03:08:23 <charlotte>	even if it is impossible. asymptotically approach that bitch like a madman
10098 23 03:08:29 <golgi>	that's honestly how i got better at music hahaha
10108 23 03:08:45 <brkman3>	hey
10118 23 03:08:46 <brkman3>	is
10128 23 03:08:59 <golgi>	i'm still at the point where the music i have in my head is cooler than what i make though which totally sucks
10138 23 03:09:08 <golgi>	one day they will have a 95% congruence
10148 23 03:09:08 <brkman3>	"i like this because it sounds kinda middle-eastern" a good answer to the "well why do i like this thing?" question?
10158 23 03:09:09 <golgi>	at least
10168 23 03:09:13 <brkman3>	is that a good place to start at least?
10178 23 03:09:23 <golgi>	well that's a good place to start
10188 23 03:09:25 <Jimmyoshi>	well you have to figure out why it sounds middle-eastern
10198 23 03:09:28 <golgi>	you could then go investigate that yea
10208 23 03:09:32 <golgi>	and check out some of the scales they use
10218 23 03:09:34 <Jimmyoshi>	what objective musical qualities make it sound that way
10228 23 03:09:35 <brkman3>	because it uses a middle-eastern scale
10238 23 03:09:39 <golgi>	yea
10248 23 03:09:40 <Jimmyoshi>	what sort of chords did they use etc
10258 23 03:09:43 <brkman3>	what's the next step from there?
10268 23 03:09:53 <golgi>	well then you can just start messing around with it yourself
10278 23 03:09:57 <brkman3>	oh
10288 23 03:10:00 <brkman3>	is that the last step?
10298 23 03:10:01 <golgi>	hmm i wonder how much of my messing around shit i have
10308 23 03:10:03 <brkman3>	man...
10318 23 03:10:03 <golgi>	well no
10328 23 03:10:07 <golgi>	it doesn't really ever end
10338 23 03:10:12 <brkman3>	okay cool
10348 23 03:10:14 <brkman3>	it's kinda funny
10358 23 03:10:15 <golgi>	you just added more knowledge to your bank
10368 23 03:10:17 <golgi>	kinda
10378 23 03:10:21 <brkman3>	cuz i've been kind of subconsciously doing that all my life
10388 23 03:10:29 <golgi>	well i think it's more fun deliberately doing it
10398 23 03:10:35 <brkman3>	just not in any methodically constructive way
10408 23 03:10:47 <brkman3>	like i remember when i was a kid
10418 23 03:10:49 <golgi>	i don't want my music to be an accident
10428 23 03:10:56 <golgi>	this is why i can't get behind prodigies
10438 23 03:10:57 <brkman3>	lke... 7 listening to my dad's a capella group 
10448 23 03:10:59 <golgi>	all they do are accidents
10458 23 03:11:04 <golgi>	it's just their accidents are good
10468 23 03:11:09 <golgi>	but they are still accidents
10478 23 03:11:11 <brkman3>	and i'd like tilt my head and be like...
10488 23 03:11:30 <golgi>	i don't mind prodigies themselves as much as
10498 23 03:11:33 <brkman3>	"ngh, that was a sick chord because those two notes are really cose together"
10508 23 03:11:34 <golgi>	how much society props them up
10518 23 03:11:42 <golgi>	as true geniuses or something
10528 23 03:11:45 <brkman3>	appreciating tight harmonies
10538 23 03:12:04 <golgi>	oh yea          like einstein just accidentally came up with the theory of relativity
10548 23 03:12:05 *	charlottte (~charlotte@cpc4-salf5-2-0-cust61.10-2.cable.virginm.net) has joined
10558 23 03:12:05 <TempleBot>	charlottte: Paulstretch . e x e
10568 23 03:12:13 <brkman3>	prodigies don't inherently stay propped up, tho
10578 23 03:12:14 <brkman3>	like
10588 23 03:12:20 <brkman3>	people be like "oh yeah wow amazing"
10598 23 03:12:27 <charlottte>	i think the main problem with botb is that the constant quest for understanding  is itself a kind of videogame
10608 23 03:12:33 <brkman3>	but eventualy if they don;t do anything beyond their "accidents" they just fade into obscurity
10618 23 03:12:42 <charlottte>	you start with only a 0.000001% of understanding of things and u are constantly trying to increase that number
10628 23 03:12:53 <charlottte>	and the numbers on botb almost competes with it
10638 23 03:13:02 *	charlotte has quit (Ping timeout: 186 seconds)
10648 23 03:13:05 <brkman3>	do you thinki can ever get better?
10658 23 03:13:16 <Jimmyoshi>	do you think you can?
10668 23 03:13:19 <charlottte>	it replicates the reward for understanding things but without incentivising the process
10678 23 03:13:31 <golgi>	ask this question instead
10688 23 03:13:35 <brkman3>	from hearing my entries, do you think it's possible that i could ever get to the point where the question of placing in a major is even viable?
10698 23 03:13:38 <golgi>	does the music you make match what you want to make?
10708 23 03:13:42 <golgi>	forget compos
10718 23 03:13:43 <charlottte>	christ. i tell myself i would've been a better musician if i'd found music communities at 14, but i'd be so fucked lol
10728 23 03:13:52 <charlottte>	i'd still be trying to write file town (day)
10738 23 03:13:58 <charlottte>	over and over again
10748 23 03:14:02 <golgi>	hahaha
10758 23 03:14:17 <brkman3>	well i want to make music that makes me feel like i could even consider the possiblity of placing in a major compo, sorry, lol
10768 23 03:14:30 <brkman3>	lol, file town (day)
10778 23 03:14:35 <charlottte>	actually spending some time outside Composing to think about what music is and how it works actually let me do something more meaningful
10788 23 03:14:54 <Jimmyoshi>	what's good is when you actually surprise yourself when writing music
10798 23 03:14:58 <brkman3>	i really just want to know what other people think, because no i don't think i can, Jimmyoshi to answer your question
10808 23 03:15:04 <Jimmyoshi>	and the thing you write actually ends up sounding *better* than you imagine
10818 23 03:15:07 <charlottte>	if 24 year old "joined botb at 14" keffie met me she would feel devastatedly inferior
10828 23 03:15:12 <Jimmyoshi>	imagined initially I mean
10838 23 03:15:22 <charlottte>	well, not botb, like online ~music communities~
10848 23 03:15:27 <brkman3>	my music is too unimpactful to get unsolicited feedback
10858 23 03:15:36 <Jimmyoshi>	brkman3, I think almost anyone can. they just need to dedicate themself
10868 23 03:15:52 <brkman3>	meh
10878 23 03:16:05 <Jimmyoshi>	so it depends on how much you want to dedicate yourself
10888 23 03:16:10 <brkman3>	i still need to go back and rework the LP that i was going to release in 2013
10898 23 03:16:14 <Jimmyoshi>	because that can be tough and stressful, I get that
10908 23 03:16:34 <brkman3>	of my first lsdj craps that were fully actualized pieces
10918 23 03:17:04 <Jimmyoshi>	I actually feel kind of bad because I don't think I'm improving as fast as I should be
10928 23 03:17:10 <brkman3>	just cna't be arsed to make the changes that i know i should make whenever i listen to them now
10938 23 03:17:30 <Jimmyoshi>	but the stress of improving can also take the fun out of it
10948 23 03:17:32 <Jimmyoshi>	so I'm torn
10958 23 03:17:53 <golgi>	i liked my idea for sakura drop more but i think baller world was the closest thing i got from my idea matching what i actually made
10968 23 03:18:09 <golgi>	*i got to
10978 23 03:18:27 <golgi>	maybe it was about 70% of the way there
10988 23 03:18:36 <brkman3>	i'm making a chiptune midi for the next major that has midi category
10998 23 03:18:44 <Jimmyoshi>	haah golgi do you ever have like
11008 23 03:18:47 <brkman3>	just can't find a good 8bit sounding gm bass
11018 23 03:18:49 <Jimmyoshi>	dreams of music
11028 23 03:18:53 <golgi>	all the time
11038 23 03:18:54 <golgi>	god damn
11048 23 03:18:56 <brkman3>	i've had dreams of music
11058 23 03:19:01 <Jimmyoshi>	like you literally hear music you never heard before in your life inside your dream
11068 23 03:19:02 <golgi>	like it's not even visual
11078 23 03:19:04 <Jimmyoshi>	and it sounds fucking amazing
11088 23 03:19:04 <brkman3>	it sucks when i wake up and don't have time to put it down before i forget
11098 23 03:19:06 <golgi>	it's just an audiodream
11108 23 03:19:15 <golgi>	and it sounds amazing
11118 23 03:19:18 <Jimmyoshi>	because that happens to me a lot
11128 23 03:19:19 <brkman3>	my "get aboard that train" was from a dream
11138 23 03:19:19 <Jimmyoshi>	but then
11148 23 03:19:20 <golgi>	and then i wake up and idk what it was
11158 23 03:19:26 <Jimmyoshi>	I usually forget it when I wake up
11168 23 03:19:27 <golgi>	i hate it because my dreammusic sounds amazing
11178 23 03:19:27 <Jimmyoshi>	;__;
11188 23 03:19:27 <Jimmyoshi>	yeah
11198 23 03:19:33 <golgi>	and then i can't do it in real life
11208 23 03:19:40 <Jimmyoshi>	god I wish I could remember it after I wake up haha
11218 23 03:19:41 <brkman3>	the trick is to be able to hum
11228 23 03:19:50 <brkman3>	and keep audacity and a microphone open at night
11238 23 03:19:57 <brkman3>	so when you wake up you can instantly hum as much of it as you can
11248 23 03:20:02 <golgi>	i think that was one of the things that really differentiated where i would be potentially good at in terms of the arts
11258 23 03:20:05 <Jimmyoshi>	no like
11268 23 03:20:10 <brkman3>	sure it's not a perfect 1:1 as it fades from your mind, but it's still something you can work with
11278 23 03:20:13 <Jimmyoshi>	the memory is literally gone by the time I've woken up
11288 23 03:20:14 <Jimmyoshi>	haha
11298 23 03:20:17 <brkman3>	i know
11308 23 03:20:20 <golgi>	i never thought to try to actually take apart shit and try to figure out how certain things are drawn
11318 23 03:20:22 <brkman3>	i get it
11328 23 03:20:30 <golgi>	and i can't make very analytical observations about them in the first place
11338 23 03:20:38 <brkman3>	but i think deliberately setting up a system for recording it when you wak up
11348 23 03:20:41 <golgi>	in terms of visual art
11358 23 03:20:45 <brkman3>	can help it stay in your mind
11368 23 03:21:03 <golgi>	though on the other hand, i recognize a lot of people think they're amazing at art when they just copy sonic fanart or w/e
11378 23 03:21:03 <brkman3>	setting it up the night before you go to bed
11388 23 03:21:05 <golgi>	or shitty pixel art
11398 23 03:21:11 <golgi>	with like shitty dots
11408 23 03:21:17 <golgi>	which misses the whole point of pixel art
11418 23 03:21:29 <golgi>	but i can't go much deeper than that
11428 23 03:21:35 <brkman3>	that's what she said
11438 23 03:21:51 <brkman3>	Jimmyoshi: you should try it, for me? and see if my hypothesis has merit?
11448 23 03:21:53 <golgi>	it's kind of why i make so much mspaint art haha
11458 23 03:22:00 <golgi>	from my pov it's like
11468 23 03:22:05 <Jimmyoshi>	I guess but I doubt it'll work lol
11478 23 03:22:06 <golgi>	at least i got the point of my art
11488 23 03:22:34 <brkman3>	have audacity open, and the first thing you think when you wake up is "i have to get this down as soon as possible"
11498 23 03:22:48 <Jimmyoshi>	dude brkman3 like
11508 23 03:22:51 <golgi>	well nah by the time you actually wake 
11518 23 03:22:55 <golgi>	like 
11528 23 03:22:56 <golgi>	literally
11538 23 03:22:58 <golgi>	open your eyes
11548 23 03:23:00 <golgi>	you forget
11558 23 03:23:01 <brkman3>	sometimes i forget my dreams as soon as i wake up
11568 23 03:23:02 <Jimmyoshi>	I can do that if I come up with something cool that a hum/whistle while driving
11578 23 03:23:05 <Jimmyoshi>	or in the shower
11588 23 03:23:06 <golgi>	yea
11598 23 03:23:06 <brkman3>	yeah, i have those usually
11608 23 03:23:09 <Jimmyoshi>	but I'm actually awake for those
11618 23 03:23:13 <brkman3>	but sometimes they don't fade
11628 23 03:23:14 <Jimmyoshi>	with dreams it's like impossible lol
11638 23 03:23:18 <golgi>	i can actualise ideas i consciously come up with
11648 23 03:23:24 <brkman3>	especialy when i've setup a system to put them down
11658 23 03:23:31 <golgi>	which i guess tap into shit like dreams and subconscious to an extent
11668 23 03:23:42 <golgi>	but it's less       random and more filtered
11678 23 03:23:50 <brkman3>	like... i do understand what you're saying
11688 23 03:23:50 <Jimmyoshi>	the closest I've done was be able to vaguely represent the general aesthetic of the dreammusic but I don't think the result was anything like what I came up with haha
11698 23 03:24:11 <brkman3>	i'm just presenting the idea that it doesn't /always/ have to be just that way, possibly. there's at least a possiblity to be explored
11708 23 03:24:21 <brkman3>	yeah
11718 23 03:24:23 <brkman3>	yeah
11728 23 03:24:29 <golgi>	haha 
11738 23 03:24:31 <golgi>	brkman3, 
11748 23 03:24:33 <golgi>	guess what i found
11758 23 03:24:37 <brkman3>	what?
11768 23 03:24:44 <golgi>	https://www.dropbox.com/s/aq8xfcvj6gvg0p1/die%20jaux.xm?dl=0
11778 23 03:24:48 <brkman3>	loool, wow
11788 23 03:24:49 <golgi>	me trying to cover a song you made
11798 23 03:24:50 <FozruciX>	Title: Dropbox - die jaux.xm
11808 23 03:24:57 <brkman3>	wow, you tried to cover it? :o
11818 23 03:25:05 <brkman3>	man, that was like my favorite thing i ever made
11828 23 03:25:08 <golgi>	it was good
11838 23 03:25:10 <golgi>	i was like
11848 23 03:25:13 <golgi>	nagging you to finish it
11858 23 03:25:18 <brkman3>	lol, yeah
11868 23 03:25:23 <brkman3>	but i'm too lazy
11878 23 03:25:33 <brkman3>	and i couldn't think of anything to add
11888 23 03:25:35 <golgi>	it's too old now anyway
11898 23 03:25:49 <brkman3>	nah
11908 23 03:26:03 <brkman3>	i've finished .mid crap sketches that i had made like 5 years prior, lol
11918 23 03:26:16 <Jimmyoshi>	5 years is way too long imo haha
11928 23 03:26:24 <brkman3>	i just
11938 23 03:26:26 <Jimmyoshi>	at that point it'd be best to completely redo it
11948 23 03:26:30 <brkman3>	i undersatnd the whole releasing thing
11958 23 03:26:42 <Jimmyoshi>	like... basically "covering" your old self
11968 23 03:26:43 <brkman3>	like... putting it on the internet made it feel ike a done deal
11978 23 03:26:47 <Jimmyoshi>	unless that's what you meant
11988 23 03:26:59 <brkman3>	so i had no inspiration to work on it more
11998 23 03:27:09 <brkman3>	other than fixing the stuck notes problems, lol
12008 23 03:27:10 <golgi>	https://www.dropbox.com/s/aan10kzcxuf3er0/mozart%20enjoys%20the%20same%20thing%20repeated%20twice%20then%20something%20different%20but%20shorter%20and%20then%20the%20same%20thing%20as%20the%20beginning%20at%20the%20end%20and%20then%20V%20I%20SPAM.it?dl=1 i found me trying to be academic but also golgi at the same time
12018 23 03:27:19 <FozruciX>	type: application/octet-stream File Size: -1.00 B
12028 23 03:27:34 <brkman3>	nah, Jimmyoshi i mean like... it was litereally like... maybe a 10 note motif that i had made. not even partially fleshed out, lol
12038 23 03:27:43 <golgi>	i'm trying to find all the examples of me taking apart shit and then messing with it on my own
12048 23 03:27:56 <golgi>	in what i was describing earlier
12058 23 03:27:57 <brkman3>	and yeah, it's basically like completely reworking i guess
12068 23 03:28:15 <brkman3>	ah this is so cool golgi
12078 23 03:28:16 <golgi>	this is jimmybait because the lead is a pan flute
12088 23 03:28:31 <brkman3>	this is kind of what i wanted it to sound like if it wasn't using stupid samples, lol
12098 23 03:28:36 <Jimmyoshi>	wow
12108 23 03:28:41 <Jimmyoshi>	I'm not *that* superficial :c
12118 23 03:28:55 <brkman3>	pan flute lead is totally sketchbait
12128 23 03:28:55 <Jimmyoshi>	it's  ok I guess
12138 23 03:28:59 <Jimmyoshi>	lol
12148 23 03:29:00 <golgi>	haha
12158 23 03:29:16 <brkman3>	i really like that little flute riff you did, golgi
12168 23 03:29:18 <brkman3>	that's so cool
12178 23 03:29:27 <brkman3>	i wish i had taken up your offer to collab to finish it back then, lol
12188 23 03:29:29 <Jimmyoshi>	the  key change at 7 was good
12198 23 03:29:56 <brkman3>	lol, i was so crushed when you were like "it's too late now, it's too old" back when i finally gave you full permission to do whateve ryou wanted with it, ha
12208 23 03:30:02 <golgi>	well this song doesn't have a lot of charm past the obvious me trying to add my own shit in because i was trying to be academic
12218 23 03:30:09 <golgi>	albeit this is rudimentary shit
12228 23 03:30:34 <brkman3>	lol joseph gaydn
12238 23 03:31:03 <golgi>	https://www.dropbox.com/s/9j92m2t0sm6pxml/ggggggggggggggggggg.xm?dl=0 me trying to take apart a kirby song (probably??????)
12248 23 03:31:06 <FozruciX>	Title: Dropbox - ggggggggggggggggggg.xm
12258 23 03:31:07 <brkman3>	i was like "oh man, my music might be morphed into something actually good by an actually good musician" and then got noped, lol
12268 23 03:31:11 <brkman3>	rip my hopes and dreams
12278 23 03:31:37 <Jimmyoshi>	haha having your songs get covered is always fun
12288 23 03:32:03 <brkman3>	yeah. it's kind of a two-edged sword when you suck, tho, lol
12298 23 03:32:08 <Jimmyoshi>	you know what I suggest actually, brkman3?
12308 23 03:32:15 <Jimmyoshi>	you should collab with another musician
12318 23 03:32:22 <brkman3>	i've done that occasionally
12328 23 03:32:41 <brkman3>	but now that i'm like self-aware and self-conscius it scares me to death
12338 23 03:32:54 <golgi>	https://www.dropbox.com/s/2ihlrnvtzuezn4h/cuicicicicccic.xm?dl=0 i was sincx before sincx existed
12348 23 03:32:57 <FozruciX>	Title: Dropbox - cuicicicicccic.xm
12358 23 03:32:58 <Jimmyoshi>	collabing is good because you can give each other realtime feedback on the song and make tweaks to each other's parts as needed
12368 23 03:33:33 <brkman3>	it was fun collabing with golgi on your mom
12378 23 03:33:39 <golgi>	hahahaha
12388 23 03:33:52 <brkman3>	lol
12398 23 03:33:59 <charlottte>	lol i wanna do more "pastiche ohbs" now
12408 23 03:34:07 <charlottte>	its fun trying to write something just so i can sort of tear it apart
12418 23 03:34:12 <Jimmyoshi>	those are fun too
12428 23 03:34:25 <charlottte>	how many of u know who eriko imura is. wld u consent to an ohb on this theme
12438 23 03:34:33 <brkman3>	i want there to be a pastiche sketchman3 ohb
12448 23 03:34:38 <charlottte>	i'd do that haha
12458 23 03:34:41 <brkman3>	i don't know who eriko imura is
12468 23 03:34:47 <Jimmyoshi>	me neither
12478 23 03:34:48 <charlottte>	mf hold on
12488 23 03:34:52 <charlottte>	YOU TOO??
12498 23 03:34:54 <Jimmyoshi>	but one of my songs was tagged "imura" once
12508 23 03:34:57 <brkman3>	ugh, the thought of a pastiche sketchman3 ohb sickens me at the same time, lol
12518 23 03:34:59 <Jimmyoshi>	yeah lol
12528 23 03:35:03 <charlottte>	man you people don't even know good videogame music, let alo-- goddamnit one fuckin sec
12538 23 03:35:10 <Jimmyoshi>	wow
12548 23 03:35:17 <Jimmyoshi>	I am offended by this statement!
12558 23 03:35:17 <charlottte>	she's good. i promise
12568 23 03:35:20 <brkman3>	because it would just be sucky music that sounds way better than me but also not like me at all, but sucks like me
12578 23 03:35:23 <Jimmyoshi>	(nah not really lol)
12588 23 03:35:28 <brkman3>	lol charlotte, xD
12598 23 03:35:41 <brkman3>	i don't know good videogame music because good vieogame music is in sucky video games, usually 
12608 23 03:36:00 <brkman3>	i might know her music, honestly, just not her name, maube
12618 23 03:36:05 <Jimmyoshi>	yeah same
12628 23 03:36:14 <Jimmyoshi>	I don't know the names of a lot of vgm composers lol
12638 23 03:36:19 <brkman3>	golgi i like the last note of the lead in that cuicuicucicui thing
12648 23 03:36:35 <brkman3>	it tickles my tummy
12658 23 03:36:39 <brkman3>	cuz it's so wrong, xD
12668 23 03:36:42 <brkman3>	<3
12678 23 03:36:45 <brkman3>	i'm so easily amused
12688 23 03:36:47 <charlottte>	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqpC9T847d0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SxqEILN0QtA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JKAx2WTNSw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFtuHnjAT5s
12698 23 03:36:56 <FozruciX>	Title: Klonoa 1 - Melancholy Soldier - YouTube
12708 23 03:37:00 <golgi>	sometimes i feel like my approach to music is too analytical but then i'm like well it's not true analytical
12718 23 03:37:04 <brkman3>	heh, klonoa
12728 23 03:37:15 <Jimmyoshi>	ooh this is nice
12738 23 03:37:20 <charlottte>	golgi your music has improved massively to my ears as of late; suggests you're doing something good lol
12748 23 03:37:30 <brkman3>	ido remember eriko imura being mentioend in connection with klonoa onw that i think of it
12758 23 03:37:53 <brkman3>	lol what is this pokemon rip-off looking poop
12768 23 03:37:57 <golgi>	well the main thing is i'm figuring out how to put whatever ideas i have in my head into actual tangible music
12778 23 03:37:57 <charlottte>	yeah, klonoa's her main thing
12788 23 03:38:06 <golgi>	i mean
12798 23 03:38:08 <golgi>	what i figured out is
12808 23 03:38:11 <golgi>	when i'm in a compo
12818 23 03:38:16 <charlottte>	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=llX0AJ0rxWQ this is i guess her most "famous" song, not that it is
12828 23 03:38:16 <golgi>	i'm just writing some music for a compo
12838 23 03:38:17 <brkman3>	charlotte i think you actually probably shared some klonoa stuff lke back years ago and mentioned her to me
12848 23 03:38:21 <brkman3>	us.. or w/e..
12858 23 03:38:21 <FozruciX>	Title: Klonoa of the Wind - Door to Phantomile - Untamed Heart - YouTube
12868 23 03:38:25 <golgi>	so i just come up with some bullshit that might be coherent
12878 23 03:38:32 <golgi>	and then i just build on that 
12888 23 03:38:32 <charlottte>	lolol
12898 23 03:38:35 <golgi>	haha do you remember me saying
12908 23 03:38:44 <golgi>	i feel like my music is just adding 20 layers of makeup
12918 23 03:38:46 <golgi>	or something
12928 23 03:38:48 <golgi>	a year or two ago
12938 23 03:38:50 <charlottte>	lmao
12948 23 03:38:56 <golgi>	yea that was because it's all compo music
12958 23 03:38:56 <charlottte>	i actually don't, but i like the metaphor
12968 23 03:38:58 <brkman3>	whoa i didn't know klonoa was for playstaiotn
12978 23 03:39:06 <golgi>	and it was like
12988 23 03:39:12 <golgi>	i was literally making music for the compo
12998 23 03:39:18 <charlottte>	man, next you guys are gonna tell me u guys haven't even heard of junya nakano
13008 23 03:39:27 <Jimmyoshi>	um........
13018 23 03:39:28 <Jimmyoshi>	:)
13028 23 03:39:29 <brkman3>	i don't japanese composers
13038 23 03:39:33 <charlottte>	fUCKIn
13048 23 03:39:34 <charlottte>	hold on
13058 23 03:39:36 <brkman3>	i don't even remember the names of the characters in the anime i like lol
13068 23 03:39:37 <Jimmyoshi>	hahaha sorry
13078 23 03:39:39 <golgi>	but like, i actually made the last two songs i did because i wanted to make them
13088 23 03:39:48 <brkman3>	i never played these games
13098 23 03:39:52 <golgi>	the main theme for soraing was stuck in my head for over a month before i put down a single note
13108 23 03:40:10 <brkman3>	it must be nice to have musical ideas
13118 23 03:40:14 <charlottte>	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yp0U2UqsXek https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_8EMpuCgwU
13128 23 03:40:16 <FozruciX>	Title: [Passing Through the Forest - Dewprism/Threads of Fate OST] - YouTube
13138 23 03:40:19 <Jimmyoshi>	some of the motifs in the  midi entry I just did were stuck in my head for almost 2 years
13148 23 03:40:24 <golgi>	great
13158 23 03:40:27 <charlottte>	you have to listen to music to be able to have musical ideas. holy fuck
13168 23 03:40:30 <brkman3>	screw you people who have ideas
13178 23 03:40:38 <charlottte>	now, don't tell me you guys haven't heard of masashi hamauzu
13188 23 03:40:44 <brkman3>	you also have to experience new things, i think
13198 23 03:40:56 <Jimmyoshi>	this is cool sinewave spam
13208 23 03:41:00 <golgi>	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_8EMpuCgwU      rly cool
13218 23 03:41:03 <brkman3>	charlotte just assume that i haven't heard of anybody you're gong to mention in the next 20 minuts and get it over with
13228 23 03:41:07 <Jimmyoshi>	haha I think I have a fetish for sinewave spam or something
13238 23 03:41:38 <charlottte>	you don't even know what you like, oh my goD fuck lemme find some more music
13248 23 03:41:43 <golgi>	charlottte, i also started doing shit irl too haha
13258 23 03:41:52 <golgi>	even by myself
13268 23 03:41:57 <brkman3>	charlotte
13278 23 03:42:00 <brkman3>	how about you 
13288 23 03:42:03 <brkman3>	make a youtube playlist
13298 23 03:42:06 <golgi>	like just riding my bike and coming up with stuff
13308 23 03:42:08 <brkman3>	of all this stuff
13318 23 03:42:16 <golgi>	or trying to imagine what to write up next
13328 23 03:42:21 <Jimmyoshi>	charlotte will just make a bunch of threads on botb
13338 23 03:42:22 <brkman3>	so we can listen to it when my brain is not sleep deprived and unretaining of anthing
13348 23 03:42:25 <Jimmyoshi>	"jimmyoshi watch these"
13358 23 03:42:28 <Jimmyoshi>	"golgi watch these"
13368 23 03:42:34 <Jimmyoshi>	"sketchman watch these"
13378 23 03:42:40 <brkman3>	yay i was included ;u;
13388 23 03:42:41 <Jimmyoshi>	lol that should be a theme
13398 23 03:42:46 <charlottte>	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=loW11_8mzuc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jywr3xVreXk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFT1A-JIcKc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQiH3YO0VB0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvqfPlNozDo
13408 23 03:42:47 <charlottte>	oh my god
13418 23 03:42:53 <brkman3>	lmao
13428 23 03:42:56 <FozruciX>	Title: Blinded by Light - Masashi Hamauzu (Final Fantasy XIII) - YouTube
13438 23 03:43:04 <brkman3>	charlotte do you have ayoutube a account you can make playlists of these?
13448 23 03:43:11 <brkman3>	i ... i can't... it's too much, lol
13458 23 03:43:17 <brkman3>	i can't take it all in as fast as you can post it
13468 23 03:43:17 <charlottte>	should be fucking mandatory to make people have an active interest music before they think they can produce something of their own
13478 23 03:43:29 <golgi>	yes
13488 23 03:43:31 <brkman3>	lol
13498 23 03:43:47 <charlottte>	also i have a tweet chain where i posted abt 90 pieces of vgm hold on
13508 23 03:43:55 <brkman3>	>assuming not having an active interest in video game music
13518 23 03:43:58 <golgi>	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jywr3xVreXk damn this one rules
13528 23 03:44:01 <FozruciX>	Title: UNLIMITED:SaGa - Battle Theme EX (EXTENDED) - YouTube
13538 23 03:44:03 <brkman3>	it always bothered me like
13548 23 03:44:08 <brkman3>	how people would like
13558 23 03:44:10 <brkman3>	be all
13568 23 03:44:11 <brkman3>	 like
13578 23 03:44:17 <charlottte>	no, i get it, you have to be pure. only music you listen to accidentally
13588 23 03:44:26 <charlottte>	https://twitter.com/kayfaraday/status/735285250138492928?lang=en-gb GOD just listen to ths entire thing please
13598 23 03:44:27 <brkman3>	nerding out over the lives and backstories of their favorite artists
13608 23 03:44:33 <brkman3>	no, that's not what i'm saying, haha
13618 23 03:44:37 <charlottte>	every song, go down the list
13628 23 03:44:46 <brkman3>	i do listen to music deliberately
13638 23 03:45:04 <brkman3>	just not jrpg music
13648 23 03:45:40 <charlottte>	well, you're in chiptune territory now. know your roots
13658 23 03:45:40 <brkman3>	how did you come to know about these japanese musicians?
13668 23 03:45:41 <golgi>	i might just be a huge fucking weeaboo but honestly the japs have really figured out a lot of cool stuff about music
13678 23 03:45:50 <Jimmyoshi>	^
13688 23 03:45:52 <golgi>	that really is not apparent anywhere else
13698 23 03:45:54 <brkman3>	lol, final fantasy xiii the roots of chiptune
13708 23 03:46:04 <golgi>	i mean jp music got me into music
13718 23 03:46:06 <golgi>	not jpop but 
13728 23 03:46:08 <golgi>	vgm shit
13738 23 03:46:21 <charlottte>	the west figured it out first, the japanese are just more willing to convert their insight over into cool synths
13748 23 03:46:29 <golgi>	like wtf is it
13758 23 03:46:32 <golgi>	oh really
13768 23 03:46:35 <golgi>	what are examples
13778 23 03:46:54 <brkman3>	chiptune territory can go to hell, tbh, lol
13788 23 03:46:57 <golgi>	i guess only catchy drums and some synth sample shit is tangible to me
13798 23 03:47:06 <charlottte>	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CwACFIYR4M you have this guy to thank for nearly anything with a minor seven in it for example
13808 23 03:47:08 <FozruciX>	Title: (live radio) Debussy - Pour le piano (3/3) - Toccata - Saša Gerželj Donaldson - YouTube
13818 23 03:47:31 <Jimmyoshi>	pretty sure people would have thought of minor 7 chords anyway lol
13828 23 03:47:46 <charlottte>	sure! but he bestowed upon it meaning
13838 23 03:48:10 <golgi>	idk it took hundreds of thousands of years for humans to even come up with anything past singing the same pitch
13848 23 03:48:15 <charlottte>	hahaha
13858 23 03:48:23 <Jimmyoshi>	lol
13868 23 03:48:46 <golgi>	man i used to diss music history like every other fucking idiot on the planet but it really is kinda cool
13878 23 03:48:46 <brkman3>	i've found that listening to music hasn't really contributed much to my musical ideas as much as having unrelated life experiences, tbh
13888 23 03:48:54 <brkman3>	like.... i guess listening to music sows the seeds
13898 23 03:49:00 <brkman3>	but doing things makes them sprout
13908 23 03:49:08 <charlottte>	yeah haha
13918 23 03:49:30 <brkman3>	i am a lazy fan
13928 23 03:49:34 <brkman3>	i've always said this, lol
13938 23 03:49:39 <brkman3>	too casual
13948 23 03:49:52 <brkman3>	"I love this!" >only listens to it once ever
13958 23 03:50:02 <Jimmyoshi>	hahah
13968 23 03:50:04 <golgi>	well usually since i'm not like hypercerebral or some other category of genius when i just listen to a song, i don't hyperanalyze it
13978 23 03:50:08 <golgi>	it takes serious concentration to do it
13988 23 03:50:09 <Jimmyoshi>	it's ok I need to listen to more shit too
13998 23 03:50:15 <charlottte>	all humans are psychos with anywhere between thin to thick veneers of politeness, i'm just trying to thn back yours
14008 23 03:50:17 <golgi>	if i'm just listening to music i'm just like well cool
14018 23 03:50:26 <charlottte>	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPHSHZssOLs another example
14028 23 03:50:31 <FozruciX>	Title: Collard plays Ravel - Pavane pour une infante défunte - YouTube
14038 23 03:50:47 <golgi>	only when i notice something has cool shit popping up and idk how they did it i start getting hyper analytical
14048 23 03:50:49 <golgi>	god what
14058 23 03:50:50 <golgi>	it's 3:50
14068 23 03:50:54 <golgi>	i have class at 10:00
14078 23 03:51:00 <golgi>	i need to get off irc permanently
14088 23 03:51:02 <brkman3>	my interest in music was way more active when i first started trying to make my own stuff, tbh <charlottte> should be fucking mandatory to make people have an active interest music before they think they can produce something of their own
14098 23 03:51:08 <brkman3>	so i met that prerequisite
14108 23 03:51:11 <Jimmyoshi>	yeah I should really sleep too... lol
14118 23 03:51:15 <brkman3>	but.... as you can see my enthusiasm
14128 23 03:51:20 <brkman3>	has dulled
14138 23 03:51:20 <golgi>	i think these discussions are cool but
14148 23 03:51:23 <golgi>	ultimately go nowhere
14158 23 03:51:35 <brkman3>	which shows in my output and my outlook on my musical output and input in general, lol
14168 23 03:51:36 <charlottte>	yeah its like trying to lead a horse to water
14178 23 03:51:39 <golgi>	because then we just go back to our daily lives
14188 23 03:51:48 <charlottte>	they just rationalise why they've drunk the water already
14198 23 03:51:48 <golgi>	doing w/e shit
14208 23 03:51:58 <golgi>	and this is fucking going to kill me irl
14218 23 03:52:06 <brkman3>	I remember when somebody said to try and write some castlevania pastiche
14228 23 03:52:06 <golgi>	i mean i tanked high school because i got jack shit for sleep
14238 23 03:52:11 <brkman3>	i should have taken that advice
14248 23 03:52:17 <brkman3>	i still could
14258 23 03:52:20 <brkman3>	but... too lazy
14268 23 03:52:24 <charlottte>	cool
14278 23 03:52:28 <Jimmyoshi>	well stop being lazy
14288 23 03:52:38 <charlottte>	good for you, i hope that laziness serves you well
14298 23 03:52:49 <brkman3>	i need to find some way to make laziness not be the path of least resistence
14308 23 03:52:56 <Jimmyoshi>	(I'm guilty of being lazy too but I do want to stop :c)
14318 23 03:53:02 <golgi>	maybe guilting you into to doing it is the best way
14328 23 03:53:09 <golgi>	so you feel more guilt from being lazy
14338 23 03:53:33 <brkman3>	i don't understand what this meant, but it seems very presumptuous, lol <charlottte> you don't even know what you like, oh my goD fuck lemme find some more music
14348 23 03:53:46 <charlottte>	lol
14358 23 03:54:00 <Jimmyoshi>	I think charlotte means you just don't listen to enough I guess
14368 23 03:54:04 <golgi>	brkman3, i will at least not regret this conversation for the rest of my life if you either improve at music by doing more serious active listening or something and trying to mess with it on your own
14378 23 03:54:08 <charlottte>	its like asking a 13 year old what political affiliation they have
14388 23 03:54:12 <Jimmyoshi>	I mean obv you know what you like already, but only based on what you've listen to so far
14398 23 03:54:20 <Jimmyoshi>	*listened
14408 23 03:54:23 <charlottte>	uHH i think the government should just be nice to people
14418 23 03:54:24 <brkman3>	ah, that makes sense
14428 23 03:54:32 <brkman3>	is that what you meant charlotte?
14438 23 03:54:35 <brkman3>	lol
14448 23 03:54:50 <golgi>	Jimmyoshi, i will not regret this conversation if us two collectively leave the entire internet
14458 23 03:54:55 <golgi>	that is all i will say
14468 23 03:54:56 <brkman3>	thanks golgi, i'll try
14478 23 03:54:59 <golgi>	oh
14488 23 03:55:08 <Jimmyoshi>	wtf
14498 23 03:55:18 <charlottte>	that's what i meant, yeah. your taste is calibrated on such a tiny speck of the universe that you have no idea what you actually like
14508 23 03:55:30 <brkman3>	okay, that makes way more sense now, lol
14518 23 03:55:45 <brkman3>	i mean i'veheard this kind of stuff before
14528 23 03:55:47 <brkman3>	but yeah
14538 23 03:55:50 <brkman3>	you're totally right
14548 23 03:56:00 <charlottte>	you have no idea what's even OUT there dude
14558 23 03:56:05 <charlottte>	fffuck
14568 23 03:56:14 <Jimmyoshi>	charlotte's seen some shit
14578 23 03:56:14 <brkman3>	well i've heard at least one example of most of it, i think
14588 23 03:56:22 <charlottte>	this is why lazy people barely even seem real to me, they haven't even given themselves the chance to *become* real
14598 23 03:56:27 <brkman3>	i bet you can't show me one thing that sounds totally different from something that i'veheard before
14608 23 03:56:48 <Jimmyoshi>	brkman3....
14618 23 03:56:53 <Jimmyoshi>	this is KF you're saying that too
14628 23 03:56:53 <golgi>	charlottte, i will not regret this conversation for the rest of my life if you somehow realize the abstract is not where it ends, it's only where it begins. it's where you begin the process of making something cool and doing something great, not just being satisfied with the abstract itself
14638 23 03:56:57 <Jimmyoshi>	I wouldn't take that bet ;)
14648 23 03:57:12 <golgi>	okay i am actually going to fall off the face of the internet now
14658 23 03:57:14 <golgi>	right now
14668 23 03:57:15 <brkman3>	hey, i'll placethe bet if there's a chance i'll lose 
14678 23 03:57:17 <golgi>	it's now or never
14688 23 03:57:17 <charlottte>	lol good night
14698 23 03:57:19 <Jimmyoshi>	golgi noooo
14708 23 03:57:20 <brkman3>	i'm betting on losing
14718 23 03:57:24 <brkman3>	the bet
14728 23 03:57:26 <golgi>	hey you know where to contact me
14738 23 03:57:27 <Jimmyoshi>	don't do it it's not worth it
14748 23 03:57:29 <golgi>	it is
14758 23 03:58:01 <Jimmyoshi>	god damnit all of my friends are fucking disappearing from the internet
14768 23 03:58:02 <Jimmyoshi>	I hate it
14778 23 03:58:05 <brkman3>	i remember when my ex... uh... fwb? i guess?
14788 23 03:58:24 <brkman3>	i showed her zanzan's semi-slug
14798 23 03:58:32 <brkman3>	and she was liek "woooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooow this is amazing"
14808 23 03:58:56 <golgi>	golgi, i will not regret this conversation for the rest of my life if you finally, start living in reality and you stop just ending at "oh yea i had this cool idea" and you stop just doing shit like having some vaguely interesting idea and then moving onto something else like some primal animal. get a fucking brain and use it you animal
14818 23 03:58:57 <brkman3>	annd then she went and dug up like every other zanzan song that might be out there on the internet
14828 23 03:59:03 <charlottte>	lmao
14838 23 03:59:11 <charlottte>	at both of those
14848 23 03:59:16 <brkman3>	lol
14858 23 03:59:26 <brkman3>	i realized  how much of a failure i am as a fan
14868 23 03:59:35 <Jimmyoshi>	whoa
14878 23 03:59:41 <golgi>	hey here's my cell phone number
14888 23 03:59:47 <golgi>	(720) 633-7812
14898 23 03:59:50 <golgi>	okay thanks rip
14908 23 03:59:52 <Jimmyoshi>	fuck, you're serious about this aren't you?
14918 23 03:59:53 <Jimmyoshi>	:(
1492**** Tue Aug 23 03:59:55 2016
1493 でログ記録終了