6YnQrBdj

1brucefenton [4:44 PM] 
2Not sure what the issue is.  I haven't seen any evidence he's Satoshi.  If he comes forward with some then that's great, I'll definitely look at anything
3
4bitsko [4:44 PM] 
5whether or not it was a fraud it was made to look like a fraud lol its easy to see why 99.9% of people would conclude its a fraud
6
7brucefenton [4:45 PM] 
8Yeah, I've been a lot more open minded than most people.  I've said that people I respect believe he is and there is definitely a chance of this
9
10jp [4:46 PM] 
11And commented like that is how you open minded.
12
13[4:47] 
14Core and blockstream should have hired you instead of Samson Mow
15
16
17bitsko [4:47 PM] 
18anybody but that damn samson mow lol
19
20brucefenton [4:47 PM] 
21I take that as a compliment -- I'm trying to be as respectful and objective with everyone as I can
22
23bitsko [4:48 PM] 
24should hire alphonse
25
26
27jp [4:48 PM] 
28Hire dandarkpill too lol
29 
30
31bitsko [4:48 PM] 
32pay dan! for sure pay dan
33
34brucefenton [4:48 PM] 
35@jp you seem upset.   I'm sorry for whatever I did that made you upset at me
36
37jp [4:49 PM] 
38It is obvious. I told you to stay out. You didn't listen.
39
40brucefenton [4:49 PM] 
41You claim to have better information about CW than me...which is great for you....so why would you expect me to blindly believe something without the same knowledge you have?
42
43jp [4:50 PM] 
44If you really want good thing for bitcoin, at least know what is right what is wrong
45
46brucefenton [4:50 PM] 
47@jp I have stayed out...I don't even remember the last time I talked about him...even now with the nchain news I haven't commented
48
49jp [4:50 PM] 
50Csw is a con man and an asshole. Move along. Nothing to see here. Vlad2vlad has information more.
51
52[4:51] 
53Oh man. Then what did you tweet then?
54
55[4:51] 
56Don't even remember - I just posted your tweets here. It is even pinned.
57
58brucefenton [4:53 PM] 
59I bet it's not as bad as you remember-- don't assume the worst about me, I'm probably not your enemy
60
61jp [4:53 PM] 
62I will say one time. You don't want to be rekt in between core vs new force.
63
64brucefenton [4:54 PM] 
65Well thank you for the advice
66
67jp [4:55 PM] 
68You have strong good voice in the community.
69
70[4:55] 
71Show your support on core or nchain will damage your rep
72
73[4:55] 
74I highly recommend you to not comment on either core nor nchain. At the end of the day, if nchain wins then cast your voice to nchain and vice versa.
75
76brucefenton [4:55 PM] 
77I've been pretty supportive of core, I thought that's what was the problem
78
79jp [4:56 PM] 
80As I said, if you want to move to litecoin or altcoin then do it now
81
82[4:57] 
83But if you want to stay in bitcoin, don't get r3kt.
84
85[4:58] 
86We do not forgive, we do not forget those dark days when we were drowned in core piss
87
88brucefenton [5:00 PM] 
89Well thank you, I respect your thoughts
90
91tomothy 
92[5:01 PM] 
93Fyi, gdax, $1533...
94
95tomothy 
96[5:10 PM] 
97Guys are we selling at 1650? 2000? Or do we just keep holding?
98
99jp [5:11 PM] 
100HODL. Those sold at ath 1400 can't buy back now.
101
102
103[5:11] 
104Calvin still buys
105
106tomothy 
107[5:12 PM] 
108There you have it bitsko, I'd say wait
109
110jp [5:16 PM] 
111Think bigger. Not a few cent.
112
113
114snoop [5:46 PM] 
115Bruce Fenton. What a guy.
116
117jp [5:48 PM] 
118Did lecturing at a govt agency do NOT make you becoming secret agent.
119
120tomothy 
121[5:50 PM] 
122They haven't started with that yet. You guys are jumping the gun on their next plan of attack. Unless I've missed a post
123
124jp [5:50 PM] 
125You heard it here first ;)
126
127tomothy 
128[5:51 PM] 
129LMFAO you can't start a smear campaign for them! It's not supposed to work that way!
130
131jp [5:55 PM] 
132They have dat campaign for long time. Not new work
133
134bitsko [5:59 PM] 
135https://www.reddit.com/r/btc/comments/69318u/save_the_chain_enclosed_1_mb_transaction_with_273/
136reddit
137Save the Chain! Enclosed: 1 MB transaction with 273 BTC in fees • r/btc
138This is my love letter to the Bitcoin Blockchain. --- begin 664 savethechain.tx.bz2 ...
139 
140
141
142----- Today May 4th, 2017 -----
143christophbergmann [1:00 AM] 
144Hei, @vlad2vlad are you here?
145
146[1:01] 
147You said CSW could answer any question I ask through your voice
148
149vlad2vlad [1:01 AM] 
150Ask away
151
152christophbergmann [1:01 AM] 
153cool ... I will ask several questions in next half hour
154
155[1:01] 
156First ... how did it come that you have become the voice of CSW?
157
158vlad2vlad [1:02 AM] 
159Destiny?
160
161[1:02] 
162Or you want me to ask him?
163
164[1:04] 
165I sent him the question.  Any other ones.
166
167christophbergmann [1:06 AM] 
168No, yes, both ... I mean, I guess he did not just call you and said: Vlad, be my voice. Did you search him? How did you win his trust?
169
170vlad2vlad [1:06 AM] 
171Here's what he said:  You are a little mad, as I am and I would not say you are my voice.  And more than that, you never treated me like shit.  You never required that I prove anything to befriend me.  You are always civil.
172
173[1:08] 
174I was hitting him up on twitter last year and I also sent him some emails but I didn't expect anything to come of it.  I tend to try and talk to all the major industry players.
175
176christophbergmann [1:09 AM] 
177When did you start believe that he is Satoshiß
178
179[1:09] 
180?
181
182[1:09] 
183thank you for taking the time, btw
184
185vlad2vlad [1:11 AM] 
186I personally thought he was Satoshi before it was leaked, when I saw a 2 part video from like 2015 I think.  That's what sold me on it.  Then when he came out and all that crazy stuff happened it was confusing but I figured there had to be some logical explanation for it all so, unlike most people, I gave him the benefit of the doubt.  I felt he at least deserved that.  Everyone does until there's real proof.  Media sound bytes are never proof for me.
187
188
189christophbergmann [1:12 AM] 
190Thanks
191
192[1:12] 
193What did he do 2010-2015?
194
195vlad2vlad [1:20 AM] 
1962010-2011. I was in a shit place family wise>
197
198I was in a court battle with the Tax office (I won this in 2012)
199
200[1:23] 
201In 2011 I started a co again.  I moved assets in 2011.  And I did contract code and security work.  I was teaching at CSU until 2014.  CSU runs the Police and military training.
202
203[1:24] 
204From 2010 to 2013 I worked for both gaming co.s and LE.  They are both the ones who cared about risk. Not that perfect security is all, but risk.
205
206[1:25] 
207I had too many things answering gov questions form 2014 on
208
209[1:26] 
210I had a farm, a ranch really.  Middle of nowhere.  No people closer than 1KM.  I could work with no disturbances.  I sold it to fund some of the companies as well as other assets.  I loved that place. My work comes first.
211
212[1:27] 
213Next question, @christophbergmann
214
215christophbergmann [1:28 AM] 
216why did he leave Bitcoin in 2010?
217
218vlad2vlad [1:38 AM] 
219I was in battles, one after another to keep what I was working on.
220
221[1:39] 
222https://www.comcourts.gov.au/file/Federal/P/SYG746/2010/actions
223
224[1:40] 
225I do not want to have people follow me.  I want people to read and think.  I want them to question and validate.  Not to take my word or for that matter, anybodies.  And worse, do not look at something in the past and make that the yardstick.
226
227christophbergmann [1:41 AM] 
228didn't know this source.
229
230[1:42] 
231Can you explain what happened? While you continued working on Bitcoin, your company went bankrupt?
232
233vlad2vlad [1:48 AM] 
234In 2003 I had a fight with a 5% shareholder.  My first wife sided with him as she wanted me to be home more.  I ended up in an 11 year court battle.  Settled part and got the company.  I ended up winning.  You have the final judgements.  are district court, so not on google and people only see what they can easily google.
235
236[1:49] 
237Here is what you can tell them all..
238
239IF you need to do what I say as I am Satoshi and not because of the idea I am presenting, but the nature of my identity, then you are all lost!
240
241If you cannot think for yourself, then all this was for nothing
242
243[1:49] 
244If you judge based on an identity alone, on a perceived authority, then you are sheeple and deserve all you get
245
246[1:52] 
247----
248
249[1:52] 
250https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10702001
251
252list of "8 2 9 10 11", which is the list that GNUPG started generating a year (commit e50cac1d848d332c4dbf49d5f705d3cbbf074ba1) after the date on the key.
253
254BS utter BS.
255
256And this was written as I write, not a paid piece, but as I do and I was the author of the Authority paper.
257
258And it was independantly validated.
259
260It is simple and who actually checks?  
261
262Gmax says and it is law.
263
264[1:52] 
265Think. Learn that code is a tool and us humans can use tools, but it is not a panacea and can solve nothing on its own.
266
267[1:57] 
268There is no form of non-repudiation. This is stated again and again by those with a past in (applied)cryptography. Yet, it is a concept that does not exist.
269
270We live in a world of people. Code is a tool, it is a means to ensure that we can control our destiny if we use it well, but it does not remove the need to check and will never remove the need to think.
271
272christophbergmann [1:57 AM] 
273Yeah, Greg seems obsessed with calling you a conman ...
274
275vlad2vlad [1:57 AM] 
276Non-Repudiation can never exist as we live in a world of law. Law is Law. Crypto is a tool that adds weight to evidence, but it is not law.
277
278I can sign and then say my key was stolen. I can pass a key to another. This is a well established principle. In the courts, it is always possible to repudiate.
279
280I learned this the hard way. In my case, I was given a contempt citation as I argued the fact that electronic evidence supported my assertions. I learnt that law is law in 2004 when I argued that evidence of source information can be used against you and can be falsified and that it is not possible to simply show a key as proof.
281
282[1:58] 
283----
284MiniMax, err, Greg, is a douche.  <------ my words.  :)
285
286[1:58] 
287---
288
289[1:58] 
290Bitcoin is code. It has all the faults that code has. It does not make the world an anarchist playground and with it we are not free. We are free when we are free. We are free only when we allow our minds to be free.
291
292[1:59] 
293We are in a tragic world. There are no fair solutions, the world is simply not fair and we can do no more than make it worse by interfering with markets and free choice.
294
295[1:59] 
296‘a piratis et latronibus capta domimium non mutant’
297
298Look it up. It is a concept of law.
299
300christophbergmann [2:00 AM] 
301Did you sleep in this time? You had a company, a family and developed Bitcoin.
302
303vlad2vlad [2:01 AM] 
304Theft of keys is a means to have access to keys, and what does it prove, only that you hold a key. Any transaction can be recovered. If you think this is not the case, deal with those with guns. Tax is forced, but try and avoid the force.  Try legally.
305
306[2:01] 
307I spend millions to win a case worth 1.1 million. Pyrrhic. And what was the use. It changed nothing.
308
309[2:02] 
310End rant...
311
312vlad2vlad [2:08 AM] 
313I have a company. I have a family and I am enrolled in a Masters degree right now.  When I complete this degree, I will start another PhD.  
314
315Back then, I was also going to conferences, this I can no longer do.
316
317I am a full fee student. I do not take money for this.  I pay my own way.  No scholarships.  My choice.
318
319[2:08] 
320So, why is this such an issue for so many people?  I enjoy learning and knowledge.
321
322[2:10] 
323---
324
325[2:10] 
326https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10702001
327
328The following is the sane response:
329
330"grovulent 512 days ago [-]
331
332As others have pointed out - it's arguable that publishing any claim about the identity of SN - puts the target in considerable, potential danger.
333Now I can understand that there is a public interest component in knowing SN's identity. And I'd even be willing to accept (but really only for sake of argument) that this public interest overrides SN's own right to privacy and safety.
334But to make these accusations when you yourself admit - as the article does - that there is a substantial degree of doubt, is to put at risk the safety and privacy of a person who doesn't deserve it in the least.
335This is an absolutely appalling thing to do to anyone. And it should be prima-facie obvious to you as to why.
336While I don't condone bullying of any sort - it really is the least of what these authors deserve. I personally don't feel Kanzure is bullying - merely pointing out how appalling this behaviour is, and this absolutely needs to be pointed out."
337
338christophbergmann [2:11 AM] 
339are you sad that you left Bitcoin in 2010? Was it a mistake?
340
341vlad2vlad [2:15 AM] 
342As for gaining... I gain nothing by proving I am Satoshi.
343My family gains nothing. We go into moving again.
344
345I do not get money and I DO NOT want fame
346
347[2:17] 
348I did not leave Bitcoin. Gavin was left to manage the code with others.  That is not leaving.
349
350christophbergmann [2:18 AM] 
351How would you call it then?
352
353vlad2vlad [2:23 AM] 
354I stopped responding to trolls.  The base protocol was and is fine.
355
356christophbergmann [2:29 AM] 
357what is the base protocol?
358
359vlad2vlad [2:31 AM] 
360With the cap removed it remains ok.
361
362christophbergmann [2:31 AM] 
363which version?
364
365[2:32] 
366I'm not so interested in Blocksize things. We had this over and over, it already bored out Bitcoin
367
368vlad2vlad [2:36 AM] 
369This is the answer to "what is the base protocol"?
370
371[2:36] 
372The means to have miners controls the network through competition. The exchange of blocks, the format, the original script and protocols.
373
374For example:
375
376https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/main.cpp#L2249
377
378See the comments that they all ignore.
379
380Prove that is not Satoshi. I do not need to sign anything and I do not need to jump their hoops, it is the code.
381GitHub
382trottier/original-bitcoin
383original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
384 
385
386christophbergmann [2:42 AM] 
387I wondered how can I know that this is the original codebase ...
388
389[2:42] 
390Some other question
391
392[2:42] 
393Why did you not publish a signed message?
394
395vlad2vlad [2:43 AM] 
396Continued from last response:                         What we need is simple, it is competition. Not a central authority. Not a 1984 double speak committee, but open and free competition.
397
398This means that people are allowed to build on top of the base protocol. That the miners decide (see the 08 paper). If people do not like it, they can lobby miners or better, invest in hash power.
399
400This way, changes are made based on what the market decides. Not an authority, the market. Each tries and fails and grows based on supply to a market.
401
402vlad2vlad [2:49 AM] 
403Answer to your last questing about signing a message:
404
405[2:49] 
406URGH!
407
4081. Tax. I am not offering proof that is proof. If I can access or not is MY business and it stays that way.
409
4102. More importantly, stop looking to a bloody saviour!
411
412Markets are the answer, free open competition.  Not Satoshi on his bloody white horse. Markets!
413
414[2:51] 
415Layer 2 networks will require the introduction of AML and intermediary controls. These are localised networks in the form of existing intermediaries.
416
417They can be allowed to operate with Bitcoin competitively, but not at the expense of open exchange. This being what they fear, why use L2 if you have no need?
418
419[2:52] 
420Those who do not think that government can set in and control this are either naive or malicious. There is no other view. This is not a false dichotomy. These are the only options.
421
422[2:53] 
423In all cases, L2 will require systems that can be controlled and they will require the interaction of merchants and other parties. Networks such as lightning centralise and offer control on a platter.
424
425christophbergmann [2:53 AM] 
426Something else ... now you are Chief Scientis at nChain, right?
427
428vlad2vlad [3:02 AM] 
429Yes. I will not discuss the company though.
430
431[3:02] 
432The others will. I say too much and get in trouble already.
433
434[3:03] 
435I am not a CEO for a good reason. I am good at maths and code, I can write responses that nobody reads that are cogent and sincere, but when it comes to politics and fronting things, I just dig holes for myself
436
437christophbergmann [3:06 AM] 
438Ok, can you say when the software will go open source?
439
440vlad2vlad [3:24 AM] 
441Not answering re times for Open Source.  It is underway.
442
443cryptonaut [3:34 AM] 
444@vlad2vlad CSW won't use slack or something? Would be interesting to get him on here.
445
446vlad2vlad [3:35 AM] 
447I seriously doubt it but I'll ask him@
448
449cryptonaut [3:36 AM] 
450Here's a question. Is Scronty legit or is this story just some fan fiction? (long read, but seems to align closely with the CSW story) https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/5aflch/bitcoin_origins/
451reddit
452Bitcoin Origins • r/Bitcoin
453Afternoon, All. Today marks the eighth anniversary of the publication of the Bitcoin white paper. As a special tribute, I will provide you with...
454 
455
456[3:38] 
457If CSW is true and that above thread is true, Team Satoshi appears to consist of Craig, whoever that Scronty guy is, and David
458
459vlad2vlad [3:38 AM] 
460Dr. Wright says he'll come take a look in this channel but he's not gonna join.
461
462[3:39] 
463Who's got a link for this channel?
464
465cryptonaut [3:40 AM] 
466if you click on your name in the top left corner there should be an option to invite people by email
467
468[3:41] 
469tell him to make a throwaway if he wants to check it out but not join and get harrassed
470
471csw [3:43 AM] 
472joined #general
473
474cryptonaut [3:43 AM] 
475:new_moon_with_face: :rocket:
476
477csw [3:44 AM] 
478Scronty is a wanker
479
480csw [3:44 AM] 
481I am tired of people saying they worked with me. Scronty even got the number of BTC wrong.
482
483 2 replies Last reply today at 6:18 AM View thread
484
485vlad2vlad [3:45 AM] 
486Welcome Dr. Wright!!!!
487
488cryptonaut [3:45 AM] 
489so just some fan fiction then? and yes, welcome :smile:
490
491csw [3:46 AM] 
492Yes, and not a fan
493
494[3:47] 
495"I wondered how can I know that this is the original codebase ..."
496
497[3:47] 
498It is not, it is close, but it is available on the satoshi Inst as well.
499
500cryptonaut [3:47 AM] 
501Are you able to say how many there were on the team? 3, or was there more? Not that it matters really
502
503csw [3:47 AM] 
504The first released code was 0.0.9
505
506[3:47] 
507It crashed.
508
509onchainscaling [3:47 AM] 
510Why was 21 million chosen? was it arbitrary number or is there a reason for that particular number?
511
512csw [3:48 AM] 
513The first other users are Bear and Hal
514
515[3:48] 
516M1
517
518[3:48] 
51921 million links to global M1
520
521christophbergmann [3:48 AM] 
522Hallo Mr. Wright!
523
524csw [3:49 AM] 
525There are no decimal points, 21 million is the reference for people, the no. Satoshi (and I did not call them that) are related to M1 (edited)
526
527cryptonaut [3:50 AM] 
528can you expand on that?
529
530csw [3:50 AM] 
531http://lexicon.ft.com/Term?term=m0,-m1,-m2,-m3,-m4
532
533[3:51] 
534If you read the 08 paper, you will note the use of fiat as a value.
535
536[3:51] 
537Sect, 9. Page 5
538
539[3:51] 
540In the use of 21 million x 10^8 parts you have a value that maps to the cent
541
542[3:51] 
543That is, to global M1
544
545vlad2vlad [3:52 AM] 
546So bitcoin is meant to displace global fiat
547
548[3:52] 
549?
550
551csw [3:52 AM] 
552This would be 21,000,000,000,000 USD as M1.
553
55421,000 trillion
555
556[3:52] 
557The idea is global cash.
558
559[3:52] 
560A single world currency
561
562[3:53] 
563Can I assume that you have read Hayek's work on global money?
564
565vlad2vlad [3:53 AM] 
566You're not gonna have many friends out there.  But if you can pull it off bitcoin is gonna reach astronomical levels.
567
568[3:53] 
569No.  But i will.  :)
570
571csw [3:53 AM] 
572I have few friends.
573
574cryptonaut [3:53 AM] 
575section 9 is titled 'combining and splitting value" and does not mention a fiat value
576
577csw [3:54 AM] 
578I am not looking for them, I work best as I am and I find having a head in maths and code does not make one amiable to others.
579
580[3:54] 
581"Although it would be possible to handle coins individually, it would be unwieldy to make a
582separate transaction for every cent in a transfer"
583
584[3:55] 
585I believe that you will find that in S9.
586
587cryptonaut [3:55 AM] 
588right
589
590[3:56] 
591gotcha
592
593csw [3:56 AM] 
594I am sorry, I can be a little vague... If I am, ask for explanations.
595
596[3:56] 
597I make assumptions of knowledge
598
599cryptonaut [3:57 AM] 
600all good, just trying to piece together
601
602csw [3:57 AM] 
603It comes from too long inside universities
604
605cryptonaut [3:57 AM] 
606never been :wink:
607
608csw [3:57 AM] 
609Never been out...
610
611
612vlad2vlad [3:57 AM] 
613Lol
614
615csw [4:00 AM] 
616Re: Bitcoin P2P e-cash paper 2008-11-10 14:09:26 UTC
617
618
619James A. Donald wrote:
620> Furthermore, it cannot be made to work, as in the
621> proposed system the work of tracking who owns what coins
622> is paid for by seigniorage, which requires inflation.
623
624If you're having trouble with the inflation issue, it's easy to tweak it for 
625transaction fees instead. It's as simple as this: let the output value from 
626any transaction be 1 cent less than the input value. Either the client 
627software automatically writes transactions for 1 cent more than the intended 
628payment value, or it could come out of the payee's side. The incentive value 
629when a node finds a proof-of-work for a block could be the total of the fees in 
630the block.
631
632Satoshi Nakamoto
633
634cryptonaut [4:01 AM] 
635Hah. So google tells me M1 USD supply is just under 2.1 trillion. Total # of satoshis is 2100 trillion. Close enough I say lol.
636
637csw [4:01 AM] 
638https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/util.cpp#L210
639GitHub
640trottier/original-bitcoin
641original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
642 
643
644[4:02] 
645Have a look at the code.
646
647[4:03] 
648n /= CENT;
649
650@212; 255; 261
651in src/util.cpp
652
653[4:03] 
654https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/main.h#L17
655GitHub
656trottier/original-bitcoin
657original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
658 
659
660[4:03] 
661Main.h
662
663[4:03] 
664Defined against Cents
665
666[4:04] 
667// Value
668        int64 nValue = (GetRand(9) + 1) * 100 * CENT;
669        if (GetBalance() < nValue)
670        {
671            wxMessageBox("Out of money ");
672            return;
673        }
674        nValue += (nRep % 100) * CENT;
675
676[4:04] 
677https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/ui.cpp#L3178
678GitHub
679trottier/original-bitcoin
680original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
681 
682
683[4:04] 
684Do you require more evidence?
685
686cryptonaut [4:08 AM] 
687makes sense to me. Here's one for you though: what was the thinking behind adding the 1MB block limit that we are now dealing with 2.5+ years drama to solve?
688
689csw [4:08 AM] 
690https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/main.cpp
691GitHub
692trottier/original-bitcoin
693original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
694 
695
696[4:09] 
697// Transaction fee requirements, mainly only needed for flood control
698                    // Under 10K (about 80 inputs) is free for first 100 transactions
699                    // Base rate is 0.01 per KB
700                    int64 nMinFee = tx.GetMinFee(pblock->vtx.size() < 100);
701
702[4:09] 
703At 0.08 cents a BTC, flood control did not work.
704
705[4:09] 
706At more than 100USD, it does
707
708[4:09] 
709We are at more than 100USD a BTC right now.
710
711[4:10] 
712In early 2010, the number of nodes (please note, nodes are always verification agents, that is miners) was low. (edited)
713
714cryptonaut [4:10 AM] 
715friggin $2200 canadian on localbitcoins right now
716
717csw [4:11 AM] 
718It should be higher. The more people can use BitCoin natively, the more the value will increase.
719
720
721cryptonaut [4:11 AM] 
722spelling it BitCoin is heresy you know :stuck_out_tongue:
723
724csw [4:12 AM] 
725This is not as has been suggested exponential, but logistic
726
727[4:12] 
728It was in the early code as BitCoin
729
730cryptonaut [4:12 AM] 
731eh, looks ugly though. But yeah, to the moon and such
732
733csw [4:12 AM] 
734https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/readme.txt
735GitHub
736trottier/original-bitcoin
737original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
738 
739
740[4:13] 
741Line 1: BitCoin v0.1.3 ALPHA
742
743cryptonaut [4:13 AM] 
744Line 13: Bitcoin. Inconsistent lol
745
746csw [4:13 AM] 
747I have never been accused of being a designer
748
749[4:13] 
750I also never said I am perfect and yes, I do go back and forth.
751
752[4:14] 
753Lines 34 - 36:
754
755To support the network by running a node, select:
756
757 Options->Generate Coins
758
759cryptonaut [4:14 AM] 
760I tend to do the same when naming things
761
762csw [4:14 AM] 
763Code naming conventions do not always move into the real world well.
764
765cryptonaut [4:14 AM] 
766true
767
768csw [4:14 AM] 
769Words are not variables as much as I would like to have this be so
770
771[4:16] 
772I thought the comments in the code were rather good, then it seems they are either ignored or they are not read.
773
774[4:16] 
775Either saddens me, though I cannot state which would sadden me more.
776
777cryptonaut [4:16 AM] 
778which points or comments do you feel are being ignored?
779
780csw [4:17 AM] 
781Have you read Brooks?
782
783[4:17] 
784Mythical Man Month, 1975, 1995 re-printed
785
786cryptonaut [4:17 AM] 
787I have not
788
789csw [4:17 AM] 
790A shame.
791
792[4:17] 
793Page 65 from memory of Brooks
794
795[4:18] 
796Triple redundancy
797
798[4:18] 
799//
800// "Never go to sea with two chronometers; take one or three."
801// Our three chronometers are:
802//  - System clock
803//  - Median of other server's clocks
804//  - NTP servers
805//
806// note: NTP isn't implemented yet, so until then we just use the median
807//  of other nodes clocks to correct ours.
808//
809
810[4:18] 
811https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/util.cpp#L326
812GitHub
813trottier/original-bitcoin
814original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
815 
816
817[4:19] 
818I do not see why there are arguments on things link the use off NTP as a base that is averaged in the system between nodes.
819
820[4:19] 
821The code has a number of comments stating that this is to be done.
822
823[4:20] 
824// Only let other nodes change our clock so far before we
825            // go to the NTP servers
826            /// todo: Get time from NTP servers, then set a flag
827            ///    to make sure it doesn't get changed again
828        }
829
830[4:22] 
831And it should not be monolithic...
832
833https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/net.cpp#L893
834GitHub
835trottier/original-bitcoin
836original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
837 
838
839[4:22] 
840//// todo: start one thread per processor, use getenv("NUMBER_OF_PROCESSORS")
841
842[4:22] 
843And the market place was never fixed.
844https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/ui.cpp#L1619
845GitHub
846trottier/original-bitcoin
847original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
848 
849
850cryptonaut [4:23 AM] 
851I'm not too familiar with the nuances of NTP and server clocks etc, just a humble web developer. To get back to the 1MB block size thing for a second - did you anticipate the difficulty of removing or replacing the limit that we are currently experiencing?
852
853csw [4:23 AM] 
854There was supposed to be a means to have a merchant exchange a message with the purchaser. This would be a direct PoS system, no need for Visa etc.
855
856[4:24] 
8572010
858
859[4:24] 
860See email
861
862[4:24] 
863Well before we get to where we are RIGHT NOW it is possible to preempt this and have an increase.
864
865jp [4:25 AM] 
866Why did you credit Adam Back hashcash when you didn't use it?
867
868csw [4:25 AM] 
869Adam intro'd Wei
870
871[4:25] 
872I do not generally talk to people I do not know. Not without an intro
873
874jp [4:26 AM] 
875But why credit him while you not used his? This wrong citation creates this evil blockstream
876
877csw [4:26 AM] 
878Adam was helpful for all that he said it would not work, but I am used to people saying my work is not worth considering.
879
880jp [4:26 AM] 
881Why you didn't credit triple entry accounting?
882
883csw [4:27 AM] 
884I am not able to see the future.
885
886cryptonaut [4:27 AM] 
887re: merchant exchange, decent idea but probably premature and not the best idea to put so many use cases into a single application (for example, the wallet accounts system used by Core is total garbage)
888
889csw [4:27 AM] 
890The list of references would be in the 100s of pages if I was to list the giants it was built to stand upon.
891
892jp [4:28 AM] 
893You used triple entry accounting in 2005 to inspire blockchain. But instead you credited something not actually used
894
895csw [4:28 AM] 
896Yes, the marketplace was far too early. And my design skills are far too poor.
897
898[4:28] 
899Using wxHtml was also a mistake.
900
901jp [4:29 AM] 
902It is why Ian grigg was heavily undervalued while core Adam back is crook
903
904cryptonaut [4:29 AM] 
905the idea for PoW is an iteration/evolution of hashcash so I don't think the citation is off base really
906
907csw [4:29 AM] 
908And triple entry accounting was something I stayed away from commenting
909
910jp [4:29 AM] 
911It is not too late to comment now
912
913csw [4:29 AM] 
914It was something I was introduced to when I was working at BDO, an accounting firm
915
916jp [4:29 AM] 
917Yes. Granger did
918
919csw [4:31 AM] 
920Again, I never foresaw the world to come as it has come. I did not see the politics. I saw state actors as more the issue than Adam B(l)ack
921
922
923jp [4:31 AM] 
924I Think you should also correct the citation.  Adam back himself was surprised when he saw he was credited
925
926christophbergmann [4:31 AM] 
927why was Ian Grigg heavily undervalued, @jp ?
928
929cryptonaut [4:31 AM] 
930what a mind trip adam must have had lol
931
932jp [4:32 AM] 
933He was the one kept looking for hmwjo SN was because he was surprised as his name was included in whitepaper while he knew hashcash was not used
934
935csw [4:32 AM] 
936It is published. Papers should not be played with
937
938[4:32] 
939I am not a god, I am a researcher. I code, I do maths and I am fallible. (edited)
940
941jp [4:33 AM] 
942It is not late to correctly credit people whose works you used.
943
944[4:33] 
945Adam back is not and should not be on whitepaper because of just an introduction email to Wei Dai
946
947csw [4:34 AM] 
948Should not. Is. These are separate concepts.
949
950tomothy 
951[4:34 AM] 
952I know you touched on the 1mb cap and mining but can you comment on the idea of the UASF, (user activated soft fork) and your thought on using it to implement segwit? Also general thoughts on segwit? Thanks.
953
954csw [4:34 AM] 
955I do not want to be found. I did not want to be found.
956
957cryptonaut [4:34 AM] 
958frankly unless csw somehow 100% proves he is satoshi, any whitepaper update wouldn't be taken seriously and probably a waste of time. Plus blockstream is already a thing, too late for that
959
960
961csw [4:35 AM] 
962UASF - Miners are nodes. Nodes are miners.
963
964[4:35] 
965There are NO full non-mining nodes.
966
967
968[4:35] 
969Please read the paper.
970
971[4:35] 
972It is VERY VERY clear
973
974[4:35] 
975If you have issues, look at the code.
976
977tomothy 
978[4:35 AM] 
979And then segwit generally?
980
981csw [4:36 AM] 
982"Nodes" that are not mining are wallets, these are fat SPV systems and sock puppets
983
984[4:36] 
985SegWit centralises the system
986
987jp [4:36 AM] 
988What is your plan to stop segwit? A hard fork coming soon?
989
990csw [4:36 AM] 
991It means that developers can make further changes without a consensus
992
993bdd [4:36 AM] 
994joined #general
995
996csw [4:37 AM] 
997There will not be an update. Mistakes on referencing or not
998
999tomothy 
1000[4:37 AM] 
1001To the best of your knowledge, does segwit infringe on any patents?
1002
1003csw [4:38 AM] 
1004And I will not prove. I am not here to prove. If you need to listen as you think that I am and this is the sole reason, then it is lost to you in any event.
1005
1006[4:38] 
1007Tomothy.
1008
1009[4:38] 
1010Yes
1011
1012[4:38] 
1013I cannot expand on that here and now.
1014
1015[4:39] 
1016That will be addressed soon and in the manner that is requires
1017
1018tomothy 
1019[4:39 AM] 
1020And is it safe to the assume that the creators of segwit had alterior motives for creating it, introducing it, and refusing to increase 1mb limit?
1021
1022[4:39] 
1023Understood. Eagerly await.
1024
1025csw [4:39 AM] 
1026I cannot speak for the motivations of others I do not know intimately
1027
1028jp [4:39 AM] 
1029What can we do to help?
1030
1031
1032csw [4:40 AM] 
1033Law is Law. 
1034Cryptographic tools are tools. 
1035I know many do not see this, but when it comes to intellectual property, it is rather certain.
1036
1037[4:40] 
1038To help... compete.
1039
1040[4:40] 
1041Competition and markets are the source of human freedom and innovation.
1042
1043[4:41] 
1044Make something.
1045 
1046
1047[4:41] 
1048Develop
1049
1050jp [4:41 AM] 
1051Compete in what way? I see that the SDK is one stone two birds. Kill core and alts
1052
1053csw [4:41 AM] 
1054And if you fail for the n-th time... Start and try again.
1055
1056cryptonaut [4:41 AM] 
1057amen to that, @jp compete in all ways :stuck_out_tongue:
1058
1059[4:41] 
1060getting super late here, I'm out guys. Cheers
1061
1062
1063jp [4:41 AM] 
1064Will there be any smart contract applications coming?
1065
1066csw [4:41 AM] 
1067I cannot discuss that./
1068
1069[4:42] 
1070I also need to go. 
1071I am sorry, but I have a lot to do.
1072 
1073
1074jp [4:42 AM] 
1075Thank you.
1076
1077tomothy 
1078[4:42 AM] 
1079Same, thanks for providing so many responses!
1080
1081csw [4:42 AM] 
1082Please, all I ask is do not follow me, a developer or anyone based on who they are. Look anytime, everytime on the solution, the effects and the trade-off.
1083 
1084
1085bitsko [4:43 AM] 
1086thank you for your thoughts!
1087
1088csw [4:43 AM] 
1089Please remember, this is a world of scarcity, there is always something that is a trade-off, a cost and we cannot just assume that a change comes without a cost.
1090
1091[4:43] 
1092Fair well.
1093 
1094
1095jp [4:45 AM] 
1096And he gone.
1097
1098cypherblock [4:45 AM] 
1099well that was interesting.
1100
1101bitsko [4:46 AM] 
1102:awesome: :ohyeah: :awesome: :ohyeah: :success: :success: :wut: :rocket:
1103
1104norway [4:47 AM] 
1105This is crazy.
1106
1107tomothy 
1108[4:47 AM] 
1109Thanks for making that happen vlad
1110
1111vlad2vlad [4:47 AM] 
1112BOOM!!!  Told you guys Dr Wright was the real deal!!!
1113
1114tomothy 
1115[4:47 AM] 
1116I still expect some God damn fireworks though. That better not be the end of it.
1117
1118
1119vlad2vlad [4:47 AM] 
1120I do what I do.  ;p
1121
1122[4:48] 
1123I don't think that's the end of it.  It's like core is gonna compromise.
1124
1125tomothy 
1126[4:48 AM] 
1127We need that tabloid inquirer type juice too
1128
1129jp [4:48 AM] 
1130I told you were a working tool. Good one.
1131
1132vlad2vlad [4:48 AM] 
1133Lol.
1134
1135tomothy 
1136[4:48 AM] 
1137LOL compromise LOL
1138
1139vlad2vlad [4:48 AM] 
1140Haha
1141
1142norway [4:49 AM] 
1143I like this one: "There are NO full non-mining nodes."
1144
1145
1146cypherblock [4:49 AM] 
1147I thought his first post was interesting.
1148
1149norway [4:50 AM] 
1150Bitcoin mapped to current M1 makes a lot of sense.
1151
1152vlad2vlad [4:50 AM] 
1153Replace cash.  Brilliant.
1154
1155norway [4:51 AM] 
1156M1 is not just physical cash. It's also spending accounts.
1157
1158vlad2vlad [4:51 AM] 
1159Yeah, cash equivalents
1160
1161[4:52] 
1162That was a solid showing
1163
1164cypherblock [4:53 AM] 
1165@vlad2vlad why did his first post here call out Scronty. Were you guys discussing him previously?
1166 2 replies Last reply today at 9:49 AM View thread
1167
1168vlad2vlad [4:53 AM] 
1169I don't think so.  Not sure if someone else maybe mentioned him.
1170
1171jp [4:54 AM] 
1172Scronty is a wannabe wanker
1173
1174vlad2vlad [4:54 AM] 
1175Lol
1176
1177jp [4:54 AM] 
1178He even sent emails asking for 500k btc
1179
1180norway [4:54 AM] 
1181I made a calculation of potential bitcoin value a couple of years ago. I used M2 (Cash + spending accounts + savings accounts) as the basis. It's these pie charts: https://i.imgur.com/KA8CuED.png (231kB)
1182
1183vlad2vlad [4:55 AM] 
1184That guy messaged me telling me crazy stuff.  Sounded desperate.  Scammer type.
1185
1186cypherblock [4:55 AM] 
1187ah I see @cryptonaut posted question about Scronty. Scronty seems like a nice guy, either he is full of shit or he is not. Same as csw.
1188
1189jp [4:57 AM] 
1190Scronty sent emails demanding 500k btc
1191
1192cypherblock [4:57 AM] 
1193@jp please post
1194
1195[4:58] 
1196csw posted ~invalid~ faked, scammy satoshi signatures. (edited)
1197
1198jp [4:58 AM] 
1199uploaded this image: Screenshot_20170504-045821.png
1200Add Comment
1201
1202vlad2vlad [4:58 AM] 
1203Scronty told me he asked for 500k BTC.  Said it was owed to him
1204
1205jp [4:59 AM] 
1206uploaded this image: Screenshot_20170504-045849.jpg
1207Add Comment
1208
1209cypherblock [5:00 AM] 
1210@jp didn’t look like a demand there, but that is semantics I suppose. Sounds like he was involved then? Can you confirm?
1211
1212jp [5:00 AM] 
1213Oh. It was a lot of rants prior that
1214
1215[5:01] 
1216Scronty was not involved. He is pissed off because he was not
1217
1218[5:01] 
1219Like you knew someone before he/she getting famous and now you jump up and down to tell people that you two were best friend forever lol
1220
1221vlad2vlad [5:02 AM] 
1222@jp  are you Joseph?
1223
1224cypherblock [5:02 AM] 
1225Not involved at all? Didn’t help author the white paper or see any drafts of it prior to publication and give feedback on that?
1226
1227jp [5:02 AM] 
1228John Paterson
1229
1230[5:02] 
1231Not involved
1232
1233[5:02] 
1234You can write that fantasy novel too
1235
1236[5:02] 
1237By gathering public info and some studies
1238
1239newliberty [5:03 AM] 
1240joined #general
1241
1242cypherblock [5:03 AM] 
1243@jp who came up with using hashcash (yes I know you hate) pow? Was that csw?
1244
1245tomothy 
1246[5:03 AM] 
1247NL this is slack text I wanted to send or link dunno how
1248
1249jp [5:04 AM] 
1250No. Hashcash was not used
1251
1252[5:04] 
1253It is why I raised this issue
1254
1255cypherblock [5:04 AM] 
1256double sha256 as pow then. who came up with that?
1257
1258jp [5:04 AM] 
1259Adam Back was surprised when he was credited
1260
1261[5:05] 
1262He kept wondering who was Satoshi because Adam back said solutions Satoshi put, wouldn't work
1263
1264[5:05] 
1265And here we re. Adam back tries to steal everything
1266
1267[5:06] 
1268Wei Dai helped
1269
1270tomtomtom7 [5:06 AM] 
1271joined #general
1272
1273tomothy 
1274[5:07 AM] 
1275I think he might now be in http://btcchat.slack.com
1276
1277[5:07] 
1278If you have access
1279
1280cypherblock [5:07 AM] 
1281@jp but bitcoin does use double sha256 as proof of work, so there is some basis for referencing another work that also used that.
1282
1283tomothy 
1284[5:08 AM] 
1285For those just joining and hoping to get some answers. Was just told he got there and is talking also
1286
1287jp [5:08 AM] 
1288Read Ddos resistance paper
1289
1290tomothy 
1291[5:08 AM] 
1292Unless this is that slack... Lol I don't think it is though, right? To many slacks
1293
1294cypherblock [5:08 AM] 
1295@timothy this is btcchat yes.
1296
1297jp [5:09 AM] 
1298Hashcash was used for email spam
1299
1300tomothy 
1301[5:09 AM] 
1302Oh. Damn, sorry NL.
1303
1304jp [5:09 AM] 
1305It was hashcash original purpose
1306
1307cypherblock [5:09 AM] 
1308@jp yes I am aware. I completely agree that bitcoin is far far different than hashcash
1309
1310jp [5:10 AM] 
1311Too much fantasy from email spam solution to bitcoin as Adam back claims. Totally scam
1312
1313cypherblock [5:11 AM] 
1314but still the concept of proof of work, of something that is easy to verify and hard to create is important. Adam came up with good solution for that and saw its use but obviously nothing like bitcoin.
1315
1316vlad2vlad [5:11 AM] 
1317JVP??  Man, Dr. Wright brought in the big strangers.  Welcome, @newliberty
1318
1319jp [5:11 AM] 
1320If the whitepaper citations were done properly, actually credit properly then we wouldn't have blockstream Adam Back of today
1321
1322[5:11] 
1323But as Dr. Wright said, he could not see the future
1324
1325[5:13] 
1326Hal Finney, Dave Kleiman. Wei Dai were  the team. If anyone else claimed to be a part of It and asking for money, it is scammer
1327
1328vlad2vlad [5:15 AM] 
1329@jp  What about bear?  I'm pretty sure he helped out early on
1330
1331jp [5:16 AM] 
1332I won't comment on that.
1333
1334vlad2vlad [5:16 AM] 
1335The answer is yes.
1336
1337cypherblock [5:16 AM] 
1338yeah who is bear? Sorry I mean I’m not familiar with that moniker, is he referenced elsewhere?
1339
1340vlad2vlad [5:16 AM] 
1341I actually talked to him a couple weeks ago about another project
1342
1343[5:16] 
1344Ray Dillinger
1345
1346[5:17] 
1347Maybe we can get him in here too.  Bring back the whole team.  Minus Hal, of course.
1348
1349jp [5:17 AM] 
1350Minus Dave K
1351
1352vlad2vlad [5:17 AM] 
1353Oops.  Him too.
1354
1355[5:18] 
1356I've got Gavin's email.  Gonna try him
1357
1358jp [5:19 AM] 
1359Adam Back should stop riding the bitcoin whitepaper coattail
1360
1361vlad2vlad [5:20 AM] 
1362I sent bear and Gavin and invite.  Maybe we'll get a super dev slack going here.
1363
1364
1365awemany [5:25 AM] 
1366joined #general
1367
1368bitsko [5:27 AM] 
1369Was trying to get full text with slack signup as title for a pastebin. Looks like i didnt get it all, now on cell and must work. :fearful:
1370
1371travin [5:27 AM] 
1372joined #general
1373
1374cypherblock [5:29 AM] 
1375@jp were you involved with early bitcoin? You are not jvp right? Sorry so many monikers to track.
1376
1377jp [5:29 AM] 
1378As Dr. Wright said, he is tired of having people saying that they worked with him.
1379
1380tomothy 
1381[5:29 AM] 
1382Yeah also on mobile, Vlad maybe make a pastebin of today's excitement?
13831 reply Today at 5:31 AM View thread
1384
1385jp [5:29 AM] 
1386I am John Paterson
1387
1388csw [5:30 AM] 
1389No, I posted a link to read Satre.
1390
1391Pinned by jp 
1392Today at 5:32 AM Pinned by jp
1393[5:31] 
1394Please read the following (translated) page for this:
1395http://www.nybooks.com/articles/1964/12/17/sartre-on-the-nobel-prize/
1396The New York Review of Books
1397Sartre on the Nobel Prize
1398Jean-Paul Sartre explained his refusal to accept the Nobel Prize for Literature in a statement made to the Swedish Press on October 22, which appeared in Le Monde in a French translation approved by Sartre. The following translation into English was made by Richard Howard. I deeply regret the fact that the incident has become … (13kB)
1399
1400vlad2vlad [5:32 AM] 
1401I'm also on mobile.  4 years strong
1402
1403xhiggy [5:33 AM] 
1404joined #general
1405
1406vlad2vlad [5:33 AM] 
1407Now I remember reading that
1408
1409awemany [5:34 AM] 
1410csw, so what I am wondering, given the general hands-off attitude you seem to possess: why do you want to get involved with Bitcoin development again through nchain? Do you distrust the market? Or do you think the market simply includes you as a market participant as well, and it therefore should reflect your actions?
1411
1412csw [5:34 AM] 
1413East vs West, this is a cultural comment. It does not relate to what people see, but to order and anarchy. Neither is the way. Being a Libertarian is a means to allow free trade and market solutions, but it requires institutions.
1414
1415[5:34] 
1416The market is all I trust!
1417
1418[5:35] 
1419Am I being a wet blanket here, or does anyone understand the point of the Satre rejection letter?
1420
1421[5:36] 
1422There exists nothing to relate a free market based global money to. It is as a consequence of never truly having been free. The "Gold standard" was in fact a Gold exchange standard and worse, it was a BiMetalist system (edited)
1423
1424
1425newliberty [5:38 AM] 
1426There've been a number of different gold standards, so there's not really a standard gold standard.
1427
1428tomothy 
1429[5:39 AM] 
1430The point of the letter is apt and plainly similar. Thanks for sharing.
1431
1432csw [5:39 AM] 
1433Everyone seeks an authority. This is what BitCoin was created to bypass. We can all trade and we can do this as the market determines. Not as a consequence of a high priesthood, but through trial and error, failure and just sheer will to try and learn and fail again.
1434
1435[5:40] 
1436Satoshi has to be a myth. If you make me, or anyone a 'God', an infallible authority, then what is the point?
1437
1438
1439cypherblock [5:40 AM] 
1440did you purposely want to undermine Gavin as a way to remove his authority as well? That seems a bit, well, rough.
1441
1442charlieshrem [5:41 AM] 
1443joined #general
1444
1445charlieshrem [5:42 AM] 
1446Hey
1447 2 replies Last reply today at 5:42 AM View thread
1448
1449awemany [5:42 AM] 
1450csw: yes that authority part makes a lot of sense and also why the creator had to hide. this is why I am wondering about your personal involvement again. is nchain going to be funded by early coins?
1451
1452csw [5:42 AM] 
1453Core should not tell you what to do. They need to propose and allow the market to decide. Bitcoin solves the issue of sock puppets in a manner analogous to the gambler at the roulette table.  This means we propose and allow it to compete and to see what we can have, not as a centralised system but through many groups.
1454
1455newliberty [5:42 AM] 
1456Recognizing "Satoshi" ought be more about gratitude than authority seeking.  Authorities are to be questioned.
1457
1458csw [5:42 AM] 
1459nChain is funded, but I will not discuss that. There are people in the group who will.
1460
1461jp [5:42 AM] 
1462Someone pastebin this chat pls. I'm on mobile
1463
1464csw [5:43 AM] 
1465Authority NEEDS to be questioned.
1466
1467
1468[5:43] 
1469I study and I write. More than that I do not ask.
1470
1471awemany [5:43 AM] 
1472csw: ok. Core supporters often bring forward the 'alternative implementations are menace to the network' part - what did you mean by that, in light of 'many groups' above? (edited)
1473
1474tomothy 
1475[5:44 AM] 
1476Newliberty did.
1477
1478csw [5:44 AM] 
1479They are a menace only to those who freely decide.
1480
1481wellspenttime [5:44 AM] 
1482joined #general. Also, @joeldalais joined.
1483
1484csw [5:44 AM] 
1485If you consider the flaw in BU, it was a loss to the miner, not to the protocol
1486
1487
1488charlieshrem [5:45 AM] 
1489BU has too many issues to safely be considered the reference client.
1490
1491csw [5:45 AM] 
1492That should be encouraged. No transaction was lost and the overall system did not suffer, so why is this a problem generally?
1493
1494[5:45] 
1495Charlie, I do agree. But the solution does not need to be so difficult
1496
1497
1498charlieshrem [5:45 AM] 
1499Agreed.
1500
1501csw [5:46 AM] 
1502And we can scale on and off chain at the same time
1503  
1504
1505charlieshrem [5:46 AM] 
1506Agreed as well.
1507
1508[5:46] 
1509I feel like good solutions have come alight, but are blocked/put down based on who their authors are.
1510
1511csw [5:46 AM] 
1512In the 8 years, Moore's law has held and will continue.
1513
1514[5:49] 
1515Did any of you know that a 2nm transistor was created. This was something considered impossible. It is lower than the 7nm Quantum tunnelling effect.
1516
1517lunar [5:49 AM] 
1518@csw . Good afternoon. I'm just one small cog in the Bitcoin Unlimited team, but we've been trying to solve the blocksize issue for several years now. I was interested in what you thought about the emergent consensus solution? The idea BU implements, by giving miners the tools to signal between each other and come to a free market driven determination of the blocksize commodity, with an adjustable block cap. Thanks
1519
1520csw [5:49 AM] 
1521This occurred in 2012.
1522
1523[5:49] 
1524I think that miners need to decide.
1525 
1526
1527joeldalais [5:50 AM] 
1528can i ask - what is nChain bringing to the table? will it be a new client implementation? actual development (instead of this stalling we've had for years)? new teams of programmers (seems you have a very strong team)? business solutions? end user solutions? or - a mix of everything and more? or don't worry if its too early to ask (edited)
1529
1530csw [5:51 AM] 
1531In 2009/10, the value of Bitcoin was far too low for flood control to work based on fees without a cap.
1532
1533tomothy 
1534[5:51 AM] 
1535See above, not really discussing nchain
1536
1537joeldalais [5:51 AM] 
1538fair enough :slightly_smiling_face:
1539
1540Pinned by jp 
1541Today at 5:52 AM Pinned by jp
1542csw [5:51 AM] 
1543I will not discuss the business side here sorry. There is a team who do that. I focus on code and maths
1544
1545[5:51] 
1546https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/main.cpp
1547GitHub
1548trottier/original-bitcoin
1549original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
1550 
1551
1552[5:51] 
1553Please have a quick look at the 0.1.3 and earlier code
1554
1555joeldalais [5:51 AM] 
1556ok, then i'll be quiet and soak up what knowledge i can :slightly_smiling_face:
1557
1558csw [5:52 AM] 
1559Lines 2249 as comments and on:
1560
1561// Transaction fee requirements, mainly only needed for flood control
1562// Under 10K (about 80 inputs) is free for first 100 transactions
1563// Base rate is 0.01 per KB
1564
1565[5:53] 
1566It is simple to create a flood based fee system
1567
1568newliberty [5:53 AM] 
1569For QC threats over the coming years, Shor's algo for keys and Grover's for hashing are concerns, but they will hit most every other security protocol before they are problems for Bitcoin, so should ample be time to resolve, and the failures of others to learn from.  I imagine these were design considerations?  Care to comment on this?
1570
1571csw [5:53 AM] 
1572Offer a set amount for free and then have a capped value - not a limit, let TXs pay to be in if there are too many (as decided by the market and not a committee)
1573
1574[5:54] 
1575QC is bunk
1576
1577
1578[5:54] 
1579Grover's  algo means a large QC could solve a hash in a billion years or so... classical growth will solve this faster
1580
1581[5:55] 
1582As for Shor's, the rate of calculation would lead to a 110 or longer solution time when a private key has been exposed.
1583
1584[5:55] 
1585This means that a 20 billion USD system could solve for 3 keys a year.
1586
1587[5:56] 
1588As a consequence, large values could be moved to multiple keys or even to multi sig systems.
1589
1590[5:56] 
1591I have a paper being published in this area. It took time. I needed to study some more physics first.
1592
1593satoshi [5:57 AM] 
1594joined #general
1595
1596awemany [5:57 AM] 
1597what is "110 or longer"?
1598
1599vlad2vlad [5:57 AM] 
1600Oh look, Satoshi is here.  Lol
1601 
1602
1603[5:57] 
1604This is getting good
1605
1606newliberty [5:58 AM] 
1607The double hashing resolves most the preimage issues, and one-time use of coins means there is only the window of time from transmission to mining to crack, so had guessed that these were considered from the beginning.
1608
1609csw [5:58 AM] 
1610At a discounted rate of 1 Billion USD a key per annum, the requirement would be that a key would need to have 100 BIT stored and to have a based value of 100 million USD per BTC to make attacking Bitcoin ECDSA keys valid.
1611
1612[5:59] 
1613More, the double hash means that the input to the hash needs to be of a set size. The collision problem allows for scaled solutions.
1614
1615satoshi [5:59 AM] 
1616I am not Satoshi.
1617
1618csw [5:59 AM] 
1619So, if you have a set number of collisions, you find that the possibility of a valid collision diminishes
1620
1621vlad2vlad [6:00 AM] 
1622For crying outloud @satoshi  I thought you were.  Lol
1623
1624jp [6:01 AM] 
1625Can we focus on the technical discussion here?
1626
1627
1628satoshi [6:01 AM] 
1629What is the most productive thing the average user can do to support on-chain scaling?
1630
1631csw [6:01 AM] 
1632There are an estimated infinite number of collisions for any hash, but the size is indeterminate.
1633
1634[6:02] 
1635Satoshi, use bitcoin and call for real solutions. This is not 2 Mb. From 09 to now, systems have increased about 100x
1636
1637
1638[6:02] 
1639In this time, we have not moved from a cap that was set for flood control at all.
1640
1641freetrader [6:03 AM] 
1642joined #general
1643
1644csw [6:03 AM] 
1645Can I ask people to look at the code comments in the 0.1.0 to 0.1.3 release.
1646
1647joeldalais [6:03 AM] 
1648its where its noted as 'flood control'?
1649
1650csw [6:03 AM] 
1651I think that it was rather clear, but then I have a habbit of losing people
1652
1653[6:04] 
1654Yes.
1655
1656[6:04] 
1657There should always be free TXs
1658
1659
1660joeldalais [6:04 AM] 
1661people seem to gaze over that part and ignore it :disappointed:
1662
1663csw [6:04 AM] 
1664Where the idea of a cap should be is a market decided limit that is not stopped, but sold at value
1665
1666[6:04] 
1667Nobody reads the code comments :disappointed:
1668
1669[6:05] 
1670There was a 100 TB drive released in the last 6 months.
1671
1672[6:06] 
1673This i not a standard laptop addition, but the truth is that we are in a world were exponential scaling is occuring and against that we have a logistic one.
1674
1675awemany [6:06 AM] 
1676csw, tbh, you lost me with the above calculations. why is it '1 billion USD a key *per annum*?".  Ialso do not understand " The collision problem allows for scaled solutions.". I assume that "More, the double hash means that the input to the hash needs to be of a set size." means that the input width is fixed for the 2nd SHA256? Why is that relevant and important?
1677
1678newliberty [6:06 AM] 
1679Storing the full chain costs about 0.001BTC worth of drive today
1680
1681
1682csw [6:07 AM] 
1683Can I assume that people understand the distinction between a logistic and exponential growth system?
1684
1685ajd [6:07 AM] 
1686csw were you on IRC while you were developing Bitcoin?
1687
1688joeldalais [6:07 AM] 
1689i was looking at bandwidth+drive space (costs) some while back, the growth/cost over the last 15 years. It boggles my mind why people think this growth will suddenly stop, there is certainly room now and in the future.
1690
1691csw [6:07 AM] 
1692Shor is not the same as linear classical systems.
1693
1694[6:08] 
1695If you have a 20 Billion USD system, and you can factor 3 keys a year, a basic IRR means you come to a value a little over 1 billion USD for each key.
1696
1697[6:09] 
1698joeldalais, the Intel roadmap is strong for the next 2 decades.
1699
1700
1701tomtomtom7 [6:09 AM] 
1702csw: Sorry if blunt, but could you comment on why you let Gavin vouch for you without going public with proof yourself?
1703
1704csw [6:09 AM] 
1705http://gizmodo.com/5807151/2-nanometer-quantum-transistors-are-the-worlds-smallest
1706Gizmodo
17072-Nanometer Quantum Transistors Are the World's Smallest
1708A team of scientists at Chungbuk National University in South Korea have created a transistor that&#39;s only 2nm in size, which happens to be the smallest in the world. By comparison, the current generation of Intel processors use 32nm transistors. (35kB)
1709
1710[6:10] 
1711Moving goal posts.
1712
1713[6:10] 
1714Tomx3+7, I had never wanted what occured and I had no plans to be an authority. I will not
1715
1716[6:11] 
1717I will be a scammer with ideas that go to market before I become something I detest and people wanted that. They dressed me in a bloody turtle neck!
1718
1719
1720[6:12] 
1721I have NEVER worn a frikin turtle neck in my life. Like I was bloody jobs or something.
1722 
1723
1724[6:12] 
1725I made stupid decisions and I, as all do, have regrets.
1726
1727
1728joeldalais [6:13 AM] 
1729its not that bad decisions are done, but how we act after that matters
1730
1731csw [6:13 AM] 
1732I am not good with people. This is difficult for me now. Vlad and others have pushed me to be here and to be frank it scares the shit out of me
1733
17341 reply Today at 6:17 AM View thread
1735
1736tomtomtom7 [6:14 AM] 
1737thank you csw
1738
1739joeldalais [6:14 AM] 
1740great respect for being here at all :slightly_smiling_face:
1741
1742
1743jp [6:14 AM] 
1744Incompleteness.
1745
1746travin [6:14 AM] 
1747Thanks for that, Craig. It's well-appreciated.
1748
1749joeldalais [6:15 AM] 
1750and for what its worth, i think you're doing fine here
1751
1752csw [6:15 AM] 
1753Ta
1754
1755jp [6:17 AM] 
1756csw: you are better with code and math.
1757
1758csw [6:17 AM] 
1759LOL
1760
1761jp [6:18 AM] 
1762Worked with you for 7 years so I know ;)
1763
1764newliberty [6:23 AM] 
1765Maybe we work up with some worthy competition in the next 7.
1766
1767ajd [6:26 AM] 
1768Have you changed your opinion on multiple implementations and if so why?
1769
1770cypherblock [6:26 AM] 
1771@csw how long did it take the write the original bitcoin source code?
1772
1773csw [6:27 AM] 
1774I am not going to play Satoshi. I am not wanting to have people think I am and I am going to imagine that nobody ever doxx'd me and that I am just some overqualified academic for the moment... ok?
1775
1776
1777tomothy 
1778[6:28 AM] 
1779Oh, what's the new masters you are getting?
1780
1781ajd [6:28 AM] 
1782OK. I'm asking csw that question.
1783
1784jp [6:28 AM] 
1785Csw is just a con artist and an asshole. Move along, nothing to see.
1786
1787
1788csw [6:28 AM] 
1789The code should compete, but what matters is that there is a reference protocol
1790
1791
1792[6:29] 
1793I am completing a MSc right now. It is in financial econometrics
1794
1795
1796[6:29] 
1797Uni of London
1798
1799joeldalais [6:29 AM] 
1800hypothetical question .. do you think it would be possible to link 2 blockchains together via a 2nd layer (that ran the same algo). A 2nd layer that basically just read and fed back data from both chains?
1801
1802csw [6:30 AM] 
1803I have put in a proposal into Cambridge for another PhD in Pure Mathematics this time. I hope to start that in Oct
18041 reply Today at 6:31 AM View thread
1805
1806libitx [6:30 AM] 
1807joined #general
1808
1809joeldalais [6:30 AM] 
1810its a good uni, think one of my sisters went there
1811
1812cypherblock [6:30 AM] 
1813any thoughts on recent ext block proposals (or ext blocks in general with ability to move coins back and forth between main and ext)?
1814
1815csw [6:30 AM] 
1816I see issues, but this is not a place to discuss that.
1817
1818[6:31] 
1819There are too many problems with the discussion of complex issues in a few words. I have a few papers and I will be publishing again soon.
1820
1821joeldalais [6:31 AM] 
1822sounds good :slightly_smiling_face:
1823
1824csw [6:31 AM] 
1825People can read and accept or dismiss the arguments that I pose in those papers.
1826
1827cypherblock [6:32 AM] 
1828expected pub date? or too soon to say?
1829
1830prometheus [6:33 AM] 
1831joined #general
1832
1833csw [6:33 AM] 
1834Peer review...
1835
1836Pinned by jp 
1837Today at 6:34 AM Pinned by jp
1838[6:34] 
1839Some have been completed... peer review is a difficult mistress. Worse than my wife :slightly_smiling_face:
1840
1841
1842newliberty [6:34 AM] 
1843Peers can be difficult to come by
1844
1845
1846awemany [6:37 AM] 
1847csw, so I am still trying to parse your above comments on using shor to crack a priv key. what I do not understand where the double hash comes in? I only see the single rpemd160 one.
1848
1849csw [6:38 AM] 
1850Sha256
1851
1852tomothy 
1853[6:38 AM] 
1854CSW,  which alt should I buy tomorrow?   (don't hurt me)
1855
1856
1857csw [6:39 AM] 
1858:stuck_out_tongue:
1859
1860
1861jp [6:39 AM] 
1862I guess it is Diem
1863
1864awemany [6:39 AM] 
1865ok, sure, SHA256. but where does that come into play in cracking priv/pub pairs?
1866
1867newliberty [6:39 AM] 
1868Guaranteed it will hurt if you do.  Rumor is we are running out of bitcoins to buy.
1869
1870csw [6:39 AM] 
18712 sec
1872
1873
1874tomothy 
1875[6:41 AM] 
1876On a serious note, thoughts on Monero, or ZEC, similar coins & code (confidential transactions) with regards to anonymity? Is anonymity something you see being brought to bitcoin in the near/far future? I know blockchain analytics have significantly improved and coin taint can be a concern for some. I.e., BTC tumblers essentially no longer working.
1877
1878
1879vlad2vlad [6:41 AM] 
1880@tomothy  Nuggets!!  Buy NUGS if you wanna be rich.
1881
1882 26 replies Last reply today at 8:01 AM View thread
1883
1884awemany [6:42 AM] 
1885@tomothy : tumblers don't work, why is that?
1886 39 replies Last reply today at 7:27 AM View thread
1887
1888klee [6:42 AM] 
1889joined #general
1890
1891awemany [6:43 AM] 
1892@tomothy : monero is mostly BTC in constant tumbler mode and seems to be working fine, privacy wise. so I don't see how bitcoin is fundamentally lacking. Now, sure, most people do NOT anonymize their TXN because it is a PITA with the current tools, but I see no reason how BTC is lacking there in principle
1893
1894Pinned by jp 
1895Today at 6:44 AM Pinned by jp
1896csw [6:43 AM] 
1897The reality is there is nothing to fear
1898Most importantly, bitcoin uses a double hashing algorithm. The results of this scenario is that any unused bitcoin address will not be reversible to the public key, let alone able to be attacked through a reversal of the ECDSA key pair. Algorithm such as Grover's algorithm (Grover, 1996) are touted as being able to speed up the searching through possible collisions in the reversing of hashing algorithms including SHA-256.
1899This algorithm is known to be at best a solution in BPP ( ), a class of decision problem that is decidable in polynomial time with an error probability bounded by 1/3 (for all inputs). The idea is that this error rate can be minimised or made to be exponentially small in 'k" using a process of iterating the algorithm 'k' times with the most frequent value returned as the result. This process ignores the noise of the quantum computer and reports an error rate based on the ideal system alone. Bennet et al. (1997) demonstrate how an ideal quantum Turning machine cannot find a solution to an NP problem in less than time  . For SHA-256, this is time  and is a far more difficult problem when the true problem, the solution of a bounded size hash to a hash puzzle is introduced. His conclusion was that “Anyone afraid of quantum hash-collision algorithms already has much more to fear from non-quantum hash-collision algorithms”. 
1900More importantly, when Bernstein (2009,  ) analysed the known quantum algorithms he demonstrated conclusively that “all the quantum-collision algorithms in the literature are steps backwards from the non-quantum algorithm of (Oorschot, et al.  ). In other words, any attack on the hash functions of Bitcoin would be more effective using a classical computer.
1901Bitcoin is thus secure against (theoretical) quantum computer attacks against a key that has not been used. Once a transaction is signed and sent to the blockchain, an attacker can extract the public key. This is not a flaw in the algorithm but a standard part of the functioning of ECC and ECDSA based systems. The question is then, what is the cost to an attacker to break the ECDSA key itself?
1902Grover’s algorithm could be said to reduce the bit-security of such primitives by half; one might say that a 256-bit pre-quantum primitive offers only 128-bit security in a post-quantum setting. This is far too large to be broken on any QC any time in the foreseeable future. However, Bitcoin uses the Hash of a Hash. The combination of both SHA256 bit hashes of SHA256 values and the use of a 160Bit RipeMD hash of a SHA256 value for an address makes the analysis of bitcoin addresses to uncover the private key infeasible.
1903Attacking ECDSA with Shor
1904Let us for a moment assume that a working solution to the problem of creating logical qubits on a FTQC that can maintain coherence for long time periods can be achieved. We next need to note that Shor's algorithm is not simple and a Universal QC would need specialised breaks - you cannot just solve ECC in one hit as is suggested by many pundits.
1905The other common fallacy and assumption is that a FTQC will just factor the private key before you can spend. It is more probable that even a 1 million logical qubit FTQC system would likely take weeks or months to break 256 bit ECDSA keys.
1906
1907[6:44] 
1908On the basis of these numbers, performing a 2048-bit number Shor factorization will take on the order of 110 days and require a system size of 2 × 109 trapped ions.
1909Trapping 2 × 109 ions will require 23 × 23 vacuum chambers occupying an area of ca. 103.5 × 103.5 m2.
1910
1911Pinned by jp 
1912Today at 6:46 AM Pinned by jp
1913[6:44] 
1914Bitcoin Mining.
1915As we noted from Bernstein’s (2009) results, quantum computers are slower at solving hash collision than are algorithms for the deployment on classical systems. Hence, there is no economic benefit for a miner to use Quantum Computers for the solution of hash puzzles as they would solve fewer hashes than a miner on a more traditional ASIC. This excludes the costs of the Quantum computer as well (which is significant) and does not consider the fact that qubits are slower to process than bits (Bernstein, 2009). The result is that a miner who was to deploy a Quantum computer for the mining of Bitcoin (if one was to ever exist in the first place) would be at an economic disadvantage to a miner using more traditional ASIC based systems. 
1916Post-quantum cryptography ( ), a purported non-partisan site for the scientific dissemination of information concerning the effects of quantum computing on cryptography that is heavily used by partisan personalities including Vitalik Buterin, (co-founder of Ethereum) starts with the doom saying prophecy: 
1917“"Imagine that it's fifteen years from now. Somebody announces that he's built a large quantum computer. RSA is dead. DSA is dead. Elliptic curves, hyperelliptic curves, class groups, whatever, dead, dead, dead. So users are going to run around screaming and say 'Oh my God, what do we do?'”
1918This false prophecy is clearly misleadingly designed to read as if it was a quote from Daniel Bernstein’s ( ) analysis. The removal of the line “The New York Times runs a frontpage article reporting that all of the public-key algorithms used to protect the Internet have been broken” changes the context where the author starts by stating, “A closer look reveals, however, that there is no justification for the leap from “quantum computers destroy RSA and DSA and ECDSA” to “quantum computers destroy cryptography.”” 
1919More importantly, no consideration of the costs and time in uncovering a private key has been announced. As Bernstein (2009  ) also demonstrated, the move to alternate hashing algorithms is unwarranted due to theoretical quantum computers even were they to become a reality.
1920
1921
1922So, please never listen to the FUD. Forget ideas such as Lamport Signatures. Bitcoin is as it is for a reason and the reason that these others who worry about science fiction did not create it is the reason we need to maintain it as the protocol was created.
1923
1924
1925[6:44] 
1926Sorry... parts of a paper I am writing.
1927
1928awemany [6:46 AM] 
1929ok, thanks, let me digest that
1930
1931
1932tomothy 
1933[6:50 AM] 
1934CSW can you address thoughts regarding privacy concerns on the blockchain and comment on coins that attempt to address some of those issues? I mean, it's recognized that it's a "PUBLIC LEDGER" with "PUBLIC WALLETS" so... but still it's an interesting topic and I just wanted to see your thoughts.
1935
1936[6:51] 
1937Also, someone was wondering what your thoughts were about "vaults". Not sure if you've seen the article. http://hackingdistributed.com/2016/02/26/how-to-implement-secure-bitcoin-vaults/
1938Hacking Distributed
1939How to Implement Secure Bitcoin Vaults
1940We have come up with a simple and elegant technique for implementing hack-proof Bitcoin vaults, to deter Bitcoin thefts. (176kB)
1941
1942csw [6:51 AM] 
1943Threshold signatures.
1944
1945csw [6:52 AM] 
1946The problem with signatures is solvable using set theory. Anyone know about Cantor's use of diagonalism?
1947  5 replies Last reply today at 6:57 AM View thread
1948
1949hankdasilva [6:54 AM] 
1950joined #general
1951
1952klee [6:54 AM] 
1953I am the guy interested for the Vault thing
1954
1955newliberty [6:54 AM] 
1956Infinite sets comparisons
1957
1958klee [6:55 AM] 
1959and also if BitCoin blockchain was made transparent (regarding anonymity, privacy) by design
1960
1961[6:55] 
1962or was the best thought back in the day
1963
1964awemany [6:56 AM] 
1965csw, so I read the above, I see most parts of where you are coming from now and it makes sense. however, the only thing remaining is the double-hashing, which is unclear to me. what does it add in terms of security in terms of QC considerations? Grover's algo will work in sqrt(n) both for a single and a double hash and the double hashing is just a constant factor in time - no?
1966
1967tomothy 
1968[6:56 AM] 
1969"jp [3 minutes ago] 
1970csw: had a conversation with Dr. Conway about Cantor
1971
1972tomothy [2 minutes ago] 
1973JP does that have to do with anonymity or storing of txs
1974
1975csw [1 minute ago] 
1976Keys. And there are ways that you can make keys more private as well... but again, too much for slack
1977
1978tomothy 
1979[< 1 minute ago] 
1980Thanks, will repost into slack as threads aren't stored easy."
1981
1982newliberty [6:57 AM] 
1983Surreal numbers, Conway worked on something related.  JP met with him a while back
1984
1985[6:57] 
1986Not sure how it applies though
1987
1988iang [6:58 AM] 
1989joined #general
1990 
1991
1992jp [6:58 AM] 
1993Welcome Ian grigg
1994
1995newliberty [6:59 AM] 
1996This is a rich meal of food for thought
1997
1998csw [6:59 AM] 
1999Hello Ian.
2000
2001iang [6:59 AM] 
2002good morning all
2003
2004
2005jp [7:00 AM] 
2006Our bloody buddy is here Ian.
2007
2008csw [7:00 AM] 
2009In distributed thresholds you have the (n+1) vs (2n+1) issue
2010
2011[7:00] 
2012Sorry, there is not a lot that can be explained in this without maths.
2013
2014newliberty [7:02 AM] 
2015Yes, it gives diagonalism, infinite sets which are not equal
2016
2017vlad2vlad [7:03 AM] 
2018Man, this channel is full of world class talent.
2019
2020
2021tomothy 
2022[7:04 AM] 
2023Do you think Grigg has been credited properly?
2024
2025[7:04] 
2026With regards to  triple entry?
2027
2028iang [7:05 AM] 
2029lol.  triple entry is a concept, it’s a bit difficult to just turn around and implement.  A bit like smart contracts.
2030
2031klee [7:05 AM] 
2032https://youtu.be/4GuqlQvFYJo
2033YouTube Bitcoin News TV
2034Craig Wright Interview - Part 1 - 2014 - Satoshi?
2035 
2036
2037luke-jr [7:07 AM] 
2038joined #general
2039
2040vlad2vlad [7:07 AM] 
2041That video was GREAT!!!
2042
2043[7:07] 
2044Hey Luke!!
2045
2046[7:07] 
2047Glad you accepted my invite.  :)
2048
2049Pinned by jp 
2050Today at 7:08 AM Pinned by jp
2051iang [7:07 AM] 
2052if you look at the list of credits in the bitcoin paper, it’s very light - only 8.  Misses out on the entire digital cash tradition which was a squillion references.  Also, the paper wasn’t written for a conference - a thing that is a thing.  There are these days a lot of papers that just don’t do the academic track.
2053
2054
2055vlad2vlad [7:08 AM] 
2056Is it too late to get my name in the whitepaper?  Just asking?
2057
2058klee [7:08 AM] 
2059$1570 at stamp
2060 18 replies Last reply today at 7:42 AM View thread
2061
2062luke-jr [7:08 AM] 
2063"IRC is disabled for your team. Ask your Team Owner to enable it."
2064
2065klee [7:08 AM] 
2066off topic?
2067
2068awemany [7:09 AM] 
2069@bitsko , was it you who set this up? maybe you can help @luke-jr ?
2070
2071iang [7:10 AM] 
2072What are the rules of engagement?
2073
2074luke-jr [7:11 AM] 
2075@iang Get married within months?
2076
2077[7:11] 
2078:stuck_out_tongue: (edited)
2079
2080iang [7:11 AM] 
2081@luke-jr … months?  You want me in pain and trauma for months?  can’t we make it days?
2082
2083[7:12] 
2084question I’ve never understood - what is the purpose of the double hash?
2085
2086luke-jr [7:12 AM] 
2087within != at
2088
2089[7:12] 
2090what double hash?
2091
2092tomothy 
2093[7:12 AM] 
2094It's bitsko's slack. I'm pretty sure he's AFK. I don't know about the IRC stuff, never needed it in here...
2095
2096awemany [7:12 AM] 
2097@iang , agree on the double hash. there was some exchange with csw above on it regarding QC. I am really curious as well
2098
2099iang [7:13 AM] 
2100oh wait - scratch that I see there is something written above.
2101
2102awemany [7:13 AM] 
2103there is - but can you explain it to me? I am kind of lost. I don't see how it makes Grover's algo better in regards to QC, except for a constant factor
2104
2105csw [7:14 AM] 
2106Double hashing means that the input to one hash is limited to a set size. It means that the number of collisions is reduced to neatly zero from infinite,
2107
2108
2109luke-jr [7:15 AM] 
2110oh, that. somehow I thought you meant twitter # hash :stuck_out_tongue:
2111
2112iang [7:15 AM] 
2113there’s a lot of twitter redundancy :wink:
2114
2115jp [7:16 AM] 
2116Luke-jr vs CSW scale debate ding ding ding. Everyone sit back.
2117
2118Speak only if you are devs or important figures ( if u think u 're lol) (edited)
2119
2120toodarkmark [7:16 AM] 
2121joined #general
2122
2123luke-jr [7:16 AM] 
2124semi-AFK until IRC gets turned on
2125
2126csw [7:16 AM] 
2127OK. I am going to cut and paste. Email was easier on lists this thing open stuff all over
2128
2129iang [7:17 AM] 
2130(I am reading it)
2131
2132Pinned by jp 
2133Today at 7:32 AM Pinned by jp
2134csw [7:17 AM] 
2135I want to see Bitcoin scale significantly and this means opening it up to merchants who will run a node in a back office.
2136
2137To grow to be able to avoid government taking it over, we have to have 100s of thousands of globally dispersed systems.
2138
2139This is possible. If you think of a Coffee shop, they have public keys on the PoS and a system in the Back office.
2140
2141Each merchant will want to ensure that they have a TX propagated as fast as possible, in seconds really.
2142
2143Bitcoin is not really a Gossip model, but it is the simplest way to explain this to CompSci people
2144
2145It is an SEIR-C
2146
2147This:
2148http://people.cs.vt.edu/naren/papers/wsdm2014-difnet-competing-cascades-agenda-setting-camera-ready.pdf
2149
2150or https://bmcmedicine.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1741-7015-9-87
2151That is the easiest way I can say it without code or maths.
2152
2153If we create a system that opens to merchants and can operate as a PoS, the end is that we have a means to transfer wealth at lower costs than Visa and the banks
2154
2155That makes us competitive and thus allows more people to enter and to allow scale.
2156
2157With me so far?
2158There are over 1 million mid sized merchants and more when you take other trading entities.
2159We could out scale Visa with a larger growth factor with an upfront cost of the hardware at 20,000 USD or lower a year
2160In ten years, we could have a 20k system that can scale to encompass all global commerce.
2161
2162In 20 years, the costs of this system would be under 500USD partity
2163
2164There is so much more to it, but I cannot type it on the fly.
2165BMC Medicine
2166Simulation of an SEIR infectious disease model on the dynamic contact network of conference attendees
2167The spread of infectious diseases crucially depends on the pattern of contacts between individuals. Knowledge of these patterns is thus essential to inform models and computational efforts. However, there are few empirical studies available that provide estimates of the number and duration of contacts between social groups. Moreover, their space and time resolutions are limited, so that data are not explicit at the person-to-person level, and the dynamic nature of the contacts is disregarded. In Show more… (40kB)
2168 
2169
2170awemany [7:19 AM] 
2171csw: ok, on the double-hashing, still working on grokking it. so basically you say: SHA256(random-length-bit-string) has potentially a lot more collisions than SHA256(256-bit-long-string)?
2172
2173csw [7:19 AM] 
2174SHA256 has an infinite number of collisions
2175
2176awemany [7:19 AM] 
2177because of the infinite bitstream length you can put into it?
2178
2179csw [7:19 AM] 
2180But, choosing a particular collision is what the problem is
2181
2182[7:20] 
2183Yes, It is an Aleph 1 problem
2184
2185[7:20] 
2186That is a second level Cantor set
2187
2188tula [7:21 AM] 
2189joined #general
2190
2191csw [7:21 AM] 
2192This is a class of sets in infinitarity problems (there is not one type of infinity but I cannot explain it here if you do not get it)
2193
2194joeldalais [7:21 AM] 
2195the 20k a year .. i think smaller businesses would find the savings really appealing (allowing them to grow), but the 20k is putting up a bit of a barrier for them... perhaps it could be 20k over X time?
2196
2197iang [7:21 AM] 
2198ok, I’ll re-read the hash commentary later, but the tl;dr is that it addresses weaknesses from QC.  My immediate knee-jerk is that if QC is in place we’ve got many many other problems to worry about … but sure.
2199
2200freetrader [7:21 AM] 
2201I'm having a problem seeing the 'reduces collisions to zero'.
2202Is that proven math?
2203 4 replies Last reply today at 7:27 AM View thread
2204
2205newliberty [7:21 AM] 
2206Countable and uncountable infinities
2207
2208joeldalais [7:21 AM] 
2209optional 20k over X time, bigger businesses would be fine
2210
2211csw [7:21 AM] 
2212Joeld... There can be companies that serve companies
2213
2214joeldalais [7:22 AM] 
2215ahh yes, i see what you mean
2216
2217csw [7:22 AM] 
2218This way, the back office PoS can be distributed for smaller companies
2219
2220[7:22] 
2221Well, actually there are both an infinity of countable and uncountable infinities.
2222
2223[7:22] 
2224It send Cantor mad... literally
2225
2226joeldalais [7:23 AM] 
2227an infinite infinities :slightly_smiling_face: people used to give me weird looks when i used to say that about bitcoin
2228
2229newliberty [7:23 AM] 
2230
2231freetrader: preimaging a hash for a collision with a dataset of unbounded size is a much easier problem than doing so with a fixed size
2232
2233
2234csw [7:23 AM] 
2235NL... not zero, 2 as a maxima
2236
2237
2238awemany [7:23 AM] 
2239csw, I see no aleph1 anywhere? all I see is that sha256^2 reduces from alelph0 to uint256 in the middle between the hashes?
2240
2241freetrader [7:23 AM] 
2242@newliberty : sure, but if anyone has proven that there are 'zero' SHA256 collisions on input size of 256 bits, I'd like to know
2243 3 replies Last reply today at 7:28 AM View thread
2244
2245csw [7:23 AM] 
2246But, the collisions are infeasible to solve
2247
2248joeldalais [7:23 AM] 
2249i can see a chain of businesses forming to create what you're talking about...
2250
2251pesa [7:23 AM] 
2252joined #general
2253
2254csw [7:25 AM] 
2255Awe.. the Aleph 1 comes from an unbounded set of input functions. That is not the case when a single hash is input to a hash
2256
2257[7:26] 
2258Freetrader. Yes, the maths to prove the reduction is proven and not just by axiomic conditions that are not completely determined.
2259
2260newliberty [7:26 AM] 
2261"Nearly zero" (though I think he misspelled it as neatly zero)
2262
2263awemany [7:26 AM] 
2264where does the unbounded set of input functions come from?
2265 11 replies Last reply today at 7:38 AM View thread
2266
2267csw [7:27 AM] 
2268In the input to a hash function, the standard calls for a stream. That stream can be of any form
2269
2270newliberty [7:27 AM] 
2271awemany: If there were sha256 not 2sha256
2272
2273awemany [7:28 AM] 
2274csw, right, but the closure of that is just aleph0?
2275
2276csw [7:28 AM] 
2277Yes, or lower when you bound the input
2278
2279[7:29] 
2280A stream is an unbounded set.
2281
2282[7:29] 
2283Note that this is in itself not infinite. That is finite but unbounded. Add to that infinite and the set increases again.
2284
2285[7:30] 
2286Joel... Yes, and in a set of companies and businesses, we create a system that can self regulate and grow.
2287
2288
2289awemany [7:31 AM] 
2290but all the streams I actually can hash appear to be strictly enumerable? it is not like SHA256 works on *infinite* streams?
2291
2292checksum0 [7:31 AM] 
2293joined #general. Also, @mastodon joined.
2294
2295csw [7:32 AM] 
2296SHA256 works on infinite the same way any machine works on infinite... You never halt and hence it is never solved in real time. It is in the conceptual infinite
2297
2298[7:33] 
2299We have a distinction here between an implemented system and a mathematically possible state.
2300
2301awemany [7:33 AM] 
2302ok. fair enough. i can see that now. thanks!
2303
2304joeldalais [7:33 AM] 
2305when i thought that i couldn't have anymore 'epiphany' moments in bitcoin, another occurs :slightly_smiling_face: ty csw
2306
2307
2308csw [7:34 AM] 
2309This is going to get me in so much trouble. I know it.
2310
2311joeldalais [7:34 AM] 
2312:smile:
2313
2314[7:34] 
2315nah, we've been lucky so far, no trolls, its been good sensible talking :slightly_smiling_face:
2316
2317odindillinger [7:35 AM] 
2318joined #general
2319
2320csw [7:35 AM] 
2321If we now start to look at network propagation models. In epidemic modelling we have giant nodes at the point of decision  between competing epidemics
2322
2323
2324iang [7:35 AM] 
2325r any changes necessary to base protocol to go to coffeechain?
2326
2327jp [7:35 AM] 
2328It is Hidden Markov Chain
2329
2330csw [7:35 AM] 
2331These are able to be made into propagation systems. Routers you may say.
2332
2333[7:35] 
2334Yes, the cap needs to be lifted.
2335
2336
2337iang [7:35 AM] 
2338(I’m not familiar with the argument as to how this is done… just trying to divide and conquer…)
2339
2340[7:36] 
2341Ah, that’s easy.
2342
2343csw [7:36 AM] 
2344https://github.com/trottier/original-bitcoin/blob/92ee8d9a994391d148733da77e2bbc2f4acc43cd/src/main.cpp#L2249
2345GitHub
2346trottier/original-bitcoin
2347original-bitcoin - This is a historical repository of Satoshi Nakamoto's original bitcoin sourcecode
2348 
2349
2350iang [7:36 AM] 
2351:upside_down_face:
2352
2353csw [7:36 AM] 
2354The early code (commented) notes what is needed for flood control
2355
2356awemany [7:37 AM] 
2357csw, ok thanks you cleared this up, I think. to restate to figure out whether I got this: basically, you do the double hashing pretty much to make further analysis of the hash function - if taken as a black box - easier?
2358
2359csw [7:38 AM] 
2360A double hash reduces the input to a hash and makes collisions infeasible
2361
2362[7:38] 
2363MD5, SHA1...
2364
2365[7:38] 
2366All of this goes away when you have a hash of a hash
2367
2368[7:39] 
2369That means that when there is a flaw in the code, the hash function I should say, you end with enough time to migrate away and to another and even those who are left do not have a more than nominal chance of compromise
2370
2371awemany [7:41 AM] 
2372ok, thanks, I think I get the idea now. there's still nothing that proves SHA256 is surjective, however, or is there?
2373
2374iang [7:41 AM] 
2375In late 2000s this was a thing, post Shandong 2004.
2376
2377chritchens [7:41 AM] 
2378joined #general
2379
2380csw [7:41 AM] 
2381No, SHA256 has not been proven in all cases
2382
2383[7:42] 
2384So, there can be a particular SHA256 hash that maps to many 256 bit values
2385
2386csw [7:43 AM] 
2387uploaded this image: image.png
2388  Add Comment
2389
2390csw [7:43 AM] 
2391Wow. This lets me post math images :slightly_smiling_face:
2392
2393[7:44] 
2394So, no, SHA 256 has not been proven surjective... That image above. There are axioms that need to be proven for this to hold
2395
2396ajd [7:44 AM] 
2397from wikipedia?
2398
2399csw [7:44 AM] 
2400Yes :slightly_smiling_face:
2401
2402ajd [7:44 AM] 
2403:smile:
2404
2405csw [7:44 AM] 
2406I could not get it to take Latex
2407
2408csw [7:45 AM] 
2409Can you do latex in this?
24101 reply Today at 7:45 AM View thread
2411
2412awemany [7:45 AM] 
2413so...  that would get worse with double hashing, it potentially reduces the size of the output set. do you have any discussion on that trade-off?
2414
2415csw [7:45 AM] 
2416Not that I can really do justice to here
2417
2418[7:46] 
2419Does this thing have a whiteboard or something similar?
2420
2421wpalczynski [7:46 AM] 
2422joined #general
2423
2424newliberty [7:46 AM] 
2425No whiteboard in slack
2426
2427csw [7:46 AM] 
2428:disappointed:
2429
2430newliberty [7:46 AM] 
2431https://www.codecogs.com/latex/eqneditor.php
2432codecogs.com
2433Online LaTeX Equation Editor - create, integrate and download
2434HTML LaTeX equation editor that creates graphical equations (gif, png, swf, pdf, emf). Produces code for directly embedding equations into HTML websites, forums or blogs. Images may also be dragged into other applications like Word. Open source and XHTML compliant.
2435
2436wpalczynski [7:47 AM] 
2437hey!!
2438
2439jp [7:47 AM] 
2440You can livestream using 3rd app
2441
2442klee [7:47 AM] 
2443https://github.com/sand500/SlackLateX
2444GitHub
2445sand500/SlackLateX
2446SlackLateX - Bot that posts posts Latex pictures
2447 
2448
2449csw [7:48 AM] 
2450Got those, but no way to draw directly.
2451
2452bicmac1973 [7:49 AM] 
2453joined #general
2454
2455klee [7:50 AM] 
2456Just paste the captioned image (from elsewhere)
2457
2458[7:50] 
2459for me is the fastest way (edited)
2460
2461csw [7:51 AM] 
2462I will but answering on the fly is not so easy in latex :slightly_smiling_face:
2463
2464coinspeak 
2465[7:51 AM] 
2466joined #general
2467
2468jp [7:51 AM] 
2469Please consider doing some whiteboard videos in the future.
2470
2471joeldalais [7:52 AM] 
2472there's a paid sketch board thing for slack, but doubt this slack has it :disappointed:
2473
2474csw [7:53 AM] 
2475I have a big electronic whiteboard, but I do not think it has a slack plug
2476
2477
2478tomothy 
2479[7:54 AM] 
2480pretty sure bitsko's sleeping or at work, he mentioned it hours ago :confused:
2481
2482jp [7:54 AM] 
2483New slack ICO - decentralized whiteboard function included
2484
2485tomothy 
2486[7:54 AM] 
2487( I think work) (so can't add functions or change things currently)
2488
2489satoshi [7:54 AM] 
2490Ha!
2491
2492joeldalais [7:54 AM] 
2493https://sketchboard.io/pricing - for future reference (edited)
2494
2495
2496csw [7:55 AM] 
2497Yep
2498
2499[7:55] 
2500Got it
2501
2502[7:55] 
2503I need to run in a moment.
2504Other questions
2505
2506iang [7:56 AM] 
2507Which institutions do you think should emerge?
2508
2509[7:56] 
2510I for one have promoted the idea of Arbitration (complicated I know) … but there are many possibilities. (edited)
2511
2512
2513csw [7:56 AM] 
2514Many, but this is also a market function.  Arbitration is a good one as it is possible to contract law.
2515
2516wings [7:56 AM] 
2517joined #general
2518
2519tomothy 
2520[7:57 AM] 
2521When are you coming back again? :smile:
2522
2523csw [7:57 AM] 
2524That is, you can agree on an arbitrator and make the contract conditional on that role. This then replaces the role of the court and in Rothbardian terms allows for the democratisation of the justice system
2525
2526satoshi [7:57 AM] 
2527Thanks for answering questions Craig.  It went surprisingly well I think.  Amazing what can be accomplished in the absence of trolling.
2528
2529jp [7:58 AM] 
2530LukeJr missed the debate. I pinned Dr. Wright scale comments here. Expect to see Luke Jr reaponse.
2531
2532
2533iang [7:58 AM] 
2534There’s also the possibility of moving direct voting into the system - create an ability for people holding BTC to vote on a proposal.  As the proposal wins some form of majority, it leads the direction on changes.
2535
2536
2537craig_s_wright [7:58 AM] 
2538joined #general
2539
2540
2541megalodon
2542[7:58 AM] 
2543lol
2544
2545csw [7:58 AM] 
2546I have a doppelganger it seems :slightly_smiling_face:
2547
2548
2549satoshi [7:59 AM] 
2550So many Craigs, so little time.
2551
2552megalodon
2553[7:59 AM] 
2554will the real Craig Wright please stand up
2555
2556craig_s_wright [7:59 AM] 
2557Hi guys
2558
2559checksum0 [7:59 AM] 
2560And cue the trolls...
2561
2562freetrader [7:59 AM] 
2563lesson on identity
2564
2565iang [8:00 AM] 
2566brands are such fun…  everyone should have one
2567
2568tomothy 
2569[8:00 AM] 
2570But seriously, I'm sure there will be some interesting responses to a lot of your comments here today. You've provided a lot of food for thought. If I pester Vlad enough do you think you can make another appearance? :smile:
2571
2572csw [8:00 AM] 
2573Yes.
2574 
2575
2576[8:00] 
2577If we keep it civil
2578
2579craig_s_wright [8:00 AM] 
2580congrats on matonis
2581
2582jp [8:00 AM] 
2583Mod here will purge trollers and craig_s_wright
2584
2585csw [8:01 AM] 
2586Thanks Craig :slightly_smiling_face:
2587
2588
2589bicmac1973 [8:01 AM] 
2590hi guys and gals, nice to be here. Let me stress that I am absolutely not craig wright!
2591
2592jesse [8:01 AM] 
2593joined #general
2594
2595csw [8:01 AM] 
2596LOL BicM...
2597
2598craig_s_wright [8:01 AM] 
2599I'm actually a famous craig_s_wright, and I wouldn't mind staying in this chat as craig_s_wright.  nowhere do I claim to be the "real" Craig S Wright
2600
2601csw [8:02 AM] 
2602Well, there are a good number of Craig Wrights :slightly_smiling_face:
2603
2604daniweav [8:02 AM] 
2605joined #general
2606
2607wings [8:02 AM] 
2608be serious guys...talk on topic only plz
2609
2610craig_s_wright [8:02 AM] 
2611I'm going to bid 900 BTC on bitstamp right now
2612
2613iang [8:02 AM] 
2614ok … so here’s a rhetorical.  What innovations post-2009 from the ideas / literature would have been good to put in, if only?
2615
2616daniweav [8:02 AM] 
2617Hello, newbie here. :baby_bottle:
2618
2619[8:02] 
2620Nice to meet you all. :slightly_smiling_face:
2621
2622vlad2vlad [8:03 AM] 
2623@bitsko time to come back!!!
2624
2625csw [8:03 AM] 
2626Another time Ian.
2627
2628iang [8:03 AM] 
2629k
2630
2631tomothy 
2632[8:03 AM] 
2633Alright, well thank you for your time today CSW. I'm sure we can waste your time all day. Hope we get to do this again in a bit.
2634
2635
2636csw [8:03 AM] 
2637I do need to go. Sorry.
2638 
2639
2640joeldalais [8:03 AM] 
2641i'm off for now, was great chatting, a lot of thanks to csw :+1: have a good one all
2642
2643satoshi [8:03 AM] 
2644Bye Craig.  Ignore the trolls and keep working.
2645
2646tomothy 
2647[8:03 AM] 
2648Thanks again for staying as long as you did. Greatly appreciated you sticking around to address all the additional comments.
2649
2650craig_s_wright [8:03 AM] 
2651I can take over for you @csw
2652
2653daniweav [8:03 AM] 
2654So many craig s wrights :dizzy_face:
2655
2656jp [8:03 AM] 
2657Fuck off
2658
2659[8:04] 
2660Where is mod?
2661
2662daniweav [8:04 AM] 
2663I'm very confused... Can someone help me?
2664
2665satoshi [8:04 AM] 
2666csw = Craig
2667
2668tomothy 
2669[8:04 AM] 
2670Bitsko's at work. Please make a pastebin of texts
2671
2672satoshi [8:04 AM] 
2673My pastebin is updated.
2674
2675tomothy 
2676[8:04 AM] 
2677If we play well and are polite maybe we get to do this again another time.
2678
2679[8:04] 
2680Thanks Satoshi. Can you share a link for those that just joined?
2681
2682daniweav [8:04 AM] 
2683Hmm... I'm going to squelch myself and observe. :thinking_face: :bow: please forgive me.
2684
2685tomothy 
2686[8:04 AM] 
2687Do you have the early morning discussion as well? Or evening/afternoon depending on timezone?
2688
2689Pinned by jp 
2690Today at 8:05 AM Pinned by jp
2691satoshi [8:05 AM] 
2692https://pastebin.com/zU6YZWXK
2693Pastebin
2694Craig Wright Q&A on Slack - Pastebin.com (19kB)
2695 
2696
2697awemany [8:05 AM] 
2698thanks!
2699
2700satoshi [8:05 AM] 
2701I'm going back to add discussion prior to csw joining.  I have it in another notepad.
2702
2703awemany [8:06 AM] 
2704and make it an rbtc post. I am really wondering what nullc finds to pick apart
2705
2706tomothy 
2707[8:06 AM] 
2708Alright Vlad, back to throwing mud at one another!
2709
2710vlad2vlad [8:07 AM] 
2711Hahaha.  Awesome
2712
2713[8:07] 
2714All that tech talk.  We can go back to talking about cats and Transylvania
2715
2716[8:07] 
2717The important stuff
2718
2719tomothy 
2720[8:07 AM] 
2721and vampires, so many vampires
2722
2723iang [8:08 AM] 
27242nm ??? f**k
2725
2726craig_s_wright [8:08 AM] 
2727His stuff reads like /r/iamverysmart
2728
2729jp [8:08 AM] 
2730Fuck off craig_s_wright
2731
2732
2733Pinned by jp 
2734Today at 8:08 AM Pinned by jp
2735travin [8:08 AM] 
2736I have also updated my pastebin now - https://pastebin.com/5A7Awrmd
2737Pastebin
2738Craig Wright Q&A btcchat.slack.com - Pastebin.com (19kB)
2739
2740[8:08] 
2741Thanks to @satoshi for doing the same. :slightly_smiling_face:
2742
2743[8:10] 
2744Mine is just the start at 10:00 CEST. With the first question from christopher (edited)
2745
2746satoshi [8:12 AM] 
2747Thanks Travin.
2748
2749
2750craig_s_wright [8:15 AM] 
2751If I say that 1) I am not really Craig S Wright and 2) I don't believe that the real Craig S Wright is Satoshi, can I stay here?  :muscle:
2752
2753tomothy 
2754[8:15 AM] 
2755I think CSW or JP discussed original team members before in pastebin
2756
2757[8:15] 
2758early on in discussion
2759
2760[8:16] 
2761we've got vlad and bruce here so, :smile:
2762
2763[8:17] 
2764:heart:
2765
2766checksum0 [8:17 AM] 
2767@craig_s_wright You saw this conversation was happening by being linked to it so you damn well knew what was going on here and you still decided to sign up with that name and you expect people to not believe you are a goddamn troll?
2768
2769craig_s_wright [8:18 AM] 
2770It is a poorly chosen username, I admit.
2771
2772tomothy 
2773[8:18 AM] 
2774whale, not troll...
2775
2776[8:18] 
2777another pastebin copy
2778
2779[8:18] 
2780https://pastebin.com/5A7Awrmd
2781
2782[8:19] 
2783nm, already posted :smile:
2784
2785bitcoindevotee [8:19 AM] 
2786joined #general
2787
2788prometheus [8:20 AM] 
2789Greetings, everyone! What a wonderful chat session with CSW. Thank you for setting this up @bitsko and @vlad2vlad . I do hope CSW will return for another Q&A. I'd love to hear him answer more questions about the original code and his future vision of BTC.
2790
2791
2792vlad2vlad [8:22 AM] 
2793We'll make it happen - it was too good to not do it again.  :)
2794
2795
2796tomothy 
2797[8:22 AM] 
2798Quick, cat pictures or mud slinging!
2799
2800craig_s_wright [8:22 AM] 
2801Stop listening to Craig S Wright, he is a phony and wants your money.
2802
2803vlad2vlad [8:23 AM] 
2804@bitsko  give me mod power.  I need to smash some trolls.
2805
2806craig_s_wright [8:23 AM] 
2807don't be part of the problem, be part of the answer
2808
2809daniweav [8:34 AM] 
2810The solution* answers can be wrong. :neutral_face:
2811
2812deadsea33 [8:47 AM] 
2813joined #general. Also, @peggy joined, @macsga joined, @satoshi420 joined.
2814
2815macsga [8:55 AM] 
2816greetings
2817
2818
2819[8:57] 
2820all the nice people here
2821
2822alp 
2823[9:01 AM] 
2824how do we know this is real csw?
2825
2826[9:01] 
2827any verification?
2828
2829bitsko [9:01 AM] 
2830Nothing to see here alp
2831
2832tomothy 
2833[9:01 AM] 
2834E-mail linked to his slack, text of discussion.
2835
2836[9:02] 
2837It can't possibly be him. He clearly was just making things up as he went along.
2838
2839[9:02] 
2840I paid my brother to make a fake e-mail address and spought smart sounding stuff.
2841
2842[9:02] 
2843...
2844
2845bitsko [9:02 AM] 
2846:dove_of_peace:
2847
2848tomothy 
2849[9:03 AM] 
2850But maybe it is... (Of course it is!)
2851
2852bitsko [9:03 AM] 
2853:ohyeah:
2854
2855klee [9:03 AM] 
2856:aa:
2857
2858vlad2vlad [9:05 AM] 
2859@alp  ohhh, you missed it
2860
2861[9:05] 
2862Here's the pastebin for you
2863
2864tomothy 
2865[9:06 AM] 
2866no pastebin...
2867
2868[9:06] 
2869probably because it's already been posted? can you redirect link to it or something?
2870
2871macsga [9:06 AM] 
2872https://pastebin.com/5A7Awrmd
2873
2874vlad2vlad [9:06 AM] 
2875https://pastebin.com/5A7Awrmd
2876
2877tomothy 
2878[9:07 AM] 
2879nm :smile:
2880
2881alp 
2882[9:07 AM] 
2883I saw the pastebin
2884
2885[9:07] 
2886havent gone through it all
2887
2888[9:07] 
2889but how was he verified?
2890
2891macsga [9:07 AM] 
2892pretty serious stuff were spoken in there, among those is that who is SN doesn't really matter
2893
2894alp 
2895[9:07 AM] 
2896well csw is a fraud so of course he makes stuff up
2897
2898macsga [9:08 AM] 
2899that's one way to see this
2900
2901alp 
2902[9:08 AM] 
2903who is jp?
2904
2905[9:08] 
2906jvp?
2907
2908macsga [9:08 AM] 
2909the other is to patiently check the text
2910
2911[9:08] 
2912God and Jesus Christ
2913
2914[9:08] 
2915(respectively)
2916
2917norway [9:08 AM] 
2918Homework for @alp
2919
2920macsga [9:08 AM] 
2921does it matter?
2922
2923[9:08] 
2924:slightly_smiling_face:
2925
2926alp 
2927[9:09 AM] 
2928yall get bamboozled?
2929
2930norway [9:09 AM] 
2931Maybe
2932
2933macsga [9:09 AM] 
2934definitely
2935
2936alp 
2937[9:10 AM] 
2938fake fake satoshi pretends to be fake satoshi lol
2939
2940norway [9:10 AM] 
2941Thanks for sharing, @apl
2942
2943tomothy 
2944[9:11 AM] 
2945jvp is new liberty
2946
2947[9:11] 
2948jp john
2949
2950[9:11] 
2951and yeah i'd agree with macsga on characterizations
2952
2953[9:11] 
2954I gave him all my money and got a pin
2955
2956[9:11] 
2957(worth it)
2958
2959alp 
2960[9:11 AM] 
2961ok wasnt sure who john is in that context (edited)
2962
2963tomothy 
2964[9:13 AM] 
2965see pastebin its in there
2966
2967[9:13] 
2968its allllllll in there
2969
2970[9:13] 
2971:slightly_smiling_face:
2972
2973macsga [9:14 AM] 
2974yeah, nice 10m read
2975
2976[9:15] 
2977I'll review it once more once home
2978
2979andrewquentson [9:33 AM] 
2980joined #general
2981
2982andrewquentson [9:39 AM] 
2983"IF you need to do what I say as I am Satoshi and not because of the idea I am presenting, but the nature of my identity, then you are all lost!" why bother telling us all you're satoshi then, instead of, you know, just presenting your work @craig_s_wright @csw @vlad2vlad
2984
2985csw [9:40 AM] 
2986https://medium.com/@MADinMelbourne/welcome-to-the-ministry-of-truth-in-the-wiki-age-601ec28a2504
2987Medium
2988Welcome to the Ministry of Truth in the Wiki Age. – #thewildcard – Medium
2989“Is this really happening?” was tweeted to me yesterday as nChain announced it’s arrival into the Bitcoin scene, bringing with it the…
2990Reading time
2991----------------
29924 min read
2993
2994(461kB)
2995April 17th at 2:36 AM
2996
2997[9:40] 
2998Nothing of the last year was planned.
2999
3000[9:41] 
3001I listened to the wrong ideas and simply where we should be is ignoring and leaving the myth.
3002
3003[9:42] 
3004I had started to present my work. That is when the attacks started and i was not prepared for any of it.
3005
3006[9:43] 
3007I did not expect to have to explain the distinction between a PhD and a professional doctorate and I did not expect to have any of the other fabrications to defend.
3008
3009[9:44] 
3010I have learnt from this. I am saddened that people feel they need an authority and cannot learn and must come to a state where they express an attack as an opinion.
3011
3012Yes, you can have an opinion, but this is not the same as a reasoned argument.
3013
3014andrewquentson [9:45 AM] 
3015Sorry, but your first act was to claim authority by claiming you are Satoshi
3016
3017[9:45] 
3018why?
3019
3020csw [9:45 AM] 
3021No, I was not the one talking in Dec 2015
3022
3023[9:46] 
3024Nor did I make up stories about recommended settings in encryption software
3025
3026iang [9:46 AM] 
3027The events of 2015 - 2016 weren’t really of Craig’s wanting.  The first problem was the attacker and extortionists and various other sundy gossipers… so the writing was on the wall.
3028
3029jp [9:46 AM] 
3030In 2015 we were hacked and blackmailed
3031
3032iang [9:46 AM] 
3033The second problem was the circus team in London that went out of control.
3034
3035
3036andrewquentson [9:47 AM] 
3037Does that include the BBC interview?
3038
3039macsga [9:47 AM] 
3040lol
3041
3042csw [9:47 AM] 
3043I was promised a simple low key interview. No TV camera
3044
3045andrewquentson [9:47 AM] 
3046with the BBC!
3047
3048[9:47] 
3049low key?
3050
3051csw [9:47 AM] 
3052It was not what eventuated
3053
3054iang [9:47 AM] 
3055yes all the events of May 2015 and the big reveal … it actually started around mid 2015.
3056
3057betty [9:48 AM] 
3058joined #general
3059
3060alp 
3061[9:48 AM] 
3062csw can you with a key for me?
3063
3064andrewquentson [9:48 AM] 
3065Alright, can you tell me how it came that Gavin ended up vauching for you?
3066
3067csw [9:48 AM] 
3068I signed the contracts and moved to London 5 months before any of this.
3069
3070Pinned by rajsallin 
3071Today at 11:20 AM Pinned by rajsallin
3072[9:49] 
3073A...Q... no. If Gavin does, that is his decision
3074
3075iang [9:49 AM] 
3076Basically it’s as said - CSW was used to add a couple of zeros to the patent portfolio.  Which necessitated the ‘big reveal’ … circus.  Unfortunately, CSW fails at being a pop star.  Who knew…
3077
3078alp 
3079[9:49 AM] 
3080when does Gavin join NChain?
3081
3082[9:49] 
3083How much money did Roger give to nChain?
3084
3085csw [9:49 AM] 
3086The worst thing I can do is play a public role.
3087
3088[9:49] 
3089I have given no money to Roger
3090
3091andrewquentson [9:50 AM] 
3092Well, how more public can you get than Gavin vauching for you
3093
3094iang [9:50 AM] 
3095sounds like business questions - I for one would expect the business team at nChain to deal with them.
3096
3097csw [9:50 AM] 
3098Gavin is semi retired and does not miss the trolling
3099
3100andrewquentson [9:50 AM] 
3101now, my memory might be wrong, but back then I think he publicly wrote saying you or someone related asked him to visit you
3102
3103[9:50] 
3104is that true?
3105
3106csw [9:50 AM] 
3107Related yes.
3108
3109travin [9:50 AM] 
3110Hey Andrew.
3111
3112andrewquentson [9:51 AM] 
3113so you willfully went forward with a ceremony which was meant to prove your identity, why?
3114
3115mrhodl [9:51 AM] 
3116joined #general
3117
3118alp 
3119[9:51 AM] 
3120how much money did roger fund nChain/
3121
3122[9:51] 
3123not that you paid him
3124
3125andrewquentson [9:51 AM] 
3126identity as claimed satoshi that is
3127
3128csw [9:51 AM] 
3129Roger. Nothing
3130
3131beautybubble [9:51 AM] 
3132joined #general
3133
3134csw [9:51 AM] 
3135I believed promises.
3136
3137[9:52] 
3138I was told, one time, and then you can be left alone.
3139
3140andrewquentson [9:52 AM] 
3141I mean, if you want us to just judge you, rather than authority, why engage in an event which tries to claim authority by showing an alleged satoshi owned address signature?
3142
3143csw [9:52 AM] 
3144I agree
3145
3146andrewquentson [9:52 AM] 
3147you agree with what sorry?
3148
3149klee [9:53 AM] 
3150read the pastebin before asking questions already answered DAMNIT
3151
3152csw [9:53 AM] 
3153I agree that was foolish
3154
3155beautybubble [9:53 AM] 
3156Pleased to be here to learn some new things.
3157
3158[9:53] 
3159Thank you for having me.
3160
3161andrewquentson [9:53 AM] 
3162alright
3163
3164travin [9:53 AM] 
3165@andrewquentson -https://pastebin.com/5A7Awrmd
3166Pastebin
3167Craig Wright Q&A btcchat.slack.com - Pastebin.com (19kB)
3168
3169andrewquentson [9:53 AM] 
3170this supercomputer @csw it doesn't exist does it?
3171
3172csw [9:53 AM] 
3173Actually it did
3174
3175tomothy 
3176[9:53 AM] 
3177Yes, Look at yesterdays disclosure from Vlad
3178
3179andrewquentson [9:53 AM] 
3180did?
3181
3182tomothy 
3183[9:53 AM] 
3184He provided all the information concerning the computer
3185
3186csw [9:54 AM] 
3187Did.
3188
3189tomothy 
3190[9:54 AM] 
3191Invoices, receipts, along with significant other information
3192
3193andrewquentson [9:54 AM] 
3194what happened to it?
3195
3196csw [9:54 AM] 
3197I had dealings with people connected to Liberty Reserve and who later ran systems in Panama
3198
3199jp [9:54 AM] 
3200I did the security pen test on it before the public class programming on supercomputer started
3201
3202andrewquentson [9:55 AM] 
3203where was the supercomputer stored/held csw?
3204
3205csw [9:55 AM] 
3206Panama
3207
3208iang [9:55 AM] 
3209Moore’s Law :slightly_smiling_face:  computers do get rather old…
3210
3211macsga [9:55 AM] 
3212like I said several times, I'd put a good use to it :slightly_smiling_face:
3213
3214
3215andrewquentson [9:55 AM] 
3216ok
3217
3218[9:55] 
3219I can see your typing looks fine
3220
3221[9:56] 
3222your background shows, however, you often like to miss-spell words
3223
3224[9:56] 
3225create grammatically messy sentances
3226
3227[9:56] 
3228why?
3229
3230csw [9:56 AM] 
3231I have friends who own more computer power than I do. They simply do not use them to do scientific calculations, they run Poker rooms.
3232 
3233
3234[9:56] 
3235Would you like me to mis-type
3236
3237
3238beautybubble [9:56 AM] 
3239Because I prefer specifics.  Are you speaking of The Panamanian SERVIR center is housed in the City of Knowledge, at CATHALAC.
3240
3241andrewquentson [9:56 AM] 
3242my preferences are completley irrelevant
3243
3244beautybubble [9:56 AM] 
3245Thank you.
3246
3247andrewquentson [9:57 AM] 
3248the document which says you entered into a partnership with the company that provided the supercomputer parts is grammatically unsound
3249
3250[9:57] 
3251your public forum statements are often grammatically unsound
3252
3253[9:57] 
3254why?
3255
3256csw [9:57 AM] 
3257My academic papers are sound.
3258
3259iang [9:57 AM] 
3260wtf?
3261
3262andrewquentson [9:58 AM] 
3263is the miss-spelling intentional?
3264
3265csw [9:58 AM] 
3266:slightly_smiling_face:
3267
3268[9:58] 
3269No more.
3270
3271alp 
3272[9:58 AM] 
3273you angered him andrew
3274
3275[9:58] 
3276the wizard of oz will close the doors on you
3277
3278iang [9:58 AM] 
3279@andrewquentson have you ever usd computers?
3280
3281andrewquentson [9:58 AM] 
3282you're completely free to not answer
3283
3284[9:59] 
3285but that doesn't leave many obvious conclusions
3286
3287freetrader [9:59 AM] 
3288... and did you spell-check your comments above (if not, you should)
3289
3290csw [9:59 AM] 
3291Your assumption is that I created those documents. Even now, I like to work in my own area and remain a curmudgeon, but I am not too far from people.
3292
3293snoop [9:59 AM] 
3294Alp=ass
3295
3296alp 
3297[10:00 AM] 
3298hi poons
3299
3300andrewquentson [10:00 AM] 
3301"When looking at Craig Steven Wright’s background, his seemingly inability to spell stands out immediately. As does his preference for general terms, vague language, and long windedness.
3302
3303Wright’s now deleted Linkedin profile contains 26 A4 sized pages and terms such as “Encryption Techniology” and “continential kitchens”."
3304
3305alp 
3306[10:00 AM] 
3307https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6qPo1zzU7s
3308YouTube doc biz
3309in which Craig Wright says "fuck off"
3310 
3311
3312andrewquentson [10:00 AM] 
3313you didn't write your own linkedin?
3314
3315csw [10:00 AM] 
3316:slightly_smiling_face:
3317
3318alp 
3319[10:00 AM] 
3320fuck off your mother if you want fuck off
3321
3322csw [10:00 AM] 
3323I did not manage much of my social media
3324
3325beautybubble [10:01 AM] 
3326Oh, dear.
3327
3328kp [10:01 AM] 
3329joined #general
3330
3331mrhodl [10:01 AM] 
3332@csw How long were you in a relationship with Michelle?
3333
3334beautybubble [10:01 AM] 
3335Once people calm down we can introduce ourselves and put on the table concerns.  Right?
3336
3337csw [10:01 AM] 
3338Yes, I am angered by people who say that they can reverse ECC private keys (excluding brain wallets)
3339
3340[10:01] 
3341I have never met Seven
3342
3343mrhodl [10:02 AM] 
3344Alright, Who manages your social media account?
3345
3346andrewquentson [10:02 AM] 
3347alright, what's the probability of compromise @csw ?
3348
3349csw [10:02 AM] 
3350A...Q... is this me...
3351
3352mrhodl [10:02 AM] 
3353So you never met Seven, eh?
3354
3355[10:02] 
3356How did you get on that panel?
3357
3358csw [10:02 AM] 
3359No, I was on a panel from London
3360
3361mrhodl [10:02 AM] 
3362Sure, but why did she invite you? (edited)
3363
3364alp 
3365[10:03 AM] 
3366csw's dick is so long it went all the way from london to the us
3367
3368
3369jp [10:03 AM] 
3370I insisted csw not to do it
3371
3372andrewquentson [10:03 AM] 
3373"
3374
3375   “Where a system uses an SMS response with a separate system (such as a web page), the probability that the banking user is compromised and a fraud is committed, P(Compromise), can be calculated as: P(Compromise) = P(C.SMS) x P(C.PIN)
3376
3377   Where: P(C.SMS) is the probability of compromising the SMS function and P(C.PIN) is the compromise of the user authentication method [sic]
3378
3379   The user can be compromised by Trojan apps, poor pins that are pasted to a monitor etc.”
3380
3381mrhodl [10:03 AM] 
3382JP, that's not my question..
3383
3384[10:03] 
3385How was on on there to begin with?
3386
3387andrewquentson [10:03 AM] 
3388I suppose that's you, unless others write under your name in mailing lists too
3389
3390beautybubble [10:03 AM] 
3391I am certain once we get through some of this hostility, we can get on to the bigger, better conversation.
3392
3393csw [10:03 AM] 
3394That is a long story and I do not wish to discuss it. I was not (as is stated) 'fucking' her, we have never been in the same city at the same time to my knowledge
3395
3396beautybubble [10:04 AM] 
3397Please guys try and be civil here.
3398
3399csw [10:04 AM] 
3400ALP... I would like to think so... but I am not that large :wink:
3401 
3402
3403mrhodl [10:04 AM] 
3404long story ..got it
3405
3406alp 
3407[10:04 AM] 
3408why should we be civil beauty?
3409
3410csw [10:04 AM] 
3411A...Q... That was a VERY short part of a very long equation (edited)
3412
3413opet [10:04 AM] 
3414joined #general
3415
3416beautybubble [10:04 AM] 
3417It allows for team work and conversation.
3418
3419alp 
3420[10:05 AM] 
3421team work with a con artist?
3422
3423[10:05] 
3424who gives a fuck
3425
3426mrhodl [10:05 AM] 
3427@csw Does @jp have a picture of you from 2005?
3428
3429andrewquentson [10:05 AM] 
3430@csw what's a Merkel Tree?
3431
3432mrhodl [10:05 AM] 
3433I hear you met at a cypherpunk conference.. he pointed you to a tent?
3434
3435andrewquentson [10:05 AM] 
3436@alp and @mrhodl can you try and not shut down discussion
3437
3438beautybubble [10:05 AM] 
3439I came here to meet a person who I am very interested in and I hope we can work through some of the harder parts.
3440
3441csw [10:05 AM] 
3442MrH... I hope not. But I used to come and go from conferences
3443
3444alp 
3445[10:06 AM] 
3446lol aquent whining about trolling
3447
3448andrewquentson [10:06 AM] 
3449questions are cool, but...
3450
3451alp 
3452[10:06 AM] 
3453pot calling kettle black here
3454
3455mrhodl [10:06 AM] 
3456Andrew, my questions are more relevant... sorry.
3457
3458csw [10:06 AM] 
3459A...Q... A merkle tree... Please ask something difficult.
3460
3461andrewquentson [10:06 AM] 
3462yes yes just relax @alp (edited)
3463
3464
3465mrhodl [10:06 AM] 
3466@jp Do you have that picture?
3467
3468jp [10:06 AM] 
3469I'm not jvp
3470
3471mrhodl [10:06 AM] 
3472Oh, right
3473
3474[10:06] 
3475So who are you?
3476
3477jp [10:06 AM] 
3478John
3479
3480alp 
3481[10:07 AM] 
3482whats your assocation to satoshi dundee
3483
3484jp [10:07 AM] 
3485Fuck off bastatd
3486
3487alp 
3488[10:07 AM] 
3489fluffer?
3490
3491jp [10:07 AM] 
3492Piece of cumbag
3493
3494mrhodl [10:07 AM] 
3495You told Craig not to go on that panel? Why? Who are you to Craig?
3496
3497jp [10:07 AM] 
3498Fluff your fucking mother if you wanna fluff
3499
3500macsga [10:07 AM] 
3501lol
3502
3503satoshi [10:08 AM] 
3504Don't engage or respond to trolling.  Ping bitsko to remove.
3505
3506macsga [10:08 AM] 
3507dat quote
3508
3509coinspeak 
3510[10:08 AM] 
3511If you have doubts that's fine but be civil. If you don't believe then just listen and see if you learn something vs dominate the conversation being a troll.
3512
3513mrhodl [10:08 AM] 
3514@satoshi How is this "trolling"?
3515
3516iang [10:08 AM] 
3517I think it is fair enough if technical and cryptographic questions are asked.
3518
3519
3520satoshi [10:08 AM] 
3521Agreed
3522
3523jp [10:08 AM] 
3524And this is not a fucking interrogation
3525
3526freetrader [10:08 AM] 
3527I believe this slack is an exercise in free speech. We have to accept the unsavory commenters.
3528
3529iang [10:09 AM] 
3530Beyond that, the reality TV questions are probably better off left to some other venue.  Like . reality TV.
3531
3532klee [10:09 AM] 
3533why should we give a flying fuk who Craig fucks?
3534
3535mrhodl [10:09 AM] 
3536CSW is claiming to be Satoshi, yes?
3537
3538jp [10:09 AM] 
3539Craig, I Think you should leave.
3540
3541
3542csw [10:09 AM] 
3543Free speech does not incorporate any speech
3544
3545cypherblock [10:09 AM] 
3546csw is claiming to be csw I think.
3547
3548mrhodl [10:09 AM] 
3549Interesting..
3550
3551satoshi [10:09 AM] 
3552csw = csw
3553
3554csw [10:09 AM] 
3555I believe that I am CSW. I could be mistaken.
3556
3557
3558satoshi [10:09 AM] 
3559LOL
3560
3561klee [10:10 AM] 
3562I am Vinny
35631 reply Today at 10:10 AM View thread
3564
3565mrhodl [10:10 AM] 
3566So you're not claiming to be Satoshi?
3567
3568klee [10:10 AM] 
3569sodl at 1250
3570
3571[10:10] 
3572still waiting for 800
3573
3574iang [10:10 AM] 
3575I’ve got that Who song in my mind… “Who are you?  Who Who?” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdLIerfXuZ4
3576YouTube TheWhoVEVO
3577The Who - Who Are You?
3578 
3579
3580csw [10:10 AM] 
3581And Freetrader, no, free speech does not incorporate libel or slander.
3582
3583alp 
3584[10:10 AM] 
3585satoshi: i was told by bitsko this chat room was explicitly for trolling
3586
3587[10:10] 
3588am i mistaken?
3589
3590csw [10:11 AM] 
3591I am stating that Satoshi needs to remain a myth and no more. Nobody in any position should be accounted as an authority for where they are. The ideas they express need to be weighted and viewed individually.
3592
3593megalodon 
3594[10:11 AM] 
3595alp can you go back to the dragon's den and reformulate the strategy? starting to get pretty stale and repetitive by this point in time
3596
3597freetrader [10:12 AM] 
3598@csw : what I'm referring to is that bitsko has announced he's unlikely to remove anyone from this slack no matter what they say.
3599libel and slander are dealt with lawfully.
3600That said, it may not be wise to feed trolls more than they can handle. (edited)
3601
3602alp 
3603[10:12 AM] 
3604kek
3605
3606cypherblock [10:12 AM] 
3607@csw do you wish to just become a “regular guy” in the community, who should be judged on his current statements, papers, etc and not on any Satoshi stuff?
3608
3609alp 
3610[10:12 AM] 
3611i figure satoshi dundee's scam is pretty stale and repetitive too
3612
3613opet [10:12 AM] 
3614Speaking of ideas, have you released any additional details regarding nChain's intended solution for scaling?
3615
3616mrhodl [10:12 AM] 
3617:thinking_face:
3618
3619prometheus [10:12 AM] 
3620@csw Thank you for helping to bring Bitcoin to life, and thank you for taking the time to answer our questions. I enjoyed reading Andrew O'Hagan's "The Satoshi Affair" piece. In it, it mentions the name "Satoshi Nakamoto" created from combining "Satoshi" (The Pokemon character Ash in Japanese) and "Nakamoto" (Tominaga Nakamoto being the Japanese merchant philosopher). Is this the correct origin on the moniker?
3621
3622You had incredible forethought to create a pseudonym when creating Bitcoin, and creating the "myth" that resulted. Was this influenced by your academic background in Religion and Mythology?
3623
3624andy [10:13 AM] 
3625joined #general
3626
3627mrhodl [10:13 AM] 
3628Why are you thanking him for bringing bitcoin to life? He's not Satoshi. (edited)
3629
3630csw [10:13 AM] 
3631CypherB... I will not be that. In my case it will be a steeper slope
3632
3633
3634andy [10:13 AM] 
3635Well it's been a lively day already I can see.
3636
3637klee [10:13 AM] 
3638csw time to talk about serious stuff, like your training in Ninjutsu & Wing Chun
3639
3640andrewquentson [10:14 AM] 
3641@csw can you share the e-mail you sent to Adam Back?
3642
3643csw [10:14 AM] 
3644No, I will not release company details. There are people for that and when I talk out of turn, I cause trouble.
3645
3646
3647andrewquentson [10:14 AM] 
3648not sure if that's been made public?
3649
3650andy [10:14 AM] 
3651Thanks for answering questions csw.
3652
3653
3654csw [10:14 AM] 
3655A..Q.. That would not be good iff I was to remain not in a role... That email may come out in time.
3656
3657andrewquentson [10:15 AM] 
3658ok
3659
3660csw [10:15 AM] 
3661It would "not" come from me.
3662
3663andrewquentson [10:15 AM] 
3664what happened after you emailed Adam back in... whenever it was?
3665
3666andy [10:15 AM] 
3667If bitcoin suddenly ended tomorrow, would you support the creation of a new coin or support an existing one?
3668
3669
3670csw [10:15 AM] 
3671If Bitcoin ends, then I am broke :slightly_smiling_face:
3672
3673
3674macsga [10:15 AM] 
3675ME TOO
3676
3677
3678[10:15] 
3679:stuck_out_tongue:
3680
3681jp [10:15 AM] 
3682Me too
3683
3684macsga [10:16 AM] 
3685lol
3686
3687klee [10:16 AM] 
3688no suga mamma?
3689
3690megalodon 
3691[10:16 AM] 
3692lol looks like we all really are satoshi then
3693
3694
3695jp [10:16 AM] 
3696No Vegas
3697
3698macsga [10:16 AM] 
3699sugga momma will divorce me
3700
3701klee [10:16 AM] 
3702rekt
3703
3704macsga [10:16 AM] 
3705unless provide sex
3706
3707csw [10:16 AM] 
3708A....Q... Adam (from my understanding) pointed a certain person to Wei. :slightly_smiling_face:
3709
3710jp [10:16 AM] 
3711Vinny rich
3712
3713klee [10:16 AM] 
3714Where's Vinny?
3715
3716mrhodl [10:16 AM] 
3717https://btcchat.slack.com/archives/C555C1FME/p1493918140758518 Why do you say that?
3718csw
3719If Bitcoin ends, then I am broke :slightly_smiling_face:
3720Posted in #generalToday at 10:15 AM
3721
3722macsga [10:17 AM] 
3723Vinny is alp
3724
3725andrewquentson [10:17 AM] 
3726did you speak to wei @csw ?
3727
3728klee [10:17 AM] 
3729We are all Vinny
3730
3731jp [10:17 AM] 
3732Vinnayaan kleecumming
3733
3734
3735andrewquentson [10:17 AM] 
3736speak obvs includes email etc
3737
3738rajsallin [10:17 AM] 
3739joined #general
3740
3741macsga [10:17 AM] 
3742he sodl early and now butthurt
3743
3744csw [10:17 AM] 
374599% of my wealth is in Bitcoin in one way or another. I own no Alts and I have sold most of the property I owned
3746
3747mrhodl [10:17 AM] 
3748@csw Prove it.
3749
3750csw [10:17 AM] 
3751I have talked to Wei in the past, yes.
3752
3753andrewquentson [10:17 AM] 
3754did you speak to wei after speaking to adam @csw ?
3755
3756csw [10:17 AM] 
3757MrH... Prove what?
3758
3759[10:18] 
3760A...Q... No comment
3761
3762jp [10:18 AM] 
3763Keep up with the kardashian is happening, featuring Craig Wright and dragon den ... Ding ding ding.
3764
3765Round 1
3766
3767mrhodl [10:18 AM] 
3768That you are the type of holder you say you are.
3769
3770andy [10:18 AM] 
3771That you'll be broke.  Ignore it.  It's not an assertion that requires proving imo.
3772
3773mrhodl [10:18 AM] 
3774At least sign block 9?
3775
3776klee [10:18 AM] 
3777Plan 9 from Outer Space
3778
3779andrewquentson [10:18 AM] 
3780@csw can you describe what b-money is and how it's similiar or different from bitcoin?
3781
3782[10:18] 
3783this one is a genuine question
3784
3785
3786csw [10:18 AM] 
3787Yes, I can explain b-money
3788
3789alp 
3790[10:19 AM] 
3791uploaded this image: image.png
3792Add Comment
3793
3794andy [10:19 AM] 
3795I'm pretty sure csw has at least a couple of bits if he's CEO of a $300m enterprise looking to dethrone BS.
3796
3797
3798iang [10:19 AM] 
3799Signing things with early keys is not particularly helpful - the keys were moved around several times, and no ‘proof’ is therefore proof.
3800
38012 replies Last reply today at 10:38 AM View thread
3802
3803csw [10:19 AM] 
3804Have you read b-money, the concept is sound, but it was not developed
3805
3806mrhodl [10:19 AM] 
3807@csw Will you ever sign any of the early blocks?
3808
3809alp 
3810[10:19 AM] 
3811andy: how is bs ona  throne
3812
3813andrewquentson [10:19 AM] 
3814I'm actually very curious to know how b-money is similiar and different from bitcoin @csw in a sort of high level conceptual manner
3815
3816andy [10:19 AM] 
3817I bet nChain has more BTC holdings that BS does, as they keep their funds in fiat.
3818 
3819
3820macsga [10:19 AM] 
3821@alp VINNY!
3822
3823alp 
3824[10:19 AM] 
3825kek
3826
3827iang [10:19 AM] 
3828I outlined this on Crypto list a year back:  http://www.metzdowd.com/pipermail/cryptography/2016-May/029323.html  Basically, signing won’t give you the proof-boost you want.
3829
3830alp 
3831[10:19 AM] 
3832you think nchain has any holdings?
3833
3834andy [10:20 AM] 
3835If tons of people have access to early keys then the coins associated would have moved by now, no?
3836
3837csw [10:20 AM] 
3838Part 1 - the paper to discuss.
3839
3840mrhodl [10:20 AM] 
3841@csw Will you ever sign any of the early blocks or are you going to continue bullshitting us?
3842
3843csw [10:20 AM] 
3844I am fascinated by Tim May's crypto-anarchy. Unlike the communities
3845traditionally associated with the word "anarchy", in a crypto-anarchy the
3846government is not temporarily destroyed but permanently forbidden and
3847permanently unnecessary. It's a community where the threat of violence is
3848impotent because violence is impossible, and violence is impossible
3849because its participants cannot be linked to their true names or physical
3850locations.
3851
3852Until now it's not clear, even theoretically, how such a community could
3853operate. A community is defined by the cooperation of its participants,
3854and efficient cooperation requires a medium of exchange (money) and a way
3855to enforce contracts. Traditionally these services have been provided by
3856the government or government sponsored institutions and only to legal
3857entities. In this article I describe a protocol by which these services
3858can be provided to and by untraceable entities.
3859
3860I will actually describe two protocols. The first one is impractical,
3861because it makes heavy use of a synchronous and unjammable anonymous
3862broadcast channel. However it will motivate the second, more practical
3863protocol. In both cases I will assume the existence of an untraceable
3864network, where senders and receivers are identified only by digital
3865pseudonyms (i.e. public keys) and every messages is signed by its sender
3866and encrypted to its receiver.
3867
3868[10:20] 
3869http://www.weidai.com/bmoney.txt
3870
3871andy [10:21 AM] 
3872I don't think he has to prove anything with regard to SN if he doesn't seek to convince anyone that he's SN.
3873
3874andrewquentson [10:21 AM] 
3875I've read that
3876
3877[10:21] 
3878the question was
3879
3880[10:21] 
3881how is b-money similiar and different from bitcoin?
3882
3883mrhodl [10:21 AM] 
3884But he did claim to be Satoshi?
3885
3886[10:21] 
3887on more than one occasion.
3888
3889csw [10:21 AM] 
3890I know and this is a forum that takes time to answer in
3891
3892
3893jp [10:22 AM] 
3894Hold my beer
3895
3896andy [10:22 AM] 
3897He was at one time forced into a position by former staff.  He initiated but then digressed from the assertion you're trying to get him to reassert.
3898
3899csw [10:22 AM] 
3900Shall I start on the first or the second protocols A...Q...?
3901
3902andrewquentson [10:22 AM] 
3903you can start on the high level differences
3904
3905[10:22] 
3906presumably you can abstract stuff in thought?
3907
3908[10:23] 
3909and distill it
3910
3911csw [10:23 AM] 
3912In b-money, each party has a database, but, unlike in Bitcoin this is not syncronised.
3913
3914andrewquentson [10:23 AM] 
3915then succinctly communicate it
3916
3917csw [10:23 AM] 
3918The issue was the Byzantine Generals problem.
3919
3920[10:24] 
3921Where this was solved is through the use of the gamblers fallacy. In this, we have the attacker under 51% (not 50) playing a game of roulette in effect.
3922
3923[10:24] 
3924As each roll is under the required return, they never expect to win in the long run.
3925
3926andrewquentson [10:25 AM] 
3927yes we know what the general's problem is
3928
3929csw [10:25 AM] 
3930B-money was similar to Adam's hashcash in use
3931
3932[10:26] 
3933It was not in effect capped. The solution was based on a known PoW that set the economic value to be the cost of "mining" the demonstrated calculation.
3934
3935alp 
3936[10:26 AM] 
3937:crocodile:
3938
3939[10:26] 
3940:knife: that's not a knife
3941
3942csw [10:26 AM] 
3943Basically, each entity seeks to mint coins
3944
3945beautybubble [10:26 AM] 
3946Was not that issue covered in a Ripple forum some years ago OR does it remain relevant?  Thank you.
3947
3948csw [10:27 AM] 
3949b-money and the broadcast system was an account based system
3950
3951alp 
3952[10:27 AM] 
3953csw: is mike hearn going to join you?
3954
3955csw [10:27 AM] 
3956I have not been up with Ripple of late sorry.
3957
3958[10:28] 
3959In b-Money (bm from now) the user agrees to send a transaction and complete the work before a time.
3960
3961[10:28] 
3962In this manner, bm is in effect a system that is online and requires the broadcast to be created in a set time window,
3963
3964andy [10:28 AM] 
3965@alp I don't imagine Hearn will return.  The community isn't going to suddenly become nontoxic, even if on-chain scaling happens.
3966
3967beautybubble [10:28 AM] 
3968Thank you for your answer.  Appreciate it.
3969
3970csw [10:29 AM] 
3971The options do allow for a payment in default against an account, but there is little in the form or nature of scripting nor of what could be a smart contract.
3972
3973andrewquentson [10:30 AM] 
3974alright let me narrow down
3975
3976alp 
3977[10:30 AM] 
3978i mean return to nchain not bitcoin
3979
3980andrewquentson [10:30 AM] 
3981wei says b-money has two layers
3982
3983csw [10:30 AM] 
3984SHA1 was proposed in bm. At the time this was still used widely, but faults had developed by 2007
3985
3986andrewquentson [10:30 AM] 
3987lets focus on the base layer
3988
3989[10:30] 
3990he says it's inefficient
3991
3992[10:30] 
3993that's why it needs a second layer
3994
3995danielnyairo [10:30 AM] 
3996joined #general
3997
3998andrewquentson [10:30 AM] 
3999what makes b-money inefficient but bitcoin efficient and therefore not needing a second layer?
4000
4001csw [10:31 AM] 
4002For a start, there are issues with the need for a secure network. Tor even was not really of sufficient quality (edited)
4003
4004ajd [10:31 AM] 
4005I want to know why 50.9% isn't enough.
4006
4007csw [10:32 AM] 
4008Bitcoin allows for offline signing. It also has a separation of the validation function
4009
4010[10:32] 
4011The use of UTXO to mint coin at each transaction(these being in effect destroyed and created a new) allows for the use as cash and not an account
4012
4013[10:33] 
4014Bitcoin is not and does not require the transaction to be encrypted.
4015
4016andrewquentson [10:33 AM] 
4017what do you mean?
4018
4019[10:33] 
4020encrypted how?
4021
4022csw [10:34 AM] 
4023BTC uses a hashing algorithm and DSS. It is not encrypted.
4024
4025beautybubble [10:35 AM] 
4026May I quote you on that?
4027
4028csw [10:35 AM] 
4029Bm requires that the channel is encrypted. Basically, more than a VPN as the need for an untraceable connection means that attacks can be formed by link analysis
4030
4031[10:35] 
4032BB?
4033
4034beautybubble [10:35 AM] 
4035Yes, on the "BTC uses a hashing algorithm and DSS. It is not encrypted."
4036
4037csw [10:35 AM] 
4038BTC uses a hashing algorithm and DSS. It is not encrypted.?
4039
4040[10:35] 
4041Yes, ECC is not used. EcDSA is.
4042
4043beautybubble [10:36 AM] 
4044Thank you.  Heading to twitter.
4045
4046csw [10:37 AM] 
4047Messages in Bitcoin are singed, but they are also open and can be analysed
4048
4049andrewquentson [10:37 AM] 
4050@csw I'm not sure what you might have discussed with wei, I'm going by the 4-5 para he wrote
4051
4052[10:38] 
4053he seems to be describing bitcoin in great parts, but he says the base layer is inefficient, why isn't bitcoin's? (edited)
4054
4055andy [10:38 AM] 
4056The plural of bitcoin is bitcoin.
4057
4058
4059klee [10:39 AM] 
4060bitscoin?
4061
4062
4063jp [10:40 AM] 
4064Bitcorns
4065
4066csw [10:40 AM] 
4067Bitcoin uses what is in effect a SEIR-c epidemic model. The messages are sent unencrypted but signed and the propagation (should) requires verification prior to forwarding
4068
4069andrewquentson [10:41 AM] 
4070but every node needs to store it
4071
4072[10:41] 
4073and they keep sending each other data, many of it useless, research has found for 8k real blocks some 200k are sent
4074
4075csw [10:41 AM] 
4076Yes. Each node. That can also be a risk decision
4077
4078megalodon 
4079[10:41 AM] 
4080@csw What's a Bitcoin? :innocent:
4081
4082csw [10:41 AM] 
4083And a point in time can mean that the verification for some nodes in limited.
4084
4085andy [10:42 AM] 
4086Do you currently mine csw?
4087
4088andrewquentson [10:42 AM] 
4089yes, alright
4090
4091xhiggy [10:42 AM] 
4092Can you explain how bitcoin maps to a SEIR-C epidemic model, and why not an SIR model?
4093
4094andrewquentson [10:42 AM] 
4095how did Adam Back come to your attention before you contacted him @csw?
4096
4097csw [10:42 AM] 
4098And there are methods that can make SEIR network graphs more efficent
4099
4100andrewquentson [10:43 AM] 
4101I don't think google can help you and of course the time it takes to answer is a factor @csw
4102
4103[10:44] 
4104its a very easy question
4105
4106[10:44] 
4107for satoshi
4108
4109[10:44] 
4110or adam back
4111
4112csw [10:44 AM] 
4113LOL
4114
4115[10:45] 
4116And as I said, I am not going to answer Satoshi questions.
4117
4118[10:45] 
4119But a good try.
4120
4121andrewquentson [10:45 AM] 
4122you should answer this one
4123
4124jp [10:45 AM] 
4125Csw is a con artist, move along.
4126
4127andrewquentson [10:45 AM] 
4128its public knoweldge
4129
4130[10:45] 
4131go on
4132
4133csw [10:45 AM] 
4134No, it is what Adam stated and what a few sites such as Gwern's state.
4135
4136jp [10:46 AM] 
4137Cright wraig is not Satoshi, con artist and asshole. Move long guys.
4138
4139andrewquentson [10:46 AM] 
4140stated what?
4141
4142csw [10:46 AM] 
4143Read Gwern's over long post and a few other blogs.
4144
4145[10:46] 
4146And it is not the real answer, but more I will not comment.
4147
4148andrewquentson [10:46 AM] 
4149what does gwern's blog say
4150
4151andy [10:47 AM] 
4152andrewquentson You're still seeking for him to prove something he's acknowledged he isn't seeking to prove.
4153
4154csw [10:47 AM] 
4155That is not too difficult to google AQ
4156
4157ajd [10:47 AM] 
4158Why is 51% the threshold and not 50%?
4159
4160
4161megalodon 
4162[10:48 AM] 
4163any estimate on when more details for the SDK nChain is working on will be available?
4164
4165andy [10:48 AM] 
416651% loses over a long enough time.
4167
4168[10:48] 
4169or wins rather
4170
4171[10:48] 
4172derp
4173
4174andrewquentson [10:48 AM] 
4175do you mean this @csw ? https://www.gwern.net/docs/2008-nakamoto
4176gwern.net
4177Dai/Nakamoto emails - Gwern.net
4178Emails between Wei Dai and Satoshi Nakamoto discussing Bitcoin
4179
4180ajd [10:48 AM] 
4181What about 50.9%?
4182
4183andrewquentson [10:48 AM] 
4184so you were googling then!
4185
4186[10:49] 
4187but that doesn't say how adam back came to your attention does it?
4188
4189klee [10:49 AM] 
4190I like Adam's hair
4191
4192
4193csw [10:49 AM] 
4194No A.Q. I was on a private chat with MrHodl
4195
4196klee [10:49 AM] 
4197much beauty
4198
4199csw [10:49 AM] 
420050.00000000001% even
4201
4202andrewquentson [10:50 AM] 
4203can you say how adam back came to your attention @csw?
4204
4205klee [10:50 AM] 
4206such brains
4207
4208beautybubble [10:50 AM] 
4209May I ask... the hostility in this channel is coming from a belief that the SLACK member csw is not Craig Steven Wright, Australian computer scientist and businessman?  So with a very simple question to the member, @csw Are you indeed the person named and described here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Craig_Steven_Wright -- Thank you for your kind answer. ~Beauty
4210Wikipedia
4211Craig Steven Wright
4212Craig Steven Wright (born October 1970) is an Australian computer scientist and businessman. He claims to be the real person behind the pseudonym Satoshi Nakamoto—the creator of bitcoin—a claim that is disputed within the bitcoin community.
4213
4214iang [10:50 AM] 
421551% is just a convenient way of saying a slight majority.  Like 50% plus a little bit.
4216
4217ajd [10:51 AM] 
4218Okay I thought maybe there was something more to https://btcchat.slack.com/archives/C555C1FME/p1493918661942624
4219csw
4220Where this was solved is through the use of the gamblers fallacy. In this, we have the attacker under 51% (not 50) playing a game of roulette in effect.
4221Posted in #generalToday at 10:24 AM
4222
4223iang [10:51 AM] 
4224The point isn’t so much xx%% but that the algorithm eventually decides one way or the other.
4225
4226alp 
4227[10:51 AM] 
4228@beautybubble : its that csw is a con artist
4229
4230beautybubble [10:51 AM] 
4231I am being patient with the answer.
4232
4233xhiggy [10:51 AM] 
4234Who is he conning?
4235
4236andrewquentson [10:51 AM] 
4237@csw can you say how adam back came to your attention?
4238
4239macsga [10:51 AM] 
4240@alp VINNY, BUY TEH DIPS
4241
4242csw [10:52 AM] 
4243I am the person named here: https://medium.com/@MADinMelbourne/welcome-to-the-ministry-of-truth-in-the-wiki-age-601ec28a2504
4244Medium
4245Welcome to the Ministry of Truth in the Wiki Age. – #thewildcard – Medium
4246“Is this really happening?” was tweeted to me yesterday as nChain announced it’s arrival into the Bitcoin scene, bringing with it the…
4247Reading time
4248----------------
42494 min read
4250
4251(461kB)
4252April 17th at 2:36 AM
4253iang [10:52 AM] 
4254Unfortunately, sadly, people are obsessed with numbers.  Numbers make something seem real.  So we have to put some numbers on the explanation … to make people believe.  See, I used numbers 3 times there, so I’m right.
4255
4256beautybubble [10:52 AM] 
4257Can you be so kind to answer my question too?  Thank you.
4258
4259andy [10:52 AM] 
42603 is a number too.  I believe you now.
4261
4262klee [10:52 AM] 
4263https://twitter.com/VinnyLingham/status/860184952003940352
4264Vinny Lingham @VinnyLingham
42651/ The current price momentum and new highs for Bitcoin has effectively neutered any chance of Segwit being activated on Bitcoin, IMHO.
4266TwitterToday at 10:30 AM
4267 
4268
4269[10:52] 
4270HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHA
4271
4272[10:52] 
4273I FART FROM LAUGHING
4274
4275[10:52] 
4276POOR MFer!!
4277!!!
4278
4279csw [10:52 AM] 
4280BB. The one on who?
4281
4282beautybubble [10:52 AM] 
4283The wiki page.
4284
4285macsga [10:52 AM] 
4286lol
4287
4288andy [10:53 AM] 
4289Segwit is DOA.  Would you agree csw?
4290
4291csw [10:53 AM] 
4292And I did answer.
4293
4294beautybubble [10:53 AM] 
4295Thank you.
4296
4297csw [10:53 AM] 
4298SegWit is a removal of many of the fundimental aspects of Bitcoin
4299
4300klee [10:54 AM] 
4301VinnyCoin
4302
4303
4304jp [10:54 AM] 
4305Corn will crash to 400.
4306
4307csw [10:54 AM] 
4308This simplistic idea that Transaction = H(TX) is a solution is a demonstration that only settlement matters to some.
4309
4310prometheus [10:54 AM] 
4311@csw are you concerned about any other alt-coins usurping BTC's position? The closest one I can currently see getting close is Ethereum (ETH), but I personally view it as being fundamentally flawed in that the chain is storing and processing all smart contract transactions (bad for storage and scaling) and there's a never ending inflation of the asset (bad for use as a hard currency).
4312
4313Litecoin (LTC) is similar to BTC, in that it's capped, and plans to implement SegWit soon. There's a lot of hype around LTC right now, but I'm unconvinced it's sustainable, unless businesses actually start utilizing SegWit and implementing Lightning (which centralizes the network, in my opinion).
4314
4315Your thoughts?
4316
4317csw [10:54 AM] 
4318I do not follow Alts.
4319
4320
4321andrewquentson [10:55 AM] 
4322@csw I won't ask again. Can you say how Adam Back came to your attention?
4323
4324andy [10:55 AM] 
4325I think people are going to persist in trying to disprove you're Satoshi, regardless of how clearly you state that you do not seek to prove this.
4326
4327csw [10:56 AM] 
4328A...Q... Then stop asking.
4329
4330
4331cypherblock [10:56 AM] 
4332can you say some more about how segwit removes some fundamental aspects?
4333
4334csw [10:56 AM] 
4335Segwit changes the validation layer
4336
4337andrewquentson [10:57 AM] 
4338Well, I did say it was the last time I'd ask, but why won't you say?
4339
4340ajd [10:57 AM] 
4341What do you think about P2SH, then?
4342
4343csw [10:57 AM] 
4344It changes the control from those who mine to a number of "soft" change options.
4345
4346andrewquentson [10:57 AM] 
4347It's public knowledge, although you clearly don't appear aware of it
4348
4349beautybubble [10:57 AM] 
4350May I post an invitation to this SLACK?  Having a chance to ask you serious questions and then learn about your newer ventures I believe would help everyone.  Thank you.
4351
4352alp 
4353[10:57 AM] 
4354andy: csw does quite a fine job disproving it every word he speaks.
4355
4356andrewquentson [10:57 AM] 
4357Satoshi, however, would certainly know
4358
4359csw [10:57 AM] 
4360P2SH was a basket case, but we have it now
4361
4362iang [10:57 AM] 
4363The Transaction = H(TX) thing was something I found pretty critical in my work, and would naturally follow it.  But bitcoin’s UTXO layout is completely different, and it’s non-obvious.  Also the entire published ledger takes away the need to have a hash proof of existence.  Still, it complicates things having multiple valid transactions.
4364
4365alp 
4366[10:57 AM] 
4367he clearly doesnt know the code.
4368
4369andrewquentson [10:57 AM] 
4370as does Adam Back of course
4371
4372iang [10:57 AM] 
4373But I’m guessing this is a whiteboard discussion :disappointed:
4374
4375cypherblock [10:58 AM] 
4376@andrewquentson why are you asking about adam ? He is not trying to prove he is Satoshi right now.
4377
4378ajd [10:58 AM] 
4379Okay you gave the right answer to that one. :slightly_smiling_face:
4380
4381mrhodl [10:58 AM] 
4382@cypherblock *right now* is keyword. He did in the past.
4383
4384andy [10:58 AM] 
4385alp seems to be an expert on who satoshi is based on their statements of the tech.  perhaps csw or someone else could ask alp a question to demonstrate his prowess with knowledge of the protocol?
4386
4387iang [10:58 AM] 
4388Everyone knows Adam Back.  I’ve known him for over 20 years.
4389
4390alp 
4391[10:58 AM] 
4392i do not claim to be satoshi andy
4393
4394[10:59] 
4395I didnt write the code.
4396
4397csw [10:59 AM] 
4398Who wrote the book referenced in the code on triple redundancy?
4399
4400cypherblock [10:59 AM] 
4401@mrhodl maybe maybe not.
4402
4403mrhodl [10:59 AM] 
4404what?
4405
4406[10:59] 
4407What do you mean maybe maybe not?
4408
4409iang [10:59 AM] 
4410Him I don’t know.  But my ex-SO does.  Goes to uni where he was.
4411
4412mrhodl [11:00 AM] 
4413Are you saying he never said he was the creator of bitcoin? @cypherblock
4414
4415iang [11:00 AM] 
4416He’s very old :slightly_smiling_face:
4417
4418klee [11:00 AM] 
4419Atherosclerosis
4420
4421klee [11:00 AM] 
4422uploaded this image: image.png
4423Add Comment
4424
4425
4426andrewquentson [11:02 AM] 
4427You guys here
4428
4429macsga [11:02 AM] 
4430uploaded this image: hear hear
4431Add Comment
4432
4433andrewquentson [11:02 AM] 
4434@cypherblock
4435
4436[11:02] 
4437@iang
4438
4439[11:02] 
4440@jp
4441
4442cypherblock [11:02 AM] 
4443@mrhodl I’m saying he may either have never wanted to prove he was satoshi or maybe changed his mind.
4444
4445andrewquentson [11:02 AM] 
4446@bitsko
4447
4448[11:02] 
4449and the rest
4450
4451[11:02] 
4452you know this guy
4453
4454[11:02] 
4455fucking discraced Gavin?
4456
4457cypherblock [11:02 AM] 
4458yes I know
4459
4460andrewquentson [11:02 AM] 
4461you know he overshadowed the May blockchain coference
4462
4463jp [11:02 AM] 
4464Vegas modafackor, M O O N F I L T H Y
4465
4466iang [11:03 AM] 
4467@andrewquentson can you please stop spamming the channel - you’re not making yourself welcome.
4468
4469andrewquentson [11:03 AM] 
4470when we were to talk about all srots of nice thing
4471
4472[11:03] 
4473It was to be the comming out party
4474
4475[11:03] 
4476you know he is the cause of the commit removal?
4477
4478cypherblock [11:03 AM] 
4479yes I know
4480
4481andrewquentson [11:03 AM] 
4482and now he blabs here
4483
4484jp [11:03 AM] 
4485uploaded this image: e7bb793450426bdf1cb4e79397aea11dea281c31505206ca1bd95fcd3a0404a7.jpg
4486Add Comment
4487
4488jp [11:03 AM] 
44891600 kleenay vincumming
4490
4491macsga [11:03 AM] 
4492@andrewquentson what's your problem exactly?
4493
4494andrewquentson [11:03 AM] 
4495and some big blockers are all yeh maybe
4496
4497[11:03] 
4498sure
4499
4500macsga [11:03 AM] 
4501are you him?
4502
4503andrewquentson [11:03 AM] 
4504maybe the sun falls
4505
4506macsga [11:04 AM] 
4507I don't see Gavin here
4508
4509cypherblock [11:04 AM] 
4510The gavin thing was unfortunate. @csw did you see that as necessary to disrupt authority myths?
4511
4512andrewquentson [11:04 AM] 
4513what authority myths
4514
4515mrhodl [11:04 AM] 
4516lol
4517
4518jp [11:04 AM] 
4519As I said. This slack should be private instead of inviting those like alp and andrew
4520
4521andrewquentson [11:04 AM] 
4522he is claiming the HIGHEST authority
4523
4524macsga [11:04 AM] 
4525alp is Vinny
4526
4527iang [11:04 AM] 
4528Gavin was just caught up in the entire circus.  He wasn’t “intended” he was just roadkill as the community responded.
4529
4530macsga [11:04 AM] 
4531let him here I like him
4532
4533[11:04] 
4534:stuck_out_tongue:
4535
4536jp [11:04 AM] 
4537Find the fucking sentence he said he wanted to be the highest
4538
4539cypherblock [11:04 AM] 
4540satoshi is authority myth.
4541
4542mrhodl [11:05 AM] 
4543I can't believe this but i'm with Andrew Quentson on this
4544
4545andrewquentson [11:05 AM] 
4546there is no myth @cypherblock
4547
4548mrhodl [11:05 AM] 
4549@andrewquentson Wanna try and be friends?
4550
4551jp [11:05 AM] 
4552Go back to your dragon den
4553
4554
4555andrewquentson [11:05 AM] 
4556satoshi is presumed to have brains
4557
4558[11:05] 
4559because of what he achieved
4560
4561mrhodl [11:05 AM] 
4562hahahah
4563
4564andrewquentson [11:05 AM] 
4565smarts
4566
4567alp 
4568[11:05 AM] 
4569lol jp
4570
4571andrewquentson [11:05 AM] 
4572you know
4573
4574alp 
4575[11:05 AM] 
4576jp who the fuck are you anyway
4577
4578andrewquentson [11:05 AM] 
4579intellect
4580
4581iang [11:05 AM] 
4582We understand that you’re trying to create some great copy - but the myth is dead.  SN is no more.  It’s over.
4583
4584
4585andrewquentson [11:05 AM] 
4586thats a useful thing
4587
4588awemany [11:05 AM] 
4589@newliberty , @csw: after some fresh air, i think the "aleph1" argument from above has a gaping hole: there needs to be a clear definition of what SHA256 (or any other hash function) *is* then
4590
4591jp [11:05 AM] 
4592I'm the one fuck your modafacker
4593
4594alp 
4595[11:05 AM] 
4596lol
4597
4598awemany [11:05 AM] 
4599It sounds cool, but I think it does not make sense
4600
4601cryptonaut [11:05 AM] 
4602@andrewquentson it's actually people like you that try to claim Satoshi is "the highest authority". Literally everything csw has said so far has been the opposite
4603
4604alp 
4605[11:06 AM] 
4606so whats the plan after no one buys this?
4607
4608jp [11:06 AM] 
4609I fucking fun in dat hole to create you piece of shit
4610
4611csw [11:06 AM] 
4612I am not claiming authority at all
4613
4614andrewquentson [11:06 AM] 
4615Satoshi is not an "authority"
4616
4617cryptonaut [11:06 AM] 
4618you are claiming he is
4619
4620macsga [11:06 AM] 
4621@alp boobs and BJ buddy
4622
4623andrewquentson [11:06 AM] 
4624thats like calling einstein an "authority"
4625
4626andy [11:06 AM] 
4627agreed
4628
4629mrhodl [11:06 AM] 
4630Yet, you want us to follow your lead? @csw
4631
4632csw [11:06 AM] 
4633No, I want people to think
4634
4635fatman3001 [11:06 AM] 
4636joined #general
4637
4638klee [11:06 AM] 
4639SHORT LTSHIT MFERS
4640
4641mrhodl [11:06 AM] 
4642I'm think you're full of shit.
4643
4644andy [11:06 AM] 
4645good luck with that one csw
4646
4647awemany [11:07 AM] 
4648csw, I see you are here again. Can you explain how you extend SHA256 to infinite data streams for your aleph1 argument?
4649
4650jp [11:07 AM] 
4651@mrhodl  fuck you modafackers. Get the fuck out of here
4652
4653mrhodl [11:07 AM] 
4654jp, eat a dick.. thank you.
4655
4656csw [11:07 AM] 
4657It saddens me, but you may be right Andy
4658
4659beautybubble [11:07 AM] 
4660I see that @charlieshrem is in the channel.  Maybe if he came forward in the conversation we can settle things once and for all.
4661
4662fatman3001 [11:07 AM] 
4663Hi all
4664
4665mrhodl [11:07 AM] 
4666English please
4667
4668charlieshrem [11:08 AM] 
4669Hmm?
4670
4671fatman3001 [11:08 AM] 
4672Hi csw
4673
4674mrhodl [11:08 AM] 
4675Hi Charlie
4676
4677beautybubble [11:08 AM] 
4678Oh, there you are!
4679
4680andy [11:08 AM] 
4681some us think.  the thoughtful ones are the silent types though.
4682
4683charlieshrem [11:08 AM] 
4684HI
4685
4686andy [11:08 AM] 
4687heya charlie
4688
4689beautybubble [11:08 AM] 
4690I think we need your sensible self injected here Charlie.
4691
4692charlieshrem [11:08 AM] 
4693Regarding?
4694
4695beautybubble [11:09 AM] 
4696I guess people are having an issue believing the @csw is indeed himself.
4697
4698jp [11:09 AM] 
4699Why would we need this guy? Core shiller
4700
4701charlieshrem [11:09 AM] 
4702OK
4703
4704[11:09] 
4705I asked him the same question
4706
4707alp 
4708[11:09 AM] 
4709jp seems to be on some kind of drugs
4710
4711[11:09] 
4712its funny when aquent is the voice of reason in a room
4713
4714
4715iang [11:09 AM] 
4716icecream :disappointed:
4717
4718andrewquentson [11:10 AM] 
4719always voice of reason
4720
4721beautybubble [11:10 AM] 
4722And are you satisfied that it is indeed Craig?
4723
4724charlieshrem [11:10 AM] 
4725I can confirm @csw emailed me to verify from 2 emails, @ncrypt.com and @rcjbr.org
4726
4727jp [11:10 AM] 
4728First of all, this is not an investigation nor an interrogation.
4729
4730beautybubble [11:10 AM] 
4731Thank you so much.
4732
4733alp 
4734[11:10 AM] 
4735its whatever we want it to be jp
4736
4737cypherblock [11:11 AM] 
4738@csw that medium post you linked to before doesn’t have any papers you wrote linked. Do you have some papers you’ve written as csw that you could post links to?
4739
4740awemany [11:11 AM] 
4741lets get to some issues: how does the aleph1 SHA256 work? I really like to have input on that, because although it sounds all nice, this one actually is a gaping hole in the above arguments, as far as I can see.
4742
4743csw [11:11 AM] 
4744Not at hand.
4745
4746beautybubble [11:11 AM] 
4747And it is good to have you around.  My prayers for your safe return back home were heard.
4748
4749andy [11:12 AM] 
4750Wow.  B is going parabolic isn't it?
4751
4752jp [11:12 AM] 
47531625
4754
4755cypherblock [11:13 AM] 
4756are there any papers of yours online at all? I really haven’t seen anything academic written by you. Maybe someone else here has links?
4757
4758iang [11:13 AM] 
4759I actually don’t follow that either.  Although SHA256 has infinite input, it is only used with a fixed length.  So in effect we have SHA256bis which has a finite input.  But I’m not a real cryptographer, I just play one on slack.
4760
4761csw [11:13 AM] 
4762AweM... As there is not a means to have a infinite input stream into SHA 256, it remains a discussion that is academic and not one that lends itself to slack
4763
4764awemany [11:14 AM] 
4765we've been discussing that in terms of collisions, and after rethinking it, it doesn't appear to make sense. so I am really curious if you could provide a solid argument on this (edited)
4766
4767iang [11:14 AM] 
4768I miss whiteboards :disappointed:
4769
4770macsga [11:18 AM] 
4771I don't :slightly_smiling_face:
4772
4773fatman3001 [11:19 AM] 
4774apologies to @csw , but I do think it's significant that SN is back (among the living? I assumed he was dead). If I've understood you're trying to create an entity or venue to compete with the ideas promoted by core. BU is such a thing, but a new branch with some well known names and gravitas is significant.
4775
4776macsga [11:19 AM] 
4777Yes, projected value is 11500 USD
4778andy
4779Wow.  B is going parabolic isn't it?
4780Posted in #generalToday at 11:12 AM
4781
4782fatman3001 [11:19 AM] 
4783can someone point me to the short and dirty of what the gameplan is?
4784
4785csw [11:20 AM] 
4786Open competition
4787
4788
4789agreenberg [11:20 AM] 
4790joined #general. Also, @david joined.
4791
4792andrewquentson [11:20 AM] 
4793right
4794
4795csw [11:20 AM] 
4796Capitalism in its purest form and in true libertarian format
4797
4798andrewquentson [11:20 AM] 
4799I guess you're sort of not asking for attention now either.....
4800
4801tomothy 
4802[11:20 AM] 
4803And would segwit impact open competition?
4804
4805andrewquentson [11:20 AM] 
4806welcome @agreenberg
4807
4808wings [11:21 AM] 
4809@csw  but there will be hardfork with Core-btc or not ? (edited)
4810
4811alp 
4812[11:21 AM] 
4813patents and closed source -> open competition lulz
4814 2 replies Last reply today at 11:26 AM View thread
4815
4816andrewquentson [11:21 AM] 
4817I was putting @csw through a test @agreenberg
4818
4819[11:21] 
4820I asked him something which is public knowledge
4821
4822[11:21] 
4823but assumed he wouldn't know
4824
4825[11:21] 
4826the question is simple
4827
4828csw [11:21 AM] 
4829SegWit adds incentives for off chain systems at the expense of the main system.,
4830
4831andrewquentson [11:21 AM] 
4832How did Adam Back come to his attention, and by his I mean Satoshi's of course
4833
4834[11:22] 
4835he hasn't replied
4836
4837[11:22] 
4838with an answer
4839
4840csw [11:22 AM] 
4841And A...Q... desires that I answer things in a manner I do not wish to.
4842
4843andrewquentson [11:22 AM] 
4844no no
4845
4846[11:22] 
4847its public knowledge
4848
4849iang [11:22 AM] 
4850@fatman3001 SN isn’t back.  SN is dead.  What’s happening is that some of the old team are now doing something … more in the public eye.  And no longer caring.
4851 
4852
4853andrewquentson [11:22 AM] 
4854you dont know the answer
4855
4856[11:22] 
4857if you do state it
4858
4859[11:22] 
4860well
4861
4862[11:22] 
4863if you were satoshi
4864
4865tomothy 
4866[11:22 AM] 
4867I think that was covered this morning. Did you read the paste bin?
4868
4869travin [11:22 AM] 
4870Andrew can't read.
4871
4872checksum0 [11:22 AM] 
4873I guess not, reading is hard
4874
4875tomothy 
4876[11:22 AM] 
4877Oh.
4878
4879[11:23] 
4880Talk about a rock and a hard spot then.
4881
4882macsga [11:23 AM] 
4883@andrewquentson he did gave an answer
4884
4885tomothy 
4886[11:23 AM] 
4887You might not like it.
4888
4889fatman3001 [11:23 AM] 
4890_csw [8:20 PM] 
4891Open competition_
4892
4893F*cking brilliant
4894pardon my french
4895
4896snoop [11:23 AM] 
4897Andrew Q does not read
4898
4899andrewquentson [11:23 AM] 
4900he hasn't given the answer
4901
4902[11:23] 
4903if he did, what is it?
4904
4905csw [11:23 AM] 
4906Yes, there seems to be this idea that we can force others to our will in here.
4907
4908macsga [11:23 AM] 
4909@fatman3001 :heart:
4910
4911tomothy 
4912[11:23 AM] 
4913Hasn't given you the answer you want. Awwwwwwww
4914
4915
4916csw [11:24 AM] 
4917That you have a right to an answer of a question that yu decide you want to ask
4918
4919andrewquentson [11:24 AM] 
4920no, he hasn't give the answer
4921
4922[11:24] 
4923the question has one answer
4924
4925tomothy 
4926[11:24 AM] 
4927Well, that's an answer in and of itself.
4928
4929macsga [11:24 AM] 
4930@andrewquentson yes, the one YOU want
4931
4932[11:24] 
4933google it man
4934
4935[11:24] 
4936paste it here
4937
4938jp [11:24 AM] 
4939He is just a retard one.
4940
4941csw [11:24 AM] 
4942Is that it A...Q...? Do you think that you decide who and how ?
4943That you get to force a response?
4944
4945andrewquentson [11:24 AM] 
4946pardon?
4947
4948snoop [11:25 AM] 
4949AQ is an "Authority"
4950
4951
4952tomothy 
4953[11:25 AM] 
4954Do you not read English?
4955
4956klee [11:25 AM] 
4957Andrew try picking up a girl in a bar
4958
4959[11:25] 
4960and leave us alone
4961 
4962
4963jp [11:25 AM] 
4964Retard can't read
4965
4966andrewquentson [11:25 AM] 
4967I simply asked a question
4968
4969[11:25] 
4970you chose to not answer it
4971
4972snoop [11:25 AM] 
4973AQ has hurt feelings.
4974
4975macsga [11:25 AM] 
4976Ok, on with the tech questions; some pretty significant stuff has been said in here today
4977
4978csw [11:25 AM] 
4979In the last year, I have learnt to deal with media better A...Q...
4980
4981You asked, but you offer nothing of value
4982
4983
4984andrewquentson [11:26 AM] 
4985thats like asking a 5 year old whats 1+1
4986
4987alp 
4988[11:26 AM] 
4989they are ganging up on you aquent, seems like you are on the right track.
4990
4991jp [11:26 AM] 
4992Mommy he doesn't answer me. Mommy!!!
4993
4994andrewquentson [11:26 AM] 
4995and they dont provide an answer
4996
4997csw [11:26 AM] 
4998Do you understand value AQ
4999
5000checksum0 [11:26 AM] 
5001OH snap
5002
5003beautybubble [11:26 AM] 
5004I do believe if we all knew a little bit about intention on social networks we would see that @csw is coming to this SLACK with good intention and has a purpose.
5005
5006andrewquentson [11:26 AM] 
5007can I assume they don't know it?
5008
5009[11:26] 
5010maybeeeeeeeeeee you do
5011
5012alp 
5013[11:26 AM] 
5014lol
5015
5016csw [11:26 AM] 
5017Free exchange?
5018
5019snoop [11:26 AM] 
5020Alp = ass
5021
5022andrewquentson [11:26 AM] 
5023but what is my little brain to rationally conclude
5024
5025alp 
5026[11:26 AM] 
5027scammer coming with good purpsose and intent? lol
5028
5029tomothy 
5030[11:26 AM] 
5031Alp just feels left out
5032
5033alp 
5034[11:26 AM] 
5035lol
5036
5037macsga [11:26 AM] 
5038VINNY!
5039
5040klee [11:26 AM] 
5041alp-aca
5042
5043cobra-bitcoin [11:26 AM] 
5044joined #general
5045
5046macsga [11:26 AM] 
5047did you buy the dips in XRP?
5048
5049tomothy 
5050[11:26 AM] 
5051We can throw the ball back and forth. I'll be your daddy, we can play catch.
5052
5053checksum0 [11:26 AM] 
5054Oh my god...
5055
5056snoop [11:27 AM] 
5057Alp=AQ ?
5058
5059checksum0 [11:27 AM] 
5060The trolls are pouring in
5061
5062andrewquentson [11:27 AM] 
5063cute, hi @cobra-bitcoin
5064
5065mrhodl [11:27 AM] 
5066lol
5067
5068tomothy 
5069[11:27 AM] 
5070No, alp = alfonse.
5071
5072andrewquentson [11:27 AM] 
5073how did you become maintainer of bitcoin.org?
5074
5075snoop [11:27 AM] 
5076Null=Alp=AQ
5077
5078cypherblock [11:27 AM] 
5079can someone just post the answer to @andrewquentson question here so we can move on. Not you csw, I mean someone else. (edited)
5080
5081alp 
5082[11:27 AM] 
5083left out of what, an orgy with michele seven?
5084
5085macsga [11:27 AM] 
5086in reality he's NotLambChop
5087
5088csw [11:27 AM] 
5089A...Q..  == Andrew Quentson
5090
5091cobra-bitcoin [11:27 AM] 
5092Hey, more active than I expected in here
5093
5094alp 
5095[11:27 AM] 
5096@cobra-bitcoin welcome its a good time
5097
5098mrhodl [11:27 AM] 
5099Craig in the house.
5100
5101tomothy 
5102[11:27 AM] 
5103Omg is he nlc?
5104
5105alp 
5106[11:27 AM] 
5107craigs groupies are here white knighting and aquent is ripping him a new one
5108
5109checksum0 [11:28 AM] 
5110All we are missing is Greg now I guess...
5111
5112freetrader [11:28 AM] 
5113>A...Q..  == Andrew Quentson
5114fark me, I though it stood for "Answer ... Question"
5115
5116jp [11:28 AM] 
5117Racist ... I'm a black knight lol
5118
5119macsga [11:28 AM] 
5120@alp ma man where have you been all this time
5121
5122csw [11:28 AM] 
5123And now A...Q... wants answers about a site run in 2008 from a VPN line to a Malaysian system owned and operated bu the same people who run Vistomail.
5124
5125travin [11:28 AM] 
5126Call him Aquent
5127
5128andrewquentson [11:28 AM] 
5129THE ANSWER IS KNOWN
5130
5131beautybubble [11:28 AM] 
5132Well, let's deal with it now.
5133
5134mrhodl [11:28 AM] 
5135lol
5136
5137andrewquentson [11:28 AM] 
5138satoshi would defo know it
5139
5140[11:28] 
5141adam back knows it
5142
5143tomothy 
5144[11:29 AM] 
5145Don't answer! Lol!
5146
5147andrewquentson [11:29 AM] 
5148its not even fully private
5149
5150fatman3001 [11:29 AM] 
5151_csw [8:21 PM] 
5152SegWit adds incentives for off chain systems at the expense of the main system.,_
5153
5154This one has been bugging me. I've tried to prod core guys about whether they've looked at the consequences of this and thus far I haven't gotten a good reply. I understand they can code and all, but incentive structures need to be researched by people with an insight into systems and economics. The closest I got to an answer was : "Yes, the incentive structure will change."
5155
5156Other than that I'm sure Segwit is a marble of engineering.
5157
5158andrewquentson [11:29 AM] 
5159its public
5160
5161klee [11:29 AM] 
5162let us all post random shit, it will be more readable
5163
5164mrhodl [11:29 AM] 
5165This is what you're going with Craig?
5166
5167macsga [11:29 AM] 
5168Adam Back is SN
5169
5170[11:29] 
5171invite him here
5172
5173beautybubble [11:29 AM] 
5174You can use search in SLACK and just see one poster.
5175
5176andy [11:29 AM] 
5177AQ he's not seeking to prove he's SN.  How many times does that need stated to you?
5178
5179andrewquentson [11:29 AM] 
5180course he seeking to prove he satoshi
5181
5182[11:29] 
5183he felew gavin there
5184
5185[11:29] 
5186gave him some...
5187
5188csw [11:29 AM] 
5189Fatman3001
5190
5191tomothy 
5192[11:29 AM] 
5193No, read the sarte article
5194
5195andrewquentson [11:29 AM] 
5196and now...
5197
5198macsga [11:29 AM] 
5199@andrewquentson because your word counts ?
5200
5201tomothy 
5202[11:29 AM] 
5203Read his prior responses
5204
5205csw [11:30 AM] 
5206The incentives move from mining to "softer" options allowing for easier chages
5207
5208andrewquentson [11:30 AM] 
5209anyway @agreenberg just thought to let you know, tred as you please
5210
5211cryptonaut [11:30 AM] 
5212@andrewquentson if it's publicly known then how would him repeating it prove anything?
5213
5214[11:30] 
5215seems silly
5216
5217cobra-bitcoin [11:30 AM] 
5218Is this actually Craig lmao?
5219
5220andrewquentson [11:30 AM] 
5221because he cant
5222
5223macsga [11:30 AM] 
5224no, it's not! It's what @andrewquentson wants
5225
5226csw [11:30 AM] 
5227As the answer is not the public one.
5228
5229andrewquentson [11:30 AM] 
5230I mean he has had hours of googling opportunity
5231
5232[11:30] 
5233and still cant......
5234
5235jp [11:30 AM] 
5236Yea. Adam back is SN. Craig is con man. Leave him alone
5237
5238andrewquentson [11:30 AM] 
5239if he could he would have jumped
5240
5241csw [11:30 AM] 
5242Segwit also makes the introduction of protocol change far easier than it should be. This is not simple a slippery slope argument, it means that developers and others who are not invested in the system (and I mean economically invested) can make changes that impact the wider system.
5243
5244andrewquentson [11:30 AM] 
5245like he did saying gewrn's blog is wrong
5246
5247csw [11:31 AM] 
5248Moving TxID = H(Tx, Sig) into TxID = H(Tx) plus Sig makes block validation less likely and extends verification
5249
5250andrewquentson [11:31 AM] 
5251the blog does not even mention it!
5252
5253[11:31] 
5254it says how wei came to satoshis attention
5255
5256[11:31] 
5257but not how adam back.............
5258
5259[11:31] 
5260tsssssssssssssss
5261
5262[11:31] 
5263FAIL
5264
5265iang [11:31 AM] 
5266yeah I get it.  It’s a worry - the Bitcoin governance layer isn’t really set up.  But what would I know.
5267
5268csw [11:31 AM] 
5269LOL A...Q...
5270
5271tomothy 
5272[11:31 AM] 
5273Oh, thoughts on parallel validation?
5274
5275andrewquentson [11:31 AM] 
5276its not a laughing matter sir
5277
5278[11:31] 
5279its a very serious matter
5280
5281tomothy 
5282[11:32 AM] 
5283No. No it isn't
5284
5285travin [11:32 AM] 
5286No, Aquent, can't be serious.
5287
5288macsga [11:32 AM] 
5289@andrewquentson WTaF? stop it man
5290
5291andrewquentson [11:32 AM] 
5292it so is he fucking ruined Gavin and the big blocker movement in 2016
5293
5294csw [11:32 AM] 
5295The code notes (at least in the early days it did) the need to change the threading and have parallelism...
5296
5297andrewquentson [11:32 AM] 
5298with his stunt
5299
5300andy [11:32 AM] 
5301Just say you're not Satoshi so they can stop blowing that trumpet.
5302
5303klee [11:32 AM] 
5304andrew has some anal itching it seems
5305
5306tomothy 
5307[11:32 AM] 
5308Sounds like you feel hurt?
5309
5310[11:33] 
5311Betrayed?
5312
5313jp [11:33 AM] 
5314Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
5315
5316prometheus [11:33 AM] 
5317fascinating to hear that the BTC model follows an epidemic model, like a "virus". I love how much of BTC mimics biology. I definitely noticed the fractal patterns in the BTC price. :slightly_smiling_face:
5318
5319macsga [11:33 AM] 
5320Ch00 Ch00
5321
5322mrhodl [11:33 AM] 
5323If he's not claiming to be satoshi why do we care about anything he says?
5324
5325jp [11:33 AM] 
5326Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
5327
5328[11:33] 
5329Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
5330
5331macsga [11:33 AM] 
5332Who are you again? :stuck_out_tongue:
5333prometheus
5334fascinating to hear that the BTC model follows an epidemic model, like a "virus". I love how much of BTC mimics biology. I definitely noticed the fractal patterns in the BTC price. :slightly_smiling_face:
5335Posted in #generalToday at 11:33 AM
5336 3 replies Last reply today at 11:37 AM View thread
5337
5338jp [11:33 AM] 
5339Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
5340
5341[11:33] 
5342Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
5343
5344cryptonaut [11:33 AM] 
5345lol the craig thing last year was just a footnote in the block size debate, I seriously doubt it changed anything besides entrenching beliefs.
5346
5347jp [11:33 AM] 
5348Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
5349
5350[11:34] 
5351Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
5352
5353mrhodl [11:34 AM] 
5354If he's not claiming to be satoshi why do we care about anything he says?
5355
5356cobra-bitcoin [11:34 AM] 
5357Satoshi is here guys, have some respect lol
5358
5359
5360cryptonaut [11:34 AM] 
5361@mrhodl ask yourself that
5362
5363awemany [11:34 AM] 
5364csw: "The code notes (at least in the early days it did) the need to change the threading and have parallelism..." <- for further understanding, can you point out, where?
5365
5366jp [11:34 AM] 
5367Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
5368
5369Pinned by jp 
5370Today at 11:36 AM Pinned by jp
5371csw [11:34 AM] 
5372Oh, Adam wrote hashcash and it is not used in Bitcoin. Sorry to say that and burst your bubble.
5373  
5374
5375tomothy 
5376[11:34 AM] 
5377LOLLLLL
5378
5379jp [11:34 AM] 
5380Die shitcoin die
5381
5382macsga [11:34 AM] 
5383DIEh
5384
5385jp [11:35 AM] 
5386Vinaayyahhha leecuminggg 800 corn
5387
5388macsga [11:35 AM] 
5389where's Vinny
5390
5391andrewquentson [11:35 AM] 
5392what bubble
5393
5394klee [11:35 AM] 
5395I am here
5396
5397alp 
5398[11:35 AM] 
5399but bitcoin is hashcash with inflation control
5400
5401[11:35] 
5402he was cited by satoshi
5403
5404macsga [11:35 AM] 
5405but but NewLambChop
5406
5407jp [11:35 AM] 
5408I want 800. Where is kleecummingvinanrry?
5409
5410klee [11:35 AM] 
5411shroomskit
5412
5413megalodon 
5414[11:35 AM] 
5415Vinny promised 850 and traded alts while I waited in fiat for his prediction to come true
54161 reply Today at 11:37 AM View thread
5417
5418csw [11:35 AM] 
5419Cited. Adam was mentioned as Adam pointed out who to contact Wei
5420 
5421
5422jp [11:35 AM] 
5423Lambo choo choo
5424
5425macsga [11:35 AM] 
5426hahahaha
5427
5428andrewquentson [11:36 AM] 
5429yes csw that's what gwern's blog says
5430
5431jp [11:36 AM] 
5432Short btc now 1600, close at 800. 100x. 20000% profit guysss
5433
5434andrewquentson [11:36 AM] 
5435but how did nakamoto get to contact adam back?
5436
5437csw [11:36 AM] 
5438You do understand that a reference is not a pointer to stat that one is an authority?
5439
5440
5441klee [11:36 AM] 
5442STOP IT!
5443I WANNA SHORT LTC
5444
5445[11:36] 
5446thx
5447
5448andrewquentson [11:36 AM] 
5449should I tell him guys?
5450
5451[11:36] 
5452I'm just worried he'll use it next time
5453
5454csw [11:37 AM] 
5455LOL
5456
5457andrewquentson [11:37 AM] 
5458ITS NOT FUNNY
5459
5460megalodon 
5461[11:37 AM] 
5462we're all dying to know...
5463
5464andy [11:37 AM] 
5465LOL
5466
5467jp [11:37 AM] 
5468R3kt
5469
5470megalodon 
5471[11:37 AM] 
5472:face_with_rolling_eyes:
5473
5474andrewquentson [11:37 AM] 
5475I mean it might be funny for us, others
5476
5477tomothy 
5478[11:37 AM] 
5479LMFAO@
5480
5481checksum0 [11:37 AM] 
5482IT IS FUNNY AS HELL
5483
5484andrewquentson [11:37 AM] 
5485but
5486
5487jp [11:37 AM] 
5488Short btc now and close at 400.
5489
5490[11:37] 
5491Triple vinanny
5492
5493tomothy 
5494[11:37 AM] 
5495LOLLLLL
5496
5497andrewquentson [11:37 AM] 
5498ITS NOT FUNNY
5499
5500andy [11:37 AM] 
5501HAHA
5502
5503checksum0 [11:37 AM] 
5504IT IS
5505
5506jp [11:37 AM] 
5507100x guys
5508
5509[11:37] 
5510Or 500x Yolo
5511
5512csw [11:37 AM] 
5513NO A...Q.. you are in fact a little funny.
5514
5515tomothy 
5516[11:37 AM] 
5517Please, say it a few more times
5518
5519macsga [11:37 AM] 
5520SHOTR TEH COIZN
5521
5522csw [11:38 AM] 
5523I have not engaged in this before, and I see why so little work is done. (edited)
5524
5525klee [11:38 AM] 
5526SHOTR ALL THE COINZ
5527
5528iang [11:38 AM] 
5529I think it’s a little sad… seeing so much opportunity go to such a waste.
5530
5531
5532andrewquentson [11:38 AM] 
5533really
5534
5535mrhodl [11:38 AM] 
5536Wait, who here believes CSW is Satoshi, raise your :raised_hands:
5537
55382 replies Last reply today at 11:39 AM View thread
5539
5540jp [11:38 AM] 
5541SHOTR Satoshi loll at csw price, close at Adam back profit
5542
5543klee [11:38 AM] 
5544me
5545
5546macsga [11:38 AM] 
5547:raised_hands:
5548
5549megalodon 
5550[11:38 AM] 
5551:raised_hand:
5552
5553iang [11:38 AM] 
5554What is belief?
5555
5556cypherblock [11:38 AM] 
5557@andrewquentson doesn’t scronty claim to have brought hashcash into the equation so to speak
5558
5559csw [11:38 AM] 
5560Please don't
5561
5562tomothy 
5563[11:39 AM] 
5564Part of a team of four, yes.
5565
5566nitram [11:39 AM] 
5567joined #general
5568
5569jp [11:39 AM] 
5570Die shitcoin die
5571
5572andrewquentson [11:39 AM] 
5573don't matter @cypherblock
5574
5575klee [11:39 AM] 
5576Make a future contract at BMEX: Is CSW Satoshi?
5577
5578pesa [11:39 AM] 
5579:raised_hands:
5580
5581
5582andrewquentson [11:39 AM] 
5583this guy was given a social test
5584
5585macsga [11:39 AM] 
55861700 in finex
5587
5588csw [11:39 AM] 
5589No, scronty and I did not work together.
5590
5591andrewquentson [11:39 AM] 
5592from public knowledge
5593
5594[11:39] 
5595its an F
5596
5597tomothy 
5598[11:39 AM] 
5599Totally an f
5600
5601jp [11:39 AM] 
5602Tomorrow: hashcash ICO raise 30M USD issued token on ethtard
5603
5604fatman3001 [11:39 AM] 
5605@csw ok, so the integrity of the network is attacked both by steering incentives off course and by softening the ultimate safeguards of the network. I thought this was accounted for somehow. Ugh...
5606
5607andrewquentson [11:39 AM] 
5608the answer doesnt have anything else but x
5609
5610mrhodl [11:39 AM] 
5611:joy::joy:
5612
5613klee [11:40 AM] 
5614POLO REKT
5615
5616andrewquentson [11:40 AM] 
5617I mean I can reveal it but I think he'd prob just use it next time
5618
5619klee [11:40 AM] 
5620IT IS HAPPENING
5621
5622macsga [11:40 AM] 
5623invite Scronty here
5624
5625tomothy 
5626[11:40 AM] 
5627Fatman, it is, that's why it wasn't adopted
5628
5629snoop [11:40 AM] 
5630"STOP LAUGHING AT ME!!!!" - AQ
5631
5632macsga [11:40 AM] 
5633I like his l33t haxx0r site
5634
5635[11:40] 
5636AQ is Scronty?
5637
5638[11:40] 
5639:smile:
5640
5641csw [11:40 AM] 
5642Fatman3001, the weight is set centrally in effect, this removal of market based controls means that a central authority gets to control the payments.
5643
5644
5645cryptonaut [11:40 AM] 
5646@andrewquentson just spit it out already
5647
5648andrewquentson [11:40 AM] 
5649it takes balls tho csw
5650
5651[11:40] 
5652big ones
5653
5654[11:41] 
5655to come in here, with your background
5656
5657csw [11:41 AM] 
5658If you think this through, and note that payment is attributed by a central body, can I ask you to follow the money?
5659
5660
5661andrewquentson [11:41 AM] 
5662and claim you are satoshi nakamoto
5663
5664
5665jp [11:41 AM] 
5666Kleecumming vinaaaayyy longcorn at 850
5667
5668cobra-bitcoin [11:41 AM] 
5669No doubt he has balls that's for sure
5670
5671andrewquentson [11:41 AM] 
5672how did you decide to do just that?
5673
5674csw [11:41 AM] 
5675And what background is that A...Q..
5676
5677beautybubble [11:41 AM] 
5678Well I am ready to read any collaterals on the project.  If you wanted to post them @csw - Thank you.
5679
5680mrhodl [11:41 AM] 
5681Easy to have balls when you have the State backing you up
5682
5683andrewquentson [11:41 AM] 
5684well
5685
5686nitram [11:41 AM] 
5687let's solve this once and for all...
5688
5689jp [11:41 AM] 
5690@cobra-bitcoin  which alts to buy tmrw?
5691
5692andrewquentson [11:41 AM] 
5693there is no evidence of a supercomputer
5694
5695
5696klee [11:41 AM] 
5697@beautybubble your twitter id?
5698
5699cobra-bitcoin [11:41 AM] 
5700Satoshi is it OK if the white paper gets updated?
5701 
5702
5703andrewquentson [11:41 AM] 
5704the ATA sort of wants to talk to you
5705
5706beautybubble [11:41 AM] 
5707Same as this handle.
5708
5709awemany [11:41 AM] 
5710lol
5711
5712andrewquentson [11:42 AM] 
5713you mispell in public forums
5714
5715
5716csw [11:42 AM] 
5717White papers are not updated.
5718
5719
5720nitram [11:42 AM] 
5721@csw do you like rick and morty? that will reveal your true character
5722
5723andrewquentson [11:42 AM] 
5724you have a linked in that lists many degrees which dont exist
5725
5726beautybubble [11:42 AM] 
5727https://twitter.com/BeautyBubble
5728twitter.com
5729Just Find Me...Okay (@BeautyBubble) | Twitter
5730The latest Tweets from Just Find Me...Okay (@BeautyBubble). Donations | Tips | Thank Me w. BTC 1N4XyVTpR84neGC9RmQzjz1fn3mmZSwYcZ. Private
5731 
5732
5733csw [11:42 AM] 
5734Not in the form it is.
5735
5736mrhodl [11:42 AM] 
5737@cobra-bitcoin Yes, it's def time.
5738
5739andrewquentson [11:42 AM] 
5740you dont know how you became aware of Adam back
5741
5742mrhodl [11:42 AM] 
5743What are you waiting for
5744
5745andrewquentson [11:42 AM] 
5746you gave us all a fake signature
5747
5748beautybubble [11:42 AM] 
5749Okay.
5750
5751jp [11:42 AM] 
5752Corn at 850
5753
5754andrewquentson [11:42 AM] 
5755and dunno
5756
5757cobra-bitcoin [11:43 AM] 
5758But it's your paper, it's OK with you if the incorrect stuff gets changed?
5759
5760iang [11:43 AM] 
5761I don’t think of it is a whitepaper, it’s a paper to me.
5762
5763beautybubble [11:43 AM] 
5764FYI.  Twitter always includes your latest pinned tweet to your handle URL.
5765
5766[11:43] 
5767No solicitation meant whatsoever in me posting my handle.
5768
5769klee [11:43 AM] 
5770blackpaper
5771
5772csw [11:43 AM] 
5773I asked you to read a letter from Satre. I see that was more than one could expect
5774
5775klee [11:43 AM] 
5776black pepper
5777
5778[11:43] 
5779PEPPER YOUR ANGUS
5780
5781jp [11:43 AM] 
5782Short the fuck out of polo lolll
5783
5784[11:43] 
57851702
5786
5787tomothy 
5788[11:43 AM] 
5789Aquent see the documents Vlad posted the other day
5790
5791iang [11:44 AM] 
5792see - I told you you needed 2 phones
5793
5794
5795csw [11:44 AM] 
5796And what incorrect stuff?
5797
5798cypherblock [11:44 AM] 
5799@csw I remember you talking a while back about releasing some write up on bitcoin simulations you were running. Did you ever do that?
5800
5801klee [11:44 AM] 
5802signal to noise ratio = ???
5803
5804csw [11:45 AM] 
5805CobraBTC... What is incorrect in the paper?
5806
5807jp [11:45 AM] 
5808Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
5809
5810
5811csw [11:45 AM] 
5812Cypher Block
5813
5814cobra-bitcoin [11:45 AM] 
5815Confirmed definitely not Satoshi, Satoshi never called me "CobraBTC", ew
5816
5817csw [11:45 AM] 
5818These were delayed. Moving to the UK and children...
5819
5820[11:45] 
5821LOL
5822
5823jp [11:45 AM] 
5824Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
5825
5826macsga [11:46 AM] 
5827this troll house is worse than @klee 's
5828
5829jp [11:46 AM] 
5830Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
5831
5832tomothy 
5833[11:46 AM] 
5834Cypherblock can you link text?
5835
5836jp [11:46 AM] 
5837Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
5838
5839fatman3001 [11:46 AM] 
5840@csw @andrewquentson one day we can arrange to have Craig on an episode of "Who do you think you are?" and all this can be settled.
5841
5842klee [11:46 AM] 
5843ltc on gox
5844
5845awemany [11:46 AM] 
5846jp, what's the reason to spam this?
5847
5848cypherblock [11:46 AM] 
5849no, just remember.
5850
5851iang [11:46 AM] 
5852@newliberty can you kick @jp’s phone, it’s broken
5853
5854macsga [11:46 AM] 
5855@tomothy what is text
5856
5857jp [11:46 AM] 
5858Move along guys. Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
5859
5860alp 
5861[11:46 AM] 
5862lol
5863
5864[11:46] 
5865Move along guys.  Btc just hits 9000 and quickly rising
5866
5867tomothy 
5868[11:46 AM] 
5869Whatever he's asked csw and csw has responded to, answer but no ?
5870
5871awemany [11:46 AM] 
5872@bitsko , please kck jp, there seems to be a problem indeed
5873
5874mrhodl [11:47 AM] 
5875Wait, @csw you have spoken to @cobra-bitcoin , right?
5876
5877alp 
5878[11:47 AM] 
5879you cant kick from the main channel
5880
5881macsga [11:47 AM] 
5882:boot:
5883
5884tomothy 
5885[11:47 AM] 
5886Anti kick slack. Accept the suffering. Like finding Nirvana.
5887
5888jp [11:47 AM] 
5889Lol. Match troll level
5890
5891csw [11:47 AM] 
5892No, I am not confirming certain things. Not in any public manner.
5893
5894[11:47] 
5895:slightly_smiling_face:
5896
5897klee [11:47 AM] 
5898:awesome:
5899
5900freetrader [11:47 AM] 
5901https://bitco.in/forum/threads/general-bitcoin-slack-unaffiliated-unmoderated.2073/
5902says "unmoderated" right there, bitsko just staying true to his word (edited)
5903
5904bitsko [11:47 AM] 
5905Im not kicking anyone guys. I dislike it philosophically. This is we we cant have nice things like scaling.
5906 
5907
5908awemany [11:48 AM] 
5909i was assuming this was a client malfunction
5910
5911alp 
5912[11:48 AM] 
5913will you kick me ifi post horse pr0n?
5914
5915xhiggy [11:48 AM] 
5916Yes
5917
5918beautybubble [11:48 AM] 
5919And un-moderated conversational social network is the ideal!
5920
5921tomothy 
5922[11:48 AM] 
5923Oh. Um.
5924
5925xhiggy [11:48 AM] 
5926I mean, please do
5927
5928jp [11:48 AM] 
5929Now I like you alp
5930
5931mrhodl [11:48 AM] 
5932@csw You're not confirming that you've spoken to @cobra-bitcoin in the past?
5933
5934bitsko [11:48 AM] 
5935You make me sad alp
5936
5937tomothy 
5938[11:48 AM] 
5939Lol
5940
5941luke-jr [11:48 AM] 
5942@mrhodl that could be falsified, so ofc he won't
5943
5944beautybubble [11:48 AM] 
5945Thank you @bitsko for doing your best to keep it that way.
5946
5947mrhodl [11:48 AM] 
5948@csw You're digging yourself a hole here.
5949
5950luke-jr [11:49 AM] 
5951@mrhodl he's already buried
5952
5953mrhodl [11:49 AM] 
5954We have multiple people in this channel that spoken to Satoshi. You can put all of this to rest right now @csw (edited)
5955
5956macsga [11:49 AM] 
5957@luke-jr fork this mofo
5958
5959ajd [11:49 AM] 
5960Happy belated parity day luke-jr
5961
5962macsga [11:49 AM] 
5963die shitcoin - we all jump into SEXWITH
5964
5965cypherblock [11:49 AM] 
5966@mrhodl except he doesn’t want to prove he is satoshi
5967
5968[11:49] 
5969or he can’t
5970
5971klee [11:49 AM] 
5972@luke-jr how is segwit going? hahahhahaha
5973 
5974
5975cypherblock [11:50 AM] 
5976but we cant tell difference
5977
5978cobra-bitcoin [11:50 AM] 
5979Let's just ignore Craig, he's not interesting anymore :disappointed:
5980
5981mrhodl [11:50 AM] 
5982Yeah
5983
5984klee [11:50 AM] 
5985@luke-jr no worries bro, you can still r&d in LTShit!!!
5986
5987macsga [11:50 AM] 
5988KLEE IS HERE
5989
5990ajd [11:50 AM] 
5991Why does it matter if he's Satoshi?
5992
5993tomothy 
5994[11:50 AM] 
5995That's silly. If sn was part of a team of 4 doesn't matter
5996
5997luke-jr [11:50 AM] 
5998@mrhodl already, nobody with a clue takes @csw seriously; his best hope of getting involved is to pretend the whole pretend-Satoshi thing never happened and start contributing for real
5999
6000
6001checksum0 [11:50 AM] 
6002So I guess you can leave then if you don't find the reason you are here interesting anymore...
6003
6004macsga [11:50 AM] 
6005I'm Satoshi bitches deal with it
6006
6007[11:50] 
6008let me forkr it
6009
6010cypherblock [11:50 AM] 
6011well you guys came here to see csw. why come here just to pester him. See what he has to say. it either makes sense or does not.
6012
6013cobra-bitcoin [11:51 AM] 
6014Didn't come here for Craig, wanted to see how active it was in here in general
6015
6016csw [11:51 AM] 
6017Well, I will leave you all. Have fun - I am off to have a t-bone :slightly_smiling_face:
6018 
6019
6020luke-jr [11:51 AM] 
6021@cypherblock I came here cuz I was invited.
6022
6023mrhodl [11:51 AM] 
6024HAhahahahahahahahahahahha
6025
6026tomothy 
6027[11:51 AM] 
6028Do you know of any patents that cover segwit? Can you discuss?
6029
6030fatman3001 [11:51 AM] 
6031bye csw
6032
6033jp [11:51 AM] 
6034Muahahha. Super rare bloody t bone
6035
6036tomothy 
6037[11:51 AM] 
6038Enjoy lunch!
6039
6040cypherblock [11:51 AM] 
6041@cobra-bitcoin @luke-jr your lucky day then :slightly_smiling_face:
6042
6043cobra-bitcoin [11:51 AM] 
6044Bye Craig
6045
6046macsga [11:51 AM] 
6047there he left us all alone with @luke-jr
6048
6049luke-jr [11:51 AM] 
6050@cobra-bitcoin what criteria do you want to see before UASF is allowed on bitcoin.org ?
6051
6052megalodon 
6053[11:51 AM] 
6054toodles
6055
6056beautybubble [11:51 AM] 
6057Thank you for time and honesty.
6058
6059klee [11:51 AM] 
6060rip the t-bone
6061
6062cobra-bitcoin [11:52 AM] 
6063UASF will never be allowed on bitcoin.org, bitcoin.org is for bitcoin, not altcoins
6064
6065
6066macsga [11:52 AM] 
6067and WHERE'S VINNY?
6068
6069[11:52] 
6070did he buy teh dip?
6071
6072klee [11:52 AM] 
6073buying shitcoins
6074
6075luke-jr [11:52 AM] 
6076guess I should be asking that on the uasf channel
6077
6078mrhodl [11:52 AM] 
6079Cobra...not *yet* :wink:
6080
6081jp [11:52 AM] 
6082He is sending more coins to his underwater position
6083
6084luke-jr [11:52 AM] 
6085@cobra-bitcoin bitcoin.org is anti-softfork now?
6086
6087freetrader [11:52 AM] 
6088Where can i buy BTU-AsF
6089
6090megalodon 
6091[11:52 AM] 
6092so can we all agree that segwit diehards can focus on LTShit and leave bitcoin to the big boys? :sunglasses:
6093
6094klee [11:52 AM] 
6095AMEN
6096
6097macsga [11:53 AM] 
6098yeah
6099
6100luke-jr [11:53 AM] 
6101@megalodon I'd sooner make a new altcoin
6102
6103macsga [11:53 AM] 
6104LTC IZ DA FUTURZ
6105
6106beautybubble [11:53 AM] 
6107I will be on the #random channel.
6108
6109megalodon 
6110[11:53 AM] 
6111oh you mean UASF ?
6112
6113mrhodl [11:53 AM] 
6114@luke-jr @cobra-bitcoin Not here.
6115
6116cobra-bitcoin [11:53 AM] 
6117@luke-jr bitcoin.org is against hostile takeover of the network unless it has overwhelmbing consensus
6118
6119klee [11:53 AM] 
6120LTC-jr?
6121
6122
6123jp [11:53 AM] 
6124Corn just crash to 400 and quickly crashing more.
6125
6126megalodon 
6127[11:53 AM] 
6128because tahts what that would be, an alt coin
6129
6130macsga [11:54 AM] 
6131DIE SHITCOIN
6132
6133[11:54] 
6134buy all alts dips boys
6135
6136luke-jr [11:54 AM] 
6137@cobra-bitcoin so the question is, what criteria do you use to determine overwhelming consensus?
61381 reply Today at 12:02 PM View thread
6139
6140macsga [11:54 AM] 
6141sorry, wrong window, I thought I was typing that in FONTASS slack
6142
6143cobra-bitcoin [11:55 AM] 
6144@luke-jr All the stakeholders agree, so almost all the miners, users, developers, overall economy, etc
6145
6146jp [11:55 AM] 
6147You have been fontasssed
6148
6149klee [11:55 AM] 
6150Vinnied
6151
6152luke-jr [11:55 AM] 
6153@cobra-bitcoin and segwit doesn't have that?
6154
6155
6156jp [11:55 AM] 
6157Yayayyayanayyvinnay
6158
6159bitsko [11:55 AM] 
6160Now i worry we will run out of free 10000 before i get home lol thanks trolls
6161
6162andy [11:55 AM] 
6163This is the weirdest day ever.
6164 
6165
6166checksum0 [11:56 AM] 
6167I guess this slack became bitcoin.org slack using the free 10000
6168
6169cobra-bitcoin [11:56 AM] 
6170@luke-jr Nope, a lot of miners are against segwit, and lots of users too unless it comes with a block size increase, so it should never be pushed through as a UASF
6171
6172
6173macsga [11:56 AM] 
6174@bitsko we know this, managed to troll everyone in klee's slack within 2days
6175
6176luke-jr [11:56 AM] 
6177@cobra-bitcoin it does come with a block size increase..
6178
6179wings [11:57 AM] 
6180@klee how is XOF doing ? :stuck_out_tongue:
6181 
6182
6183cypherblock [11:57 AM] 
6184@cobra-bitcoin “all the stakeholders” all is a pretty strong criteria.
6185
6186luke-jr [11:57 AM] 
6187@cobra-bitcoin there's only like 2 miners opposed, and pretty few users
6188
6189fatman3001 [11:57 AM] 
6190@andy _"This is the dimension of imagination. It is an area which we call the Twilight Zone."_
6191
6192mrhodl [11:57 AM] 
6193Miners? Here i thought it was just asic manufacturer.
6194
6195cobra-bitcoin [11:57 AM] 
6196@luke-jr People don't feel that it does enough
6197
6198megalodon 
6199[11:57 AM] 
6200ay fatman come back to klee's slack :stuck_out_tongue:
6201
6202macsga [11:57 AM] 
6203yeah we missed you black cat
6204
6205luke-jr [11:57 AM] 
6206@cobra-bitcoin I don't get that impression at all. Everyone seems to want it except trolls.
6207
6208
6209fatman3001 [11:57 AM] 
6210@megalodon I never left
6211
6212mrhodl [11:57 AM] 
6213What does "feelings" have anything to do with it?
6214
6215macsga [11:58 AM] 
6216we have none to troll and we troll each other
6217
6218mrhodl [11:58 AM] 
6219It's either a blocksize increase or it's not.
6220
6221megalodon 
6222[11:58 AM] 
6223send the ol' boy an invite!
6224
6225jp [11:58 AM] 
6226uploaded and commented on this image: e7bb793450426bdf1cb4e79397aea11dea281c31505206ca1bd95fcd3a0404a7.jpg
62271 Comment
6228Btc hits 9000 and quickly rising.
6229
6230vlad2vlad [11:58 AM] 
6231What you people done to this channel?  lol
6232
6233mrhodl [11:58 AM] 
6234Segwit IS a blocksize increase. I wish it wasn't
6235
6236
6237nicosey [11:58 AM] 
6238joined #general
6239
6240macsga [11:58 AM] 
6241lol
6242
6243vlad2vlad [11:58 AM] 
6244I'm gone 2 hours and it's trolled to death
6245
6246cobra-bitcoin [11:58 AM] 
6247@luke-jr So then if everyone wants it, let it go through the usual fork process instead of forcing it on others with a UASF?
6248
6249
6250macsga [11:58 AM] 
6251they started this!
6252
6253
6254ajd [11:58 AM] 
6255You don't think calling everyone who doesn't want segwit a troll is problematic?
6256
6257luke-jr [11:58 AM] 
6258@cobra-bitcoin UASF is the usual fork process
6259
6260
6261mrhodl [11:59 AM] 
6262@cobra-bitcoin Asicboost is in the way
6263
6264alp 
6265[11:59 AM] 
6266@ajd: there are not just trolls against it, morons too
6267
6268luke-jr [11:59 AM] 
6269or at least UESF is
6270
6271bitsko [11:59 AM] 
6272Please pm me any pastebins or recordings thx. I have the first one
6273
6274freetrader [11:59 AM] 
6275UASF == the road to POS or POW change
6276
6277mrhodl [11:59 AM] 
6278No one is stopping any from forking
6279
6280freetrader [11:59 AM] 
6281so sad it wasn't demo'ed on LTC first
6282
6283luke-jr [11:59 AM] 
6284@cobra-bitcoin just because segwit was first proposed with activation delegated to miners means it can't be un-delegated?
6285
6286mrhodl [12:00 PM] 
6287@cobra-bitcoin You think bip9 isn't a mistake?
6288
6289cobra-bitcoin [12:00 PM] 
6290@luke-jr If it has so much support, then it shouldn't need bitcoin.org to help you here
6291
6292
6293luke-jr [12:00 PM] 
6294@cobra-bitcoin I agree, but bitcoin.org could interfere potentially
6295
6296
6297ajd [12:00 PM] 
6298I argued that bip9 was a mistake from the time it was proposed.
6299
6300luke-jr [12:01 PM] 
6301anyway, time for #bitcoin-core-dev meeting, bbl
6302
6303andrewquentson [12:01 PM] 
6304@cobra-bitcoin how exactly did you get to become maintainer of bitcoin.org?
6305
6306
6307luke-jr [12:01 PM] 
6308http://webchat.freenode.net/?channels=#bitcoin-core-dev
6309
6310klee [12:01 PM] 
6311you mean #litecoin-core-dev
6312
6313
6314checksum0 [12:01 PM] 
6315Oh look, the cop is back...
6316
6317ajd [12:01 PM] 
6318#blockstream-core-dev
6319
6320freetrader [12:02 PM] 
6321Agenda Item 1: stop the brain drain
6322
6323tomothy 
6324[12:02 PM] 
6325I don't want segwit and I don't want uasf
6326
6327
6328andrewquentson [12:02 PM] 
6329@cobra-bitcoin are you satoshi?
6330
6331
6332ajd [12:02 PM] 
6333" To gracefully upgrade and ensure no long-lasting block-chain split occurs, more than 50% of miners must support full validation of the new transaction type and must switch from the old validation rules to the new rules at the same time. "
6334
6335andrewquentson [12:02 PM] 
6336How did you get maintainer status?
6337 
6338
6339[12:03] 
6340Answer me, I don't like it when people don't answer, it leaves everyone to have to assume
6341
6342
6343[12:03] 
6344which means they can speculate...
6345
6346
6347checksum0 [12:03 PM] 
6348The authority is demanding answer guys
6349
6350freetrader [12:03 PM] 
6351pick up that can
6352
6353tomothy 
6354[12:03 PM] 
6355I'm sorry aquent this has to be awful for you lol
6356
6357ajd [12:03 PM] 
6358UASF is just doublespeak for a developer activated soft fork anyway
6359
6360
6361checksum0 [12:04 PM] 
6362Aquent can't not _not_ know you know?
6363
6364cobra-bitcoin [12:04 PM] 
6365Pretty true, most people just download whatever is pushed on to them on the most visited sites
6366
6367andrewquentson [12:04 PM] 
6368yes, snake
6369
6370[12:04] 
6371HOW DID YOU GET MAINTAINER STATUS OF BITCOIN.ORG?
6372
6373
6374ajd [12:05 PM] 
6375Is this the new question you're going to ask 15000 times?
6376
6377snoop [12:05 PM] 
6378Please don't yell, AQ.
6379
6380checksum0 [12:05 PM] 
6381How much did you drink today Aquent?
6382
6383freetrader [12:06 PM] 
6384I don't like it when people don't answer the question.
6385
6386Pinned by jp 
6387Today at 12:06 PM Pinned by jp
6388cobra-bitcoin [12:06 PM] 
6389Andrew, how long have you been in bitcoin? You're asking the most basic questions that is very public knowledge
6390
6391andrewquentson [12:06 PM] 
6392really?
6393
6394snoop [12:06 PM] 
6395Yes, AQ. Really.
6396
6397andrewquentson [12:07 PM] 
6398its public knowledge how you came to become maintainer of bitcoin.org?
6399 
6400
6401iang [12:07 PM] 
6402He didn’t answer my question, either.  I didn’t like it :cry:
6403
6404
6405mastodon [12:07 PM] 
6406I asked csw "What's a bitcoin" to no response - he's  obviously not Satoshi
6407 
6408
6409snoop [12:07 PM] 
6410But Ian does not yell when he does not get his own way.
6411
6412
6413checksum0 [12:07 PM] 
6414I don't feel so good when answers are left unanswered
6415
6416
6417[12:08] 
6418I think I'll have to drink to compensate...
6419
6420
6421jp [12:08 PM] 
6422AQ needs some diapers
6423
6424
6425iang [12:08 PM] 
6426@mastodon … there is a video about that somewhere.
6427
6428
6429snoop [12:08 PM] 
6430Let's not Bully AQ. Let's help him understand his problem.
6431 
6432
6433jp [12:09 PM] 
6434AQ ICO issue on Ethtard network
6435
6436
6437andrewquentson [12:09 PM] 
6438Who cares about my problem, question is how does some random guy get maintainer status of bitcoin.org
6439 
6440
6441beautybubble [12:09 PM] 
6442There is a wonderful platform called Medium that is very useful for these questions.  It allows for everyone to answer.  Just an idea.
6443
6444
6445snoop [12:09 PM] 
6446Right. We hear you AQ.
6447
6448
6449checksum0 [12:10 PM] 
6450Your problem affect us all AQ
6451
6452
6453beautybubble [12:10 PM] 
6454Or a Q & A channel would work.
6455
6456
6457ajd [12:10 PM] 
6458That question answers itself.
6459
6460
6461checksum0 [12:10 PM] 
6462We understand, don't worry, the first step is to accept it.
6463
6464
6465andrewquentson [12:10 PM] 
6466it works perfectly fine here too @beautybubble
6467 
6468
6469[12:11] 
6470and dont think just because now he might be supporting one thing or another
6471
6472
6473[12:11] 
6474you wont get the same thing in your face
6475
6476
6477[12:11] 
6478there is a reason why norms, conventions, holding ppl to accnt, etc, exists
6479
6480
6481beautybubble [12:11 PM] 
6482Okay.  So, then, what is your deal?  I mean the questions for days and then it feels as though you don't like the answers.
6483
6484
6485andrewquentson [12:11 PM] 
6486there is a reason why some random guy cant go into apple and just run the company
6487
6488
6489beautybubble [12:12 PM] 
6490I mean you can't keep that up.
6491
6492
6493checksum0 [12:12 PM] 
6494Yes yes, the authority needs to hold people accountable
6495
6496
6497alp 
6498[12:12 PM] 
6499csw: that's not a fork, THIS IS  A FORK
6500
6501
6502checksum0 [12:12 PM] 
6503We understand, don'T worry
6504
6505
6506snoop [12:12 PM] 
6507You tell' everyone AQ. We got your back.
6508
6509
6510checksum0 [12:12 PM] 
6511At least luke is being entertaining
6512
6513
6514ajd [12:13 PM] 
6515The only way a random guy can achieve something is randomly.
6516
6517
6518andrewquentson [12:13 PM] 
6519I'd call it distracting
6520
6521
6522[12:13] 
6523but
6524
6525
6526[12:13] 
6527whatever
6528 
6529
6530ajd [12:13 PM] 
6531Or by being a guy, I guess.
6532
6533
6534andrewquentson [12:13 PM] 
6535let it be a playground
6536 
6537
6538checksum0 [12:13 PM] 
6539Luke the authority find it distracting, please stop.
6540       
6541
6542andrewquentson [12:13 PM] 
6543that will persuade anyone on the sidelines to take any participant in the bitcoin space seriously
6544   
6545
6546macsga [12:13 PM] 
6547who is authority
6548 
6549
6550[12:13] 
6551klee?
6552
6553
6554jp [12:14 PM] 
6555Kleecumming vinaay for bitcoin president 2020
6556
6557
6558macsga [12:14 PM] 
6559VINNY
6560
6561
6562[12:14] 
6563LUV
6564
6565
6566ajd [12:14 PM] 
6567Wow seriously, that's a core dev being a baby with the reactions?
6568
6569
6570jp [12:14 PM] 
6571Qora with love
6572
6573
6574andrewquentson [12:14 PM] 
6575@luke-jr why are you triggered? Are you @cobra-bitcoin ?
6576  
6577
6578macsga [12:14 PM] 
6579no, he's not. He's NotLambChop
6580
6581
6582[12:15] 
6583he's just using @luke-jr slack
6584
6585
6586jp [12:16 PM] 
6587T bone babe.
6588
6589
6590[12:16] 
6591Lambo choo choo.
6592 
6593
6594[12:17] 
6595Buy qora at 1 sat, pump to 100sat. F I L T H Y
6596
6597
6598andrewquentson [12:17 PM] 
6599Are you alirght @jp?
6600
6601
6602tomothy 
6603[12:17 PM] 
6604I don't like it when people don't answer the question.
6605 
6606
6607jp [12:17 PM] 
6608Buy qora and diem now AQ
6609 
6610
6611[12:18] 
6612We will fontas it
6613
6614
6615andrewquentson [12:18 PM] 
6616Are you the actual jp, jp, can you verify?
6617
6618
6619cryptonaut [12:18 PM] 
6620nice work turning this into a troll fest guys
6621
6622
6623checksum0 [12:18 PM] 
6624He makes about as much sense as you
6625
6626
6627andrewquentson [12:18 PM] 
6628in the usual ways, you know, twitter, no need for descartes philosophy
6629
6630
6631tomothy 
6632[12:18 PM] 
6633Aquent do you like it when people don't answer the question? (edited)
6634
6635
6636jp [12:18 PM] 
6637Very fontas much wow
6638
6639
6640checksum0 [12:18 PM] 
6641The authority demand to have proof of your identity
6642
6643
6644cryptonaut [12:18 PM] 
6645luke-jr just discovering emojis after coming out of his IRC cave
6646     
6647
6648jp [12:19 PM] 
6649LUKEJR emoji ICO raised 30M and quickly rising
6650
6651
6652cryptonaut [12:19 PM] 
6653lmao
6654   
6655
6656checksum0 [12:20 PM] 
6657I don't think I ever had that much fun in the span of a few hours...
6658 
6659
6660tomothy 
6661[12:20 PM] 
6662We need more slack emojis
6663
6664
6665jp [12:20 PM] 
6666Vinanny kleecumminggg ICO 800 corns sold all after 1 hr
6667
6668
6669beautybubble [12:21 PM] 
6670How many SLACK emoji's are there?
6671 
6672
6673checksum0 [12:21 PM] 
6674Not enough obviously
6675
6676
6677[12:21] 
6678Also, not enough to silence the authority
6679
6680
6681beautybubble [12:21 PM] 
6682I think I can do a spreadsheet and have a projection of when this will end.
6683
6684
6685cryptonaut [12:21 PM] 
6686you can create custom ones
6687
6688
6689beautybubble [12:21 PM] 
6690Oh, no!
6691 
6692
6693cryptonaut [12:21 PM] 
6694lol
6695
6696
6697tomothy 
6698[12:22 PM] 
6699There's a slack emoji website they have animated ones. They're amazing.
6700 
6701
6702beautybubble [12:22 PM] 
6703There used to be a SLACK bot that counted the one's each user preferred.
6704 
6705
6706jp [12:22 PM] 
6707Custom emoji ICO sold out at 50M market cap
6708 
6709
6710checksum0 [12:22 PM] 
671150M
6712 
6713
6714[12:22] 
6715THAT'S IT?
6716 
6717
6718beautybubble [12:22 PM] 
6719Oh, @tomothy that is even worse.
6720 
6721
6722freetrader [12:22 PM] 
6723we need a whiteboard to come up with more emoji
6724
6725
6726macsga [12:22 PM] 
6727what is whiteboard
6728
6729
6730beautybubble [12:22 PM] 
6731Hush @freetrader
6732
6733
6734macsga [12:22 PM] 
6735where's vinny
6736
6737
6738[12:23] 
6739nobody likes me here
6740
6741[12:23] 
6742only vinny
6743
6744freetrader [12:23 PM] 
6745@macsga : it's a table tennis table in disguide
6746
6747jp [12:23 PM] 
6748Whiteboard ICO used ethtard network sold 5B market cap
6749
6750luke-jr [12:23 PM] 
6751stoooooooooooop
6752 
6753
6754andy [12:23 PM] 
6755lol
6756
6757macsga [12:23 PM] 
6758@luke-jr ma man you're back :heart:
6759
6760beautybubble [12:23 PM] 
6761What if we did it this way.  We have #emoji hour and then move on?  You guys like that idea?
6762
6763checksum0 [12:23 PM] 
6764I though you had an really important #blockstream-core-dev meeting luke?
6765
6766tomothy 
6767[12:23 PM] 
6768See, bitcoin can come together. All we needed are slack emojis! (edited)
6769
6770jp [12:24 PM] 
6771LukeJr Stoop scream ICO sold at 10M MARKET cap, exceeding LTShit
6772
6773freetrader [12:24 PM] 
6774we could try just communicating in emojis for a while.
6775
6776luke-jr [12:24 PM] 
6777@checksum0 that's why i can't keep up here
6778
6779andy [12:24 PM] 
6780emoji BIP incoming
6781
6782ajd [12:24 PM] 
6783Apparently his DSL connection can handle IRC and slack *at the same time*
6784
6785luke-jr [12:24 PM] 
6786lol ajd
6787
6788beautybubble [12:24 PM] 
6789Oh, this is Kumbaya.
6790
6791jp [12:24 PM] 
6792BIP 404 - add custom emoji to btc tx
6793
6794macsga [12:24 PM] 
6795no, this is not true, he steals wifi from me
6796
6797freetrader [12:25 PM] 
6798sekret upgrade to 56K
6799
6800andy [12:25 PM] 
6801I'll be glad when this scaling saga is over.  What is the next big battle for Bitcoin?
6802
6803jp [12:25 PM] 
6804ICO
6805
6806checksum0 [12:25 PM] 
6807Nobody will need anything more than 33.3k guys
6808
6809[12:25] 
6810plz be serious
6811
6812andy [12:25 PM] 
681328800 BAUD BABY
6814
6815checksum0 [12:25 PM] 
6816300kb per 10 minutes, that's all anybody will ever need.
6817
6818macsga [12:25 PM] 
6819mine is 14400k V32
6820
6821freetrader [12:26 PM] 
6822andy shouting down the wire doesn't decrease the error rate
6823
6824luke-jr [12:26 PM] 
6825@checksum0 that'd be awesome if true
6826
6827ajd [12:26 PM] 
6828gmax said that Bitcoin used to have a 500K block size limit
6829
6830andy [12:26 PM] 
6831there were soft limits that were raised.
6832
6833checksum0 [12:26 PM] 
6834Oh yeah, if we could fit the world in 300kb block, that's be awesome, I agree.
6835
6836ajd [12:26 PM] 
6837I thought he meant a hard limit though
6838
6839checksum0 [12:26 PM] 
6840He is lying as usual
6841
6842
6843ajd [12:26 PM] 
6844the soft limit was less than that
6845
6846jp [12:27 PM] 
6847Hard fork ICO issued on ethtard raised 76M from AXA
6848
6849checksum0 [12:27 PM] 
6850Satoshi did not implement the 1mb for nothing, that was the first hard limit
6851
6852ajd [12:27 PM] 
6853I'm not sure what the limit was he was referring to though.
6854
6855beautybubble [12:27 PM] 
6856It would have been really nice if he had written something for "the emoji."
6857
6858luke-jr [12:28 PM] 
6859@ajd Bitcoin used to have a 500k hard limit that was not directly enforced, but indirectly enforced
6860
6861[12:28] 
6862it predates the 1 MB limit
6863
6864ajd [12:28 PM] 
6865The BDB limit?
6866
6867luke-jr [12:28 PM] 
6868yes
6869
6870ajd [12:28 PM] 
6871okay
6872
6873[12:30] 
6874BIP 50 was the way Satoshi should have implemented the 1 meg limit.
6875
6876[12:31] 
6877Maybe more than 2 months though
6878
6879andrewquentson [12:32 PM] 
6880Which satoshi @csw or @cobra-bitcoin ?
6881
6882[12:32] 
6883we have two of them
6884
6885[12:32] 
6886both fake obs
6887
6888alp 
6889[12:32 PM] 
6890who said cobra was satoshi?
6891
6892ajd [12:32 PM] 
6893Who would have imagined there'd be so much fighting over raising that limit, though?
6894
6895andrewquentson [12:32 PM] 
6896theymos
6897
6898checksum0 [12:32 PM] 
6899And the authority is back...
6900
6901freetrader [12:32 PM] 
6902satoshi no satoshi, kimosabe
6903
6904andrewquentson [12:34 PM] 
6905@cobra-bitcoin are you satoshi?
6906
6907[12:34] 
6908is that how you gained maintainer status of bitcoin.org @cobra-bitcoin ?
6909
6910alp 
6911[12:34 PM] 
6912when did theymos say that
6913
6914andrewquentson [12:35 PM] 
6915before the mess
6916
6917awemany [12:35 PM] 
6918@luke-jr : so if the BDB limit was an indirect HARD limit that was enforced, did we hard fork to larger blocks already? :smile:
6919
6920luke-jr [12:36 PM] 
6921@awemany yes, we did, May 2013
6922
6923beautybubble [12:36 PM] 
6924Who gets in the SLACK core dev?
6925
6926awemany [12:36 PM] 
6927I am happy to hear that, Luke :slightly_smiling_face:
6928
6929beautybubble [12:36 PM] 
6930Observers, pundits, traders?
6931
6932[12:37] 
6933Besides the developers.
6934
6935andrewquentson [12:37 PM] 
6936they don't have a slack, they have IRC, but why do small blockers not ask where did this cobra guy come from?
6937
6938checksum0 [12:37 PM] 
6939You can always expect Luke-jr to be faire
6940
6941luke-jr [12:37 PM] 
6942developers don't typically use slack
6943
6944checksum0 [12:37 PM] 
6945He is crazy... but fair...
6946
6947andrewquentson [12:38 PM] 
6948I mean, his avatar is  a cobra snake!
6949
6950[12:38] 
6951what other symbol do you want?
6952
6953checksum0 [12:38 PM] 
6954SO WHAT?
6955
6956[12:38] 
6957WHO GIVES A FUCK?
6958
6959andrewquentson [12:38 PM] 
6960do you wants it spelled out?
6961
6962checksum0 [12:38 PM] 
6963WHAT KIND OF SYMBOL?
6964
6965andrewquentson [12:38 PM] 
6966HE BRINGING VENOM
6967
6968checksum0 [12:38 PM] 
6969WHO CARES?
6970
6971[12:38] 
6972It's a fucking snake for fuck sake
6973
6974alp 
6975[12:39 PM] 
6976why does anyone care where he came from?
6977
6978checksum0 [12:39 PM] 
6979Nobody cares besides Aquent obviously
6980
6981andrewquentson [12:39 PM] 
6982because he gained maintainer status of bitcoin.org
6983
6984xhiggy [12:39 PM] 
6985It's a fair question
6986
6987checksum0 [12:39 PM] 
6988He can't respect that somebody don't want to disclose their identity
6989
6990andrewquentson [12:39 PM] 
6991its like someone suddenly becoming maintainer of the bitcoin github
6992
6993xhiggy [12:39 PM] 
6994Bu the doesn't have to answer it
6995
6996andrewquentson [12:39 PM] 
6997out of nothing
6998
6999xhiggy [12:39 PM] 
7000*but
7001
7002checksum0 [12:39 PM] 
7003Then congrats
7004
7005[12:40] 
7006There is no such thing as a bitcoin github
7007
7008andrewquentson [12:40 PM] 
7009I mean, sure, right now maybe he hormones small blockers, but tomorrow?
7010
7011beautybubble [12:40 PM] 
7012Drop.
7013
7014checksum0 [12:40 PM] 
7015That sentence make no sense
7016
7017andrewquentson [12:41 PM] 
7018do the brain dead
7019
7020travin [12:41 PM] 
7021Aquent, this isn't bitcointraders
7022
7023beautybubble [12:41 PM] 
7024Check your accounts.
7025
7026damelon [12:43 PM] 
7027joined #general
7028
7029alp 
7030[12:43 PM] 
7031why anyone care he has it? roger ver has bitcoin.com... who cares.
7032
7033freetrader [12:43 PM] 
7034drop indeed :slightly_smiling_face:
7035
7036beautybubble [12:43 PM] 
7037Pardon @alp
7038
7039[12:44] 
7040Many of us have our lives in this.
7041
7042travin [12:45 PM] 
7043I think he's talking about the website.
7044
7045andrewquentson [12:46 PM] 
7046roger ver has an identity (edited)
7047
7048alp 
7049[12:46 PM] 
7050so
7051
7052andrewquentson [12:46 PM] 
7053if he does something super stupid there can be public pressure
7054
7055[12:46] 
7056how do you public pressure a cobra snake?
7057
7058alp 
7059[12:46 PM] 
7060that sounds like a good thing
7061
7062[12:46] 
7063i dont want anyone being under duress
7064
7065mrhodl [12:47 PM] 
7066We need more anonymous people in the space.
7067
7068alp 
7069[12:47 PM] 
7070what if the cia wanted to coerce roger into doing something evil
7071
7072andrewquentson [12:47 PM] 
7073you don't want someone with huge influence to be held to account?
7074
7075alp 
7076[12:47 PM] 
7077much better no one knows who he is
7078
7079[12:47] 
7080you are correct andrew
7081
7082andrewquentson [12:47 PM] 
7083what keeps him from abusing it then?
7084
7085alp 
7086[12:47 PM] 
7087I dont want people to be able to be threateaned, kidnapped, etc...
7088
7089andrewquentson [12:47 PM] 
7090the influence?
7091
7092alp 
7093[12:47 PM] 
7094you ignore the site if its abusive
7095
7096[12:47] 
7097just like we do with bitcoin.com
7098
7099andrewquentson [12:48 PM] 
7100well, its first rank on google
7101
7102[12:48] 
7103noobs can't just ignore it
7104
7105[12:48] 
7106what if he inserted a mallicious wallet?
7107
7108beautybubble [12:48 PM] 
7109I think we should be nicer people.
7110
7111alp 
7112[12:49 PM] 
7113then you tell people he put a malicious wallet
7114
7115[12:49] 
7116he already has a malicious wallet
7117
7118andrewquentson [12:49 PM] 
7119well, you're afforded to not be nice when you're a cobra snake
7120
7121alp 
7122[12:49 PM] 
7123so you warn people
7124
7125[12:49] 
7126apparently his reputation doesnt matter to him anyway
7127
7128[12:49] 
7129so your theory doesnt work so good andrew
7130
7131andrewquentson [12:49 PM] 
7132do you wear a mask when you walk down the street alp?
7133
7134[12:50] 
7135imagine if the ceo of apple walked around with a mask...
7136
7137alp 
7138[12:50 PM] 
7139whats your point?
7140
7141andrewquentson [12:50 PM] 
7142how do you hold him to account?
7143
7144alp 
7145[12:50 PM] 
7146I like privacy
7147
7148andrewquentson [12:50 PM] 
7149you, sure
7150
7151[12:50] 
7152the ceo of apple? nah thanks
7153
7154[12:50] 
7155he could run with all the 500 billion apple has
7156
7157[12:50] 
7158or
7159
7160ajd [12:50 PM] 
7161FWIW, there was never a 500k hard limit. The 500k soft limit (which was imposed after the 1 meg hard limit) just made the triggering of a certain bug in the locking system unlikely. But blocks above 500k could be and were created despite that bug. See BIP50. (edited)
7162
7163andrewquentson [12:50 PM] 
7164for bitcoin.org, splash it with scam ads and whatever
7165
7166[12:51] 
7167and what does that do to bitcoin's name?
7168
7169alp 
7170[12:51 PM] 
7171we already have that with roger ver
7172
7173[12:51] 
7174so hows that reputation based accountability going
7175
7176andrewquentson [12:51 PM] 
7177roger is a known person
7178
7179[12:51] 
7180he does it all openly
7181
7182[12:51] 
7183if there is something there is recourse, accountability
7184
7185alp 
7186[12:51 PM] 
7187what recourse?
7188
7189[12:52] 
7190i mean hes doing it today
7191
7192andrewquentson [12:52 PM] 
7193he has to, is forced to, stick within ethical lines
7194
7195alp 
7196[12:52 PM] 
7197all we can do is shame him
7198
7199[12:52] 
7200no he isnt
7201
7202andrewquentson [12:52 PM] 
7203how do you hold a cobra snake within ethical lines?
7204
7205alp 
7206[12:52 PM] 
7207the same way you hold roger
7208
7209[12:52] 
7210are you suggesting someone be jailed?
7211
7212andrewquentson [12:52 PM] 
7213if they do something criminal, then sure
7214
7215alp 
7216[12:52 PM] 
7217ok, so what if its not criminal
7218
7219[12:53] 
7220what then
7221
7222andrewquentson [12:53 PM] 
7223well, that's the point
7224
7225[12:53] 
7226how do you feel the public pressure when you are a cobra snake?
7227
7228[12:53] 
7229he is totes anon
7230
7231[12:53] 
7232which means he can do what he pleases
7233
7234[12:53] 
7235he could
7236
7237alp 
7238[12:53 PM] 
7239how do you put pressure on roger?
7240
7241travin [12:53 PM] 
7242Same I guess when one complains about Brexit all day and just hangs around IRC while never going out to vote. (edited)
7243
7244alp 
7245[12:54 PM] 
7246which means he can do what he pleases.
7247
7248andrewquentson [12:54 PM] 
7249load mallicious wallets that steel all your bitcoins
7250
7251[12:54] 
7252and youd have no recourse
7253
7254alp 
7255[12:54 PM] 
7256lol voting is for morons
7257 3 replies Last reply today at 12:55 PM View thread
7258
7259andrewquentson [12:54 PM] 
7260with roger there would be recourse
7261
7262[12:54] 
7263you can sue him or he can get imprisoned
7264
7265alp 
7266[12:54 PM] 
7267WHAT recourse?
7268
7269andrewquentson [12:54 PM] 
7270with a cobra snake...
7271
7272alp 
7273[12:54 PM] 
7274ok so you can sue him?
7275
7276andrewquentson [12:54 PM] 
7277or he could be locked up
7278
7279[12:54] 
7280he has bounderies
7281
7282alp 
7283[12:54 PM] 
7284so you are suggesting using governments to control what is on bitcoin domains or in bitcoin code?
7285
7286andrewquentson [12:54 PM] 
7287a cobra snake has no bounderies
7288
7289alp 
7290[12:54 PM] 
7291you say it like thats a bad thing
7292
7293[12:54] 
7294that sthe feature, not a bug
7295
7296andrewquentson [12:55 PM] 
7297im suggesting locking up whoever does anything criminal
7298
7299ajd [12:55 PM] 
7300everyone does something criminal
7301
7302andrewquentson [12:56 PM] 
7303and no, a complete random guy getting maintainer status is not a feature
7304
7305[12:56] 
7306its a hack
7307
7308alp 
7309[12:56 PM] 
7310some would say bitcoin itself is criminal
7311
7312[12:56] 
7313would you suggest governments should lock up bitcoin developers?
7314
7315andrewquentson [12:57 PM] 
7316whoever created bitcoin proved him/themselves, now if randomly someone becomes maintainer of bitcoin
7317
7318[12:57] 
7319there is no proof here
7320
7321[12:57] 
7322there is no indication of rationality or anything
7323
7324[12:58] 
7325its a loophole, which they can play for their own pleasure and burn it all
7326
7327[12:58] 
7328because what do they care
7329
7330[12:58] 
7331they dont have the mind of whoever created it, or its inclination
7332
7333[12:58] 
7334they may be retarded idiots for all we know who just somehow become maintainers
7335
7336[12:58] 
7337thus the implicit accountablity
7338
7339[12:58] 
7340is gone
7341
7342alp 
7343[12:58 PM] 
7344do you think governments should lock up satoshi?
7345
7346mrhodl [12:59 PM] 
7347@andrewquentson Why do you think Satoshi stayed anonymous?
7348
7349andrewquentson [12:59 PM] 
7350@cobra-bitcoin is no satoshi
7351
7352[12:59] 
7353not close
7354
7355alp 
7356[12:59 PM] 
7357ok
7358
7359mrhodl [12:59 PM] 
7360yeah, i know
7361
7362[12:59] 
7363That doesn't answer my question
7364
7365andrewquentson [12:59 PM] 
7366Satoshi proved himself
7367
7368[12:59] 
7369so the calculus there is different
7370
7371[1:00] 
7372a completley random guy
7373
7374[1:00] 
7375is very different
7376
7377mrhodl [1:00 PM] 
7378So he had a right to stay anonymous and someone else doesn't?
7379
7380andrewquentson [1:00 PM] 
7381yes
7382
7383[1:00] 
7384because he proved himself (edited)
7385
7386mrhodl [1:00 PM] 
7387What if cobra proved himself to me
7388
7389andrewquentson [1:00 PM] 
7390this someone else didnt
7391
7392[1:00] 
7393satoshi proved himself to all
7394
7395[1:00] 
7396you are just one blip
7397
7398[1:00] 
7399among a sea of blips
7400
7401mrhodl [1:01 PM] 
7402did he fuck up bitcoin.org?
7403
7404[1:01] 
7405You see any viruses on there?
7406
7407andrewquentson [1:01 PM] 
7408so, trust him?
7409
7410mrhodl [1:01 PM] 
7411You don't need to trust him
7412
7413andrewquentson [1:01 PM] 
7414and what if he does put viruses there?
7415
7416mrhodl [1:01 PM] 
7417you can't force his hand either.
7418
7419alp 
7420[1:01 PM] 
7421if he puts viruses there then we stop using it
7422
7423andrewquentson [1:01 PM] 
7424what are you going to do?
7425
7426[1:01] 
7427we?
7428
7429[1:01] 
7430who is we?
7431
7432[1:02] 
7433does google stop using them?
7434
7435mrhodl [1:02 PM] 
7436I'll boycott bitcoin.org
7437
7438[1:02] 
7439as i'm sure you will
7440
7441andrewquentson [1:02 PM] 
7442do the thousands, millions of sites linking to it?
7443
7444mrhodl [1:02 PM] 
7445They link it bitcoin.org because it's built a reputation over the years
7446
7447andrewquentson [1:02 PM] 
7448satoshi's reputation
7449
7450[1:03] 
7451he created the site
7452
7453[1:03] 
7454and then some random guy comes and somehow becomes maintainer!
7455
7456mrhodl [1:03 PM] 
7457cobra has maintained bitcoin.org longer than satoshi.
7458
7459andrewquentson [1:03 PM] 
7460what
7461
7462mrhodl [1:03 PM] 
7463Do you see any reasons to to trust cobra?
7464
7465andrewquentson [1:03 PM] 
7466I mean you guys are all ra ra about craig wright
7467
7468[1:03] 
7469but ignore your own craig wright
7470
7471mrhodl [1:03 PM] 
7472Craig is a scammer
7473
7474andrewquentson [1:03 PM] 
7475and @cobra-bitcoin ?
7476
7477mrhodl [1:03 PM] 
7478How did cobra scam?
7479
7480[1:04] 
7481Tell me
7482
7483andrewquentson [1:04 PM] 
7484by claiming he is satoshi
7485
7486new messages
7487mrhodl [1:04 PM] 
7488What!?
7489
7490[1:04] 
7491lol
7492
7493[1:04] 
7494source please
7495
7496andrewquentson [1:04 PM] 
7497dude
7498
7499[1:04] 
7500how does he become maintainer/
7501
7502[1:04] 
7503I mean
7504
7505satoshi [1:05 PM] 
7506Cobra has also made some really idiotic suggestions too.
7507
7508mrhodl [1:05 PM] 
7509What does that have to do with him saying he's satoshi ?
7510
7511[1:05] 
7512Guys.. bitcoin is at all time highs
7513
7514[1:05] 
7515cheer up
7516
7517alp 
7518[1:05 PM] 
7519not good news if you are all in on dash