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3«‹›5 »« Neo-FYAD Discussion › FYAD
4BookmarkPost Reply
5Jeffrey of YOSPOS
6Dec 31, 1969
7
8I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
9Floss Finder	
10Facebook
11Twitter
12Share
13Hey. So here are the long awaited proposed rules for fyad. The core goals here are to eliminate bigotry from fyad, put a lid on the forums-wide antagonism that has provoked much ire over the past years, and ensure that, going forward, whoever runs fyad will be a participating member of the mod team. This will be a challenge but it's one that I am prepared to undertake. We will be starting over with a fresh, empty forum and implementing the following rules, in addition to those stated in the existing forum rules.
14New FYAD Rules posted:
151. No bigotry in any form. This will not be taken lightly. You have been warned.
162. Make fun of what people do, not who they are. If you cannot tell the difference between these things, don't post.
173. Absolutely no subforum invasions.
18
19Short and sweet, I am happy to discuss any part of it. I want to call specific attention to rule 2. It has prompted a lot of discussion. The goal of the rule as stated is to create a place where going into the trans thread and mocking posters posting about their lived experiences is 100% off limits. At the same time, I don't think we need to be so severe that we can't laugh at, say, the guy who cut through his house's I-beams to install a gaudy bathtub. I am hoping that my rule captures this distinction, but I'm open to rewording it. I think it will, in practice, be fairly simple to draw this line, but being able and willing to do so will be a key responsibility of any fyad moderator going forward. Diligent implementation of this rule has managed to turn around the "Awkward Ugly and Gross" thread, despite the inherent, errm, ugliness that such a thread carries in its subject matter.
20
21ZDR and FAU, for all their hard work, had a policy of turning a blind eye towards FYAD. Guyovich was promoted to admin rather confront the person giving him chain six hour probations. This era is over - no special treatment will be given to FYAD posters going forward. That's not to say that FYAD posters are not allowed to post elsewhere at all, as plenty of them have interests that they talk about on the forums like anyone else. However, I will absolutely not allow FYAD to be a meeting ground for group antagonism. I think it's been made clear that the pendulum has swung the other way. FYAD posters are on thin ice and they know it. I hope that posting normal stuff in your subforums and also in fyad will not be a cause for probation, but you have my full permission to give them a short leash.
22
23This is a *temporary* forum for discussion of these issues. This will go away when the issue is settled, as there will be no more siloing of fyad issues from the rest of the mod team. Ralp is here and should be able to read and post in this thread. Part of incorporating the fyad mod into the mod team means including them in mod conversations, especially ones like this one that will directly shape how they do their job.
24
25Also FYAD now stands for Farewell You Appalling Dickheads. (Credit to Ariong for that one.)
26 # ? Dec 19, 2019 22:49
27Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
28Dash Rendar
29Jan 9, 2007
30
31Han Solo, ha! If I'm around, you don't need that guy.
32first
33 # ? Dec 19, 2019 22:57
34Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
35LITERALLY A BIRD
36Sep 26, 2008
37
38I knew you were trouble
39when you flew in
40
41Which I graciously allowed for you to be. 
42 # ? Dec 19, 2019 22:59
43Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
44Burt Sexual
45Jan 26, 2006
46
47
48Aida Cuevas is my Ranchera Princess
49
50
51Switchblade Switcharoo	Present
52 # ? Dec 19, 2019 23:01
53Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
54fool of sound
55Oct 10, 2012
56
57Soiled Meat	I think that basically covers it. I'd just append "posting in other forums like they're fyad will get you in trouble" or something like that to rule 3.
58 # ? Dec 19, 2019 23:07
59Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
60Burt Sexual
61Jan 26, 2006
62
63
64Aida Cuevas is my Ranchera Princess
65
66
67Switchblade Switcharoo	0. low taxes over arching rules completely apply to this forum, please review prior to posting
681. Edit. No bigotry, ironic or otherwise, ......
692. Question. How do they handle long face Jim?
703. Edit. Invasion encompasses one or multiple goons entering a forum and bad faith posting, and or unnecessary unfunny shitstirring
71
72Make Ralp mod
73 # ? Dec 19, 2019 23:08
74Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
75LITERALLY A BIRD
76Sep 26, 2008
77
78I knew you were trouble
79when you flew in
80
81Burt, what about "shitstirring" instead of or in addition to "invasions" in rule three's phrasing, without elaborating further? I think it's best to keep that one punchy and with room for us to flex it.
82 # ? Dec 19, 2019 23:10
83Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
84Burt Sexual
85Jan 26, 2006
86
87
88Aida Cuevas is my Ranchera Princess
89
90
91Switchblade Switcharoo	
92LITERALLY A BIRD posted:
93Burt, what about "shitstirring" instead of or in addition to "invasions" in rule three's phrasing, without elaborating further? I think it's best to keep that one punchy and with room for us to flex it.
94
95That’s cool, in addition to.
96 # ? Dec 19, 2019 23:17
97Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
98Ralp
99Aug 18, 2004
100
101by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
102hello
103 # ? Dec 19, 2019 23:20
104Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
105LITERALLY A BIRD
106Sep 26, 2008
107
108I knew you were trouble
109when you flew in
110
111Hi Ralp. 
112 # ? Dec 19, 2019 23:21
113Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
114Gigi Galli
115Sep 19, 2003
116
117WORLD COMPETITVE VAPING CHAMPION 2017/18
118~~PHAT CLOUDS~~
119NASIOC MASSIVE
120~~MONSTER ENERGY~~
121Ralp posted:
122hello
123
124Hi!
125
126These seem good.
127
128LITERALLY A BIRD posted:
129Burt, what about "shitstirring" instead of or in addition to "invasions" in rule three's phrasing, without elaborating further? I think it's best to keep that one punchy and with room for us to flex it.
130
131I like this as well. Remember the mess regarding the use of “invasion” with the smooth brains in cspam and d&d? I know they’re a special type of pedantic but it’s best to be vague here, I think
132 # ? Dec 19, 2019 23:24
133Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
134Burt Sexual
135Jan 26, 2006
136
137
138Aida Cuevas is my Ranchera Princess
139
140
141Switchblade Switcharoo	Request permission to post “Fyad status discussions are underway with real actual people. Please hold”.
142
143Within the open gbs Fyad thread. They need something real. Nothing more. Accepting suggestions.
144 # ? Dec 19, 2019 23:33
145Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
146fool of sound
147Oct 10, 2012
148
149Soiled Meat	Yeah I think letting the FYAD thread and the trans thread know We're Hard At Work Improving Their Posting Experience would be a good idea.
150 # ? Dec 19, 2019 23:34
151Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
152Burt Sexual
153Jan 26, 2006
154
155
156Aida Cuevas is my Ranchera Princess
157
158
159Switchblade Switcharoo	
160Ralp posted:
161hello
162
163Yo, you up for that Fyad gig? It’s kinda off the rails rn. What’s your platform sir? Lol
164 # ? Dec 19, 2019 23:35
165Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
166LITERALLY A BIRD
167Sep 26, 2008
168
169I knew you were trouble
170when you flew in
171
172I think sharing that we're actively buckling down on it in that single-sentence manner is a good idea, if Jeff is on board as well. I know that in the PYF circles at least people are allowing us a little slack due to the holidays and assorted RL crises but even they are alert to the lack of communication here.
173 # ? Dec 19, 2019 23:43
174Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
175LITERALLY A BIRD
176Sep 26, 2008
177
178I knew you were trouble
179when you flew in
180
181Jeff is fine with it as well (new post for visibility).
182 # ? Dec 20, 2019 00:18
183Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
184Liquid Communism
185Mar 9, 2004
186
187
188Out here, everything hurts.
189
190
191Fun Shoe	Would it be useful to make it clear to the IKs (and posters) that chain probating people in FYAD for posting elsewhere is going to cost them ten bucks and their buttons?
192
193That's a thing that I know keeps some people from posting in FYAD in order to avoid having a post for that shit to be targeted at, after seeing the whole Guyovitch saga.
194
195Don't want to step on the comedy sixers, because they're often pretty good, but it's a thing that's been abused in the past.
196 # ? Dec 20, 2019 00:56
197Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
198Burt Sexual
199Jan 26, 2006
200
201
202Aida Cuevas is my Ranchera Princess
203
204
205Switchblade Switcharoo	
206Liquid Communism posted:
207Would it be useful to make it clear to the IKs (and posters) that chain probating people in FYAD for posting elsewhere is going to cost them ten bucks and their buttons?
208
209That's a thing that I know keeps some people from posting in FYAD in order to avoid having a post for that shit to be targeted at, after seeing the whole Guyovitch saga.
210
211Don't want to step on the comedy sixers, because they're often pretty good, but it's a thing that's been abused in the past.
212
213They chained me for like days, as a mod. It was fucked up agaimst the rules, FAU finally stepped in
214
215
216I made this earlier, chains (no mods) can only go 24 or whatever hours. Not weeks
217 # ? Dec 20, 2019 01:24
218Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
219nine-gear crow
220Aug 10, 2013
221
222red bird	
223Burt Sexual posted:
224They chained me for like days, as a mod. It was fucked up agaimst the rules, FAU finally stepped in
225
226
227I made this earlier, chains (no mods) can only go 24 or whatever hours. Not weeks
228
229My thoughts exactly. 24-48 hours is funny, any longer than that and it gets annoying for nearly all parties involved. Make it absolutely clear if they abuse the buttons, the buttons are going away and it might even cost them  or more.
230 # ? Dec 20, 2019 01:32
231Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
232Jeffrey of YOSPOS
233Dec 31, 1969
234
235I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
236Floss Finder	
237nine-gear crow posted:
238My thoughts exactly. 24-48 hours is funny, any longer than that and it gets annoying for nearly all parties involved. Make it absolutely clear if they abuse the buttons, the buttons are going away and it might even cost them  or more.
239I am definitely not okay with probating mods, preventing mods from posting in the reports forum is particularly bad. In my mind this gets your buttons taken away. That really goes for any IK, it's not just a fyad thing.
240
241I am more inclined to keep things discretionary than prescribe any hard and fast rules for chain sixers in general. There is a point where it's obnoxious but I'm more a fan of "ask them to stop" than "this costs you , no exceptions". I do honestly believe that having a fyad mod who participates in the mod forum will alleviate the issue somewhat. It's not like Hogge Wilde or Moridin were bad calls, and clearer communication between us and whoever wanted to stop them from posting might well have saved us all some trouble.
242 # ? Dec 20, 2019 01:43
243Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
244Jerusalem
245May 19, 2004
246
247Would you be my new best friends?
248In particular for rule 2, I think at least for the first little while (days, maybe weeks?) that the new version of the forum is open you'll have people trying their best to see exactly how far they can possibly stretch this and get away with it. Not saying it's a bad rule, just that the mod (which it looks like will be Ralp) is going to be getting tested pretty hard and it's probably gonna be a rough time for them. I'm not really sure what if any solutions there are to that, just pointing out that there's always gonna be people trying to rules-lawyer their way into being allowed to be assholes, and maybe a catch-all "the mod has complete discretion to penalize bad posting as they see fit" comment isn't a bad idea? Or is that already implied by Burt's suggestion of Rule 0?
249 # ? Dec 20, 2019 02:33
250Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
251Archyduchess
252Jul 18, 2006
253
254
255
256I only have excellent ideas
257Are they still going to be choosing IKs through that random number thing, or will they be picked through the normal channels?
258 # ? Dec 20, 2019 02:51
259Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
260Fedule
261Mar 26, 2010
262
263
264No one left uncured.
265I got you.
266I think a complete lack of tolerance for bullshit should be made implicit in the rules and subsequently made apparent by making examples of the first few people to try it, personally.
267 # ? Dec 20, 2019 02:51
268Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
269Junpei Hyde
270Mar 15, 2013
271
272Never believe in lies	
273Fedule posted:
274I think a complete lack of tolerance for bullshit should be made implicit in the rules and subsequently made apparent by making examples of the first few people to try it, personally.
275
276Agreed
277 # ? Dec 20, 2019 05:55
278Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
279Jaded Burnout
280Jul 10, 2004
281
282
283.
284Jaded Burnout fucked around with this message at Dec 23, 2019 around 12:16
285
286 # ? Dec 20, 2019 07:27
287Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
288iospace
289Jan 18, 2038
290
291
292
293Fun Shoe	I think the biggest thing is you can not be mocked or attacked for your posts in the other forums. It's effectively helldumping at that point. The mentality of "you can go after whomever you choose, even if they aren't here" was part of problem. Hell, it's what lead to this whole thing in the first place.
294
295To address Jaded Burnout's #3 above, it's why I said in the other thread: "no probing people who aren't actively participating in FYAD." General Anime sort of started it (with a script no less), but what would happen is an IK would find a post in FYAD made by a forum enemy, no matter how old, and chain probe over their entire time as IK. Half the time, it would be for posts that are months, if not years, old.
296iospace fucked around with this message at Dec 20, 2019 around 09:36
297
298 # ? Dec 20, 2019 09:31
299Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
300Jaded Burnout
301Jul 10, 2004
302
303
304.
305Jaded Burnout fucked around with this message at Dec 23, 2019 around 12:16
306
307 # ? Dec 20, 2019 09:59
308Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
309alnilam
310Nov 10, 2009
311
312
313
314I think JB's breakdown is helpful. FYAD did a lot of what was basically helldumping and I think that's toxic as hell. Digging up old posts or cross-forum posts for mockery hurts the forums as a whole.
315
316Mocking people in FYAD for what they're currently posting in FYAD should probably be fair game, even if it's not my cup of tea.
317 # ? Dec 20, 2019 10:13
318Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
319Dash Rendar
320Jan 9, 2007
321
322Han Solo, ha! If I'm around, you don't need that guy.
323People who rule lawyer to try and get away with doing dumb bullshit are super annoying. If it helps, add to the rules that it won't be tolerated. You don't have to let someome get away with being shitty if they didn't technically run afoul of section 8 paragraph 2 line 40-42 of the rules.
324
325LITERALLY A BIRD posted:
326Which I graciously allowed for you to be. 
327
328haha, thank you!
329 # ? Dec 20, 2019 10:42
330Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
331graph
332Nov 21, 2006
333
334aaag peanuts
335
336
337Soiled Meat	i dig it
338
339is there a contingency plan if it all falls apart again?
340
341moving forward on the reboot, will there be a sort of punishment like removing the stylesheet/banner to push the notion of un-siloing ?
342 # ? Dec 20, 2019 10:53
343Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
344fool of sound
345Oct 10, 2012
346
347Soiled Meat	Imo there should be room for making fun of goons and threads when they're doing something actually worthy of mockery, like that rediculous Old Spice bathroom from DIY. It's think the line should be 'make fun of stuff happening right now, don't stalk the subjects of mockery in hopes of finding more material'.
348 # ? Dec 20, 2019 10:58
349Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
350Cyrano4747
351Sep 25, 2006
352	OK, going to drop a bunch of posts I made in the other thread then get caught up in here:
353 # ? Dec 20, 2019 11:10
354Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
355Cyrano4747
356Sep 25, 2006
357	
358Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:
359Hey. So here are the long awaited proposed rules for fyad. The core goals here are to eliminate bigotry from fyad, put a lid on the forums-wide antagonism that has provoked much ire over the past years, and ensure that, going forward, whoever runs fyad will be a participating member of the mod team. This will be a challenge but it's one that I am prepared to undertake. We will be starting over with a fresh, empty forum and implementing the following rules, in addition to those stated in the existing forum rules.
360
361
362Short and sweet, I am happy to discuss any part of it. I want to call specific attention to rule 2. It has prompted a lot of discussion. The goal of the rule as stated is to create a place where going into the trans thread and mocking posters posting about their lived experiences is 100% off limits. At the same time, I don't think we need to be so severe that we can't laugh at, say, the guy who cut through his house's I-beams to install a gaudy bathtub. I am hoping that my rule captures this distinction, but I'm open to rewording it. I think it will, in practice, be fairly simple to draw this line, but being able and willing to do so will be a key responsibility of any fyad moderator going forward. Diligent implementation of this rule has managed to turn around the "Awkward Ugly and Gross" thread, despite the inherent, errm, ugliness that such a thread carries in its subject matter.
363
364ZDR and FAU, for all their hard work, had a policy of turning a blind eye towards FYAD. Guyovich was promoted to admin rather confront the person giving him chain six hour probations. This era is over - no special treatment will be given to FYAD posters going forward. That's not to say that FYAD posters are not allowed to post elsewhere at all, as plenty of them have interests that they talk about on the forums like anyone else. However, I will absolutely not allow FYAD to be a meeting ground for group antagonism. I think it's been made clear that the pendulum has swung the other way. FYAD posters are on thin ice and they know it. I hope that posting normal stuff in your subforums and also in fyad will not be a cause for probation, but you have my full permission to give them a short leash.
365
366I am making a *temporary* forum for discussion of these issues, linked below and with a copy of this post. This will go away when the issue is settled, as there will be no more siloing of fyad issues from the rest of the mod team. Ralp is, at present, my top choice for fyad mod. I wish we lived in the universe where Grandmother of Five had time to do it, but she unfortunately does not. I have spoken to him about this and he has asked to be part of this discussion before he agrees. He will have access to the discussion board below, as will other potential candidates, so if you'd like to comment on that choice without them seeing it, please do so here in the mod forum. Otherwise, I would appreciate it if discussion could go in the linked thread. Part of incorporating the fyad mod into the mod team means including them in mod conversations, especially ones like this one that will directly shape how they do their job.
367
368https://forums.somethingawful.com/s...hreadid=3907503
369
370PS FYAD now stands for Farewell You Appalling Dickheads. (Credit to Ariong for that one.)
371
372I think #2 somewhat covers it but I do think that we need to be more explicit about not shitting on other sub forums for “content.” It’s self destructive and hurts the forum as a whole. It got to the point in TFR where I made a rule against it there because it was petty and drove other posters away. I like how simple the rules are but that one might need two sentences to nuance. Gimme a sec and I’ll do find the specific rule from TFR to give an example.
373 # ? Dec 20, 2019 11:10
374Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
375Cyrano4747
376Sep 25, 2006
377	Here’s the TFR rule. Again I’m a wordy academic so no need to make yours too long, just an example of my thinking:
378
379quote:
380
381This is not the place to complain about other SA forums. If you think that you were mistreated in another SA community that is between you, the posters there, and that mod team. Different forums have different cultures and expectations. Yes, D&D isn’t as gun-friendly as TFR but we don’t want to define ourselves in opposition to other parts of the forums. If you have a gripe about how another forum (or this one for that matter) is being run and the mods there don’t seem responsive, try contacting an admin or making a thread in QCS.
382
383My big concerns is that the FYAD mock threads start back up. Even if it’s a “make fun of posters actions not posters” thing that can turn ugly, fast. There’s obviously nuance and room for discretion if another Grover house happens but do we really need FYAD making fun of e/n posters for being bad at relationships or the next Zaurg etc? I think in most of the obvious cases of someone being an idiot the subs themselves tend to make fun of the idiot.
384 # ? Dec 20, 2019 11:11
385Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
386Cyrano4747
387Sep 25, 2006
388	
389alnilam posted:
390I agree with this. It's a tricky line to draw though. It might just take some subjectivity.
391
392
393The reason I think it should be made explicit in the new FYAD rules is that it's historically been one of the biggest problems with FYAD. I mean, fuck, it's basically the reason we're all doing this right now. The anti-trans shit was gross and awful, but it was part of a larger pattern of FYAD cruising the other subs looking for "content."
394
395I think the angle to approach this is to make it clear that mock threads about other SA posters or forums isn't OK, but that there is a window there where it's become an ~epic something awful event~ (Zaurg, Grover house) and therefore fair game. I would say that the rule of thumb needs to be if they're getting mocked inside the affected sub, then it's fine.
396Cyrano4747 fucked around with this message at Dec 20, 2019 around 11:15
397
398 # ? Dec 20, 2019 11:11
399Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
400Cyrano4747
401Sep 25, 2006
402	Ok, so I'm still thinking this through, so bear with me.
403
404Here is the rule as proposed:
405
4062. Make fun of what people do, not who they are. If you cannot tell the difference between these things, don't post.
407
408A big part of the problem is that, online, a lot of what people are is what they do. We aren't meeting each other in public and forming shitty opinions based on how we look, we're talking to each other online and forming shitty opinions based on what we decide to talk about. I'm a shit ton more than just a guy who target shoots but on SA I'm the gun mod. KM is a lot more than just a person who doesn't like online racism and posts funny gifs, but on SA she's the Black Mod (capital B, capital M). etc.
409
410Let's take Pet Island as an example. A lot of people there have very intense relationships with their pets. Do we want FYAD searching through there and finding posters who are using their animals as a way of coping and mocking them because of that, in typically cruel FYAD fashion?
411
412To pick an example close to home, look at Literally A Bird (edit: sorry if this hits close to home Bird, but I think it's an example we can talk about given that we're all friends here and we all care about you). I wouldn't want to see her as the focus of some FYAD circle jerk because of how important her bird is to her. But, according to that rule as it stands, that's OK because they're making fun of what she does (loves a bird) rather than who she is.
413
414PI is the most obvious example and probably has more potential for outright cruelty ("lol look at that idiot grieving over a dog, it's just an animal, buy another one"), but you can do this for just about all of the hobby subforums. Make a mock thread for the sweaty D&D nerds in trad games. Make a mock thread for the idiots spending too much money on pimping their civic in AI. Make a mock thread for the political partisan knife fights in CSPAM. Make a mock thread for the gun nuts in TFR. All of these are things people do rather than things people are, but having a forum pointing and laughing at the shit the other people in the forums do still isn't healthy for the SAF as a whole.
415 # ? Dec 20, 2019 11:11
416Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
417Koalas March
418May 20, 2007
419
420	I was working last night so apologies, but I think the rules look good, however I do agree with Cyrano.
421 # ? Dec 20, 2019 11:20
422Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
423Koalas March
424May 20, 2007
425
426	
427fool of sound posted:
428Imo there should be room for making fun of goons and threads when they're doing something actually worthy of mockery, like that rediculous Old Spice bathroom from DIY. It's think the line should be 'make fun of stuff happening right now, don't stalk the subjects of mockery in hopes of finding more material'.
429
430Ehh I'm not sure that's a great idea because it's hard to quantify and easy to rules lawyer.
431
432In the fragility thread posters are allowed to make fun of racist posts or fragility meltdowns but that's a very specific metric that's easy to identify. If that makes sense anyway
433 # ? Dec 20, 2019 11:25
434Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
435Jeffrey of YOSPOS
436Dec 31, 1969
437
438I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
439Floss Finder	
440fool of sound posted:
441Imo there should be room for making fun of goons and threads when they're doing something actually worthy of mockery, like that rediculous Old Spice bathroom from DIY. It's think the line should be 'make fun of stuff happening right now, don't stalk the subjects of mockery in hopes of finding more material'.
442Yeah this is closer to where I'm at. Going to their forums and shitstirring there is a problem but laughing at a post that, with sufficient distance from the subject matter, reads as ridiculous out of context is kind of okay with me? Like I hate to use personal examples, but fyad has found e/n stuff of mine and made fun of it, and it's been universally true for me that, with the benefit of time and distance, those things have become extremely funny to me, as well. I even shared an example in the mod discord because I wanted y'all to be able to laugh at them too. Being willing to laugh at ourselves is something that separates something awful from other places online and I don't think it is a bad thing in general. Where to draw that line between funny and cruel will be a job for the fyad mod and any admin overseeing things, but I don't think that is as difficult a task as folks have made it out to be.
443
444Like, I understand your hypothetical situation here Cyrano, and I just don't think rules as stated need to cover it explicitly. My intent with writing new rules is to preserve spaces on this forum where folks can share their own vulnerabilities without fear of being mocked, like the trans thread, not to address all of the cases where someone should or shouldn't be made fun of. It's the difference between "this is a specifically vulnerable person sharing something personal" and, well, regular posts. My intent is to call unique attention to situations where it isn't okay, not demarcate the entire space of posts. It's understandable if you don't believe this outright, but I don't think anyone in FYAD thinks that someone grieving over their pet is hilarious material to yuk about, and I think anyone who tried that would have been run out all along. This is something I can only show you with action, taken in the future, not words in the mod forum, but I hope to be given the chance to demonstrate it as such.
445
446I do think Lucy, personally, went too far. I have gotten FYAD posters PMing to thank me for banning her, for this very reason. Open communication between the folks who run fyad and the folks here is something I believe will genuinely help that sort of situation.
447
448Rules lawyering has never ever been a problem on something awful. Every generation of mod has known to ignore it and we've been collectively doing so for years. I do think it is a reason why broad principles are better than long lists of specific rules, but it's not something we as a staff are vulnerable to.
449 # ? Dec 20, 2019 11:46
450Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
451Burt Sexual
452Jan 26, 2006
453
454
455Aida Cuevas is my Ranchera Princess
456
457
458Switchblade Switcharoo	I wouldn’t change their style sheet, it’s their identity, having a good mod that isn’t explicitly “part of the clan” will de silo it enough for me.
459 # ? Dec 20, 2019 12:02
460Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
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473«‹›5 »« Neo-FYAD Discussion › FYAD
474BookmarkPost Reply
475Athanatos
476Jun 6, 2006
477
478It's a great trip.
479Facebook
480Twitter
481Share
482I think a simple:
483
484"This is not helldump, do not treat it as such" works. Or if that gives off too much of "DONT EVER LOOK AT OTHER FORUMS" vibe, "Be good to other forums users." Something simple. You can't complex a rule up in an attempt to catch every instance of hate.
485
486and this:
487
488"Where to draw that line between funny and cruel will be a job for the fyad mod and any admin overseeing things, but I don't think that is as difficult a task as folks have made it out to be." Will be the difference maker. You are not going to be able to type the perfect line into the rules that is a "GOTCHA" for every person trying to be a shit. The people who mod it and watch it will be the ones who monitor that and the difference between "Look at this guy who just fired someone 2 days before Christmas because of snow" and "Haha, this guy is a [slur] screw those people!"
489 # ? Dec 20, 2019 12:05
490Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
491Jaded Burnout
492Jul 10, 2004
493
494
495The DIY bathroom guy is worth discussing in more detail because I was there when it happened, but I wasn't a mod at the time, but I can talk about how I would deal with that sort of thread if one came up again.
496
497Yes, a lot of the response to it was mean spirited, and he's a punchline across DIY to this day, but he was being dunked on for his terrible opinions about women, money, and digging a well if the well happens to be your upstairs bathroom's engineered floor joists. There was a moderate amount of mocking his taste in decor but that comes with the territory and was kinda secondary. The DIY folks can swing from supportive to fucking brutal in a second once they smell blood and resistance.
498
499However.
500
501They started digging through his post history, though at least it was for relevant stuff.
502
503They started proto-doxxing him.
504
505They started digging up more tangential stuff from his posting history. To quote Burt Sexual at this point, "This is my first foray into DIY so you guys may be more fyad than I know".
506
507They reported him to his local code enforcement office using information dug up from linkedin.
508
509And it sort of carried on from there. I don't remember if kid sinister got a slap for that, but he should've.
510
511Point being, there's a line to cross, where on one side you have "Dude stop doubling down before you kill yourself, also your design is ugly", and on the other side you have "Sure you posted about this here, but over there I've found X, Y, and Z about you so now that's fair game too".
512
513Where each forum puts that line is going to be different, but if that thread played out in DIY the same now I'd raise an eyebrow when people went outside the thread to find other relevant DIY crimes, giving a week probation for "ooh look I found your linkedin" and a ban for either posting that info in-thread or calling the dude's local authority or whatever.
514
515If I was running FYAD I'd do the same; if you're going to dunk on someone for bad actions & opinions they need to be proximal and contemporaneous, i.e. don't go digging far away or long ago to find them, but I don't run FYAD and maybe that line sits elsewhere.
516Jaded Burnout fucked around with this message at Dec 20, 2019 around 12:08
517
518 # ? Dec 20, 2019 12:06
519Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
520Cyrano4747
521Sep 25, 2006
522	
523Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:
524My intent is to call unique attention to situations where it isn't okay, not demarcate the entire space of posts. It's understandable if you don't believe this outright, but I don't think anyone in FYAD thinks that someone grieving over their pet is hilarious material to yuk about, and I think anyone who tried that would have been run out all along.
525
526Here's the problem: the whole reason we're going through all this right now is that many posters in FYAD thought it was A-OK to do exactly this. Not over grieving for pets, but over gender identity and a whole host of other really shitty things that came to light as we started digging in. The "I think women in domestic violence shelters should be raped" post keeps coming back to me when I think about this stuff.
527
528No one who did that stuff was run out by FYAD itself. Self-policing for them broke down in the worst possible ways. Right now I have very little faith in their ability to stay chill and not be shitty without some clear boundaries.
529
530I do, however think that this works:
531Athanatos posted:
532I think a simple:
533
534"This is not helldump, do not treat it as such" works.
535
536We don't want Helldump back, and at its worst that's exactly what FYAD was and it caused a lot of the same cross-forums problems that Helldump caused.
537
538The fact that people were afraid to go in there and post speaks volumes about it. I was never a FYAD poster. I poked my head in once ca. 2006 and thought it wasn't for me. Same with BYOB. Just not my cup of tea. But FYAD in 2019 doesn't resemble what I remember of 2006 at all. Maybe I'm a different person and it was always like that, but I think part of it might also be people looking back on FYAD a decade ago and thinking that the current iteration resembles their fond memories.
539 # ? Dec 20, 2019 12:16
540Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
541Liquid Communism
542Mar 9, 2004
543
544
545Out here, everything hurts.
546
547
548Fun Shoe	
549Burt Sexual posted:
550I wouldn’t change their style sheet, it’s their identity, having a good mod that isn’t explicitly “part of the clan” will de silo it enough for me.
551
552If the stylesheet's staying can we at least get the flags culled?
553 # ? Dec 20, 2019 12:16
554Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
555Athanatos
556Jun 6, 2006
557
558It's a great trip.
559Cyrano4747 posted:
560Here's the problem: the whole reason we're going through all this right now is that many posters in FYAD thought it was A-OK to do exactly this. Not over grieving for pets, but over gender identity and a whole host of other really shitty things that came to light as we started digging in. The "I think women in domestic violence shelters should be raped" post keeps coming back to me when I think about this stuff.
561
562No one who did that stuff was run out by FYAD itself. Self-policing for them broke down in the worst possible ways. Right now I have very little faith in their ability to stay chill and not be shitty without some clear boundaries.
563
564I think, like Jeffrey said, that will be the mod/admins job. The last breakdown was a failure of the mod. If someone is there turning discussion away from too far, keeping it from that, and handing out probations if it does get to that, the boundaries will be set.
565 # ? Dec 20, 2019 12:21
566Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
567Jeffrey of YOSPOS
568Dec 31, 1969
569
570I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
571Floss Finder	Wait they blew up his LinkedIn? That is.....fucking disturbing actually. Like I've read the threads where FYAD mocks people, and they can be pretty harsh when they want to be, but it never ever reaches the point of posting people's social media accounts and making fun of those. Full stop. FYAD actually did ban for stuff like that already. Big Anime Fan Here is the most recent one I can remember, and he posted a picture of Spanish Manlove's sister, and was permabanned for it rightly. This line has been well-preserved by the existing fyad staff, for all of their other faults - they make fun of posts here and don't go beyond that, because they are looking for ephemeral laughter. They may still end up hurting people with cruel words, and the new rules are designed to put a lid on that, but it's incidental, never the intent of the posts. Those DIY posts are explicitly seeking to hurt and punish this guy IRL for his posting crimes, there's nothing funny about going to local code enforcement at all.
572
573This is supposed to be a discussion of fyad, but damn, I kinda think we should perma- that "teehee I found your LinkedIn" guy. That's toxic. That is worse than anything I've seen in fyad for years and I permabanned someone for posting a goon's facebook in GBS. Like it's embarrassing for the site to have that sort of post unpunished in the goldmine and I'm blindsided that it was going on unchallenged in a subforum I don't read. Like it feels absurd to, in the current crisis, praise FYAD for it's restraint, but they certainly have shown more of it than DIY if that thread is to be taken at face value.
574 # ? Dec 20, 2019 12:24
575Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
576LITERALLY A BIRD
577Sep 26, 2008
578
579I knew you were trouble
580when you flew in
581
582I would agree with the not helldump don't use it as such phrasing. Same as rule three: short and sweet and vague is best for the mod to enforce with the proper judgment, this of course presupposing it is a mod we trust (Ralp has not said yes just yet!).
583 # ? Dec 20, 2019 12:25
584Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
585graph
586Nov 21, 2006
587
588aaag peanuts
589
590
591Soiled Meat	
592Liquid Communism posted:
593If the stylesheet's staying can we at least get the flags culled?
594
595something needs to be taken away. flags or sigs or both. of course it's their identity, that's why it'll sting
596 # ? Dec 20, 2019 12:26
597Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
598Cyrano4747
599Sep 25, 2006
600	
601Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:
602Wait they blew up his LinkedIn? That is.....fucking disturbing actually. Like I've read the threads where FYAD mocks people, and they can be pretty harsh when they want to be, but it never ever reaches the point of posting people's social media accounts and making fun of those. Full stop. FYAD actually did ban for stuff like that already. Big Anime Fan Here is the most recent one I can remember, and he posted a picture of Spanish Manlove's sister, and was permabanned for it rightly. This line has been well-preserved by the existing fyad staff, for all of their other faults - they make fun of posts here and don't go beyond that, because they are looking for ephemeral laughter. They may still end up hurting people with cruel words, and the new rules are designed to put a lid on that, but it's incidental, never the intent of the posts. Those DIY posts are explicitly seeking to hurt and punish this guy IRL for his posting crimes, there's nothing funny about going to local code enforcement at all.
603
604This is supposed to be a discussion of fyad, but damn, I kinda think we should perma- that "teehee I found your LinkedIn" guy. That's toxic. That is worse than anything I've seen in fyad for years and I permabanned someone for posting a goon's facebook in GBS. Like it's embarrassing for the site to have that sort of post unpunished in the goldmine and I'm blindsided that it was going on unchallenged in a subforum I don't read. Like it feels absurd to, in the current crisis, praise FYAD for it's restraint, but they certainly have shown more of it than DIY if that thread is to be taken at face value.
605
606
607
608SA in general has a doxxing problem right now. A lot of it is going on in off-sites like forum specific discords. I've been vocal about it in the past with how it relates to CSPAM but there's a population of posters who think that punishing someone for shit they did online is a good thing and they are usually smart enough to do it not on the forums themselves.
609
610We had a really good TFR poster leave over threats made to his family on his youtube page referencing shit that happened in CSPAM, for example.
611
612I don't have an answer to this. If I knew who pulled that on the TFR poster I'd queue the perma myself or get one of the CSPAM mods to push that button if the malfactor wasn't a TFR poster, but there's no good way to track that shit.
613
614edit: this shit is a big part of why I tell my posters, frequently and loudly, to watch what they post online. TFR used to be a much more open place about arranging meet ups and the like. Now I get nervous whenever Secret Santa comes along.
615Cyrano4747 fucked around with this message at Dec 20, 2019 around 12:29
616
617 # ? Dec 20, 2019 12:27
618Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
619alnilam
620Nov 10, 2009
621
622
623
624graph posted:
625something needs to be taken away. flags or sigs or both. of course it's their identity, that's why it'll sting
626
627FYAD has been closed for like over a week, I think the message that things must change has been felt. The stylesheet and sigs and flags are in principle one of the most innocuous and nice things about fyad in that it's harmless, fun decoration. Of course in practice some of the flags are/were terrible or even illegal so they should probably be reset to zero or at least culled, but I personally don't think the styles need to be removed.
628
629Cards on the table, I'm defensive about this because BYOB loves our stylesheet and sigs, and we would relish flags if we had them.
630 # ? Dec 20, 2019 12:33
631Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
632Koalas March
633May 20, 2007
634
635	
636graph posted:
637something needs to be taken away. flags or sigs or both. of course it's their identity, that's why it'll sting
638
639Yup, mte.
640
641Also I feel like there is some happy medium between vague and long af/impossible to parse.
642
643And while I think Ralp would do a good job and I think that having the mods be actually part of the mod team is a big fucking plus, but this
644
645quote:
646No one who did that stuff was run out by FYAD itself. Self-policing for them broke down in the worst possible ways. Right now I have very little faith in their ability to stay chill and not be shitty without some clear boundaries
647
648Is exactly right and should be screamed from the rafters right now.
649
650Handing them their old stylesheet, 3 rules (same as old but we're going to enforce them this time guys, I promise!!) is a disaster waiting to happen and sends the wrong message. Both to fyad and the trans posters they've been harassing relentlessly.
651 # ? Dec 20, 2019 12:33
652Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
653Jeffrey of YOSPOS
654Dec 31, 1969
655
656I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
657Floss Finder	
658Cyrano4747 posted:
659SA in general has a doxxing problem right now. A lot of it is going on in off-sites like forum specific discords. I've been vocal about it in the past with how it relates to CSPAM but there's a population of posters who think that punishing someone for shit they did online is a good thing and they are usually smart enough to do it not on the forums themselves.
660
661We had a really good TFR poster leave over threats made to his family on his youtube page referencing shit that happened in CSPAM, for example.
662
663I don't have an answer to this. If I knew who pulled that on the TFR poster I'd queue the perma myself or get one of the CSPAM mods to push that button if the malfactor wasn't a TFR poster, but there's no good way to track that shit.
664
665edit: this shit is a big part of why I tell my posters, frequently and loudly, to watch what they post online. TFR used to be a much more open place about arranging meet ups and the like. Now I get nervous whenever Secret Santa comes along.
666Doxxing is something I take extremely seriously and I truly don't believe that it's something done by FYAD. The facebook I'm talking about was from the Australia thread in GBS, and I think C-Spam has a serious issue with it as well. I keenly remember the story you're referring to and it's probably the most tempted I've ever been to read someone's PMs intrusively. I don't want to cross that line and I respect the victim's wishes not to share who did it but I really would like to find and remove the perpetrator from this forum. Maybe you could email the victim again and ask if he'd share his PMs with you or an admin now that time has passed?
667
668This is kind of off-topic though. FYAD already had this line drawn and if it hadn't it would have been deleted years ago. Find me a facebook link in there (lowtax excepted) and I'll destroy them but they really have not done that.
669
670My goal here is to eliminate the bigotry in fyad, as I said up top. Sigs and flags and stylesheets do not cause bigotry and I have no interest in using this thread to also address those things. I have removed some bad flags and I'm happy to continue to do so in the future but that is not what this thread ought to be about.
671 # ? Dec 20, 2019 12:40
672Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
673Jaded Burnout
674Jul 10, 2004
675
676
677Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:
678This is supposed to be a discussion of fyad, but damn, I kinda think we should perma- that "teehee I found your LinkedIn" guy. That's toxic. That is worse than anything I've seen in fyad for years and I permabanned someone for posting a goon's facebook in GBS. Like it's embarrassing for the site to have that sort of post unpunished in the goldmine and I'm blindsided that it was going on unchallenged in a subforum I don't read. Like it feels absurd to, in the current crisis, praise FYAD for it's restraint, but they certainly have shown more of it than DIY if that thread is to be taken at face value.
679
680He did catch a ban for it later in the thread when combined with some other weird behaviour. As I say I wasn't running the show back then. He never actually doxxed him on the forums themselves, and was (is?) a pariah for having gone as far as he did.
681
682I've not seen any misbehaviour from anyone in the last year.
683
684Edit: to keep this thread relatively clear, PM me if you wanna chat it through. Or in the serious thread.
685Jaded Burnout fucked around with this message at Dec 20, 2019 around 13:19
686
687 # ? Dec 20, 2019 12:49
688Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
689Koalas March
690May 20, 2007
691
692	Jeffrey. Please.
693
694FYAD and KF have the exact same talking points re: me being a Puerto Rican (because I am lightskinned, you see) was never poor because I also owned a piano(!?). Like really specific fucking things. There is absolutely overlap there.
695 # ? Dec 20, 2019 12:50
696Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
697fool of sound
698Oct 10, 2012
699
700Soiled Meat	
701Koalas March posted:
702Handing them their old stylesheet, 3 rules (same as old but we're going to enforce them this time guys, I promise!!) is a disaster waiting to happen and sends the wrong message. Both to fyad and the trans posters they've been harassing relentlessly.
703
704They're really not the same rules. Bigotry and slurs were allowed in FYAD because it ostensibly wasn't malicious. It was, so that's going away. FYAD was allowed to stalk posters because the ostensibly could maintain ironic distance. They couldn't so that's going away. FYAD was largely given special treatment when they harasses and stirred shit in other subforums because they were ostensibly the conscience of SA. They aren't, so this is going away. The FYAD mod was a largely jokey position received via contest because they ostensibly self-policed. They couldn't, so that is going away. Removing cosmetic effects from FYAD doesn't do anything to solve any problem and comes off as weirdly spiteful imo.
705 # ? Dec 20, 2019 13:01
706Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
707Athanatos
708Jun 6, 2006
709
710It's a great trip.
711fool of sound posted:
712Removing cosmetic effects from FYAD doesn't do anything to solve any problem
713
714I agree. Not sure what the endgame of that one is that the bans, probations, and complete change of their forum rules and mods doesnt accomplish
715 # ? Dec 20, 2019 13:16
716Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
717Cyrano4747
718Sep 25, 2006
719	
720Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:
721Doxxing is something I take extremely seriously and I truly don't believe that it's something done by FYAD. The facebook I'm talking about was from the Australia thread in GBS, and I think C-Spam has a serious issue with it as well. I keenly remember the story you're referring to and it's probably the most tempted I've ever been to read someone's PMs intrusively. I don't want to cross that line and I respect the victim's wishes not to share who did it but I really would like to find and remove the perpetrator from this forum. Maybe you could email the victim again and ask if he'd share his PMs with you or an admin now that time has passed?
722
723
724I still keep in touch with him and it's something that he's shot down hard ever time I've mentioned it. Apparently the threats were pretty specific and he's just done with having an online presence. As he put it "bullshitting on the internet isn't worth my family or my job."
725 # ? Dec 20, 2019 13:35
726Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
727Koalas March
728May 20, 2007
729
730	
731Athanatos posted:
732I agree. Not sure what the endgame of that one is that the bans, probations, and complete change of their forum rules and mods doesnt accomplish
733
734It send the message that the old forum is dead and gone and it integrates fyad with the rest of forums as a whole.
735 # ? Dec 20, 2019 13:36
736Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
737Ralp
738Aug 18, 2004
739
740by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
741ok but like, this thread is about reopening a new fyad, not an unrelated gray forum.
742 # ? Dec 20, 2019 13:54
743Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
744Party Plane Jones
745Jul 1, 2007
746
747by Reene
748Fun Shoe	
749Ralp posted:
750ok but like, this thread is about reopening a new fyad, not an unrelated gray forum.
751
752gradually change it from grey to color like the intro sequence from wizard of oz
753 # ? Dec 20, 2019 14:07
754Profile Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
755Ralp
756Aug 18, 2004
757
758by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
759There's a difference between creating rules for a forum, and creating rules for the mods/iks of a forum, and creating rules for a group of people. I think the rules in the OP are substantially fine; I would suggest adding something like "4. no mod sass" (but maybe defined a little better, "mod sass" is not super meaningful). It's covered in the universal forum rules but imho bears repeating explicitly. IK rules are another thing that some posts in this thread are touching on (regarding probations etc) and that's a good discussion but those do not belong as part of the forum rules. I'll dig up the IK rules I sent out after every contest later, as a starting point.
760
761The third thing, rules that apply to a group of people, doesn't really make sense though. I understand the idea of fyad being a specific group of sinister trolls or whatever, and the insularity of the forum means that's not entirely nonsensical, but it's uh, not what fyad is. It's a forum on the internet (as the first half of that flag goes). When we sign up for the forums we don't pick a box that says I'm a gbs poster or fyad poster. So rules about what is/isn't ok to do in other forums, don't belong in the fyad rules — they would belong in that forum.
762 # ? Dec 20, 2019 14:09
763Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
764Jeffrey of YOSPOS
765Dec 31, 1969
766
767I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
768Floss Finder	
769Koalas March posted:
770Jeffrey. Please.
771
772FYAD and KF have the exact same talking points re: me being a Puerto Rican (because I am lightskinned, you see) was never poor because I also owned a piano(!?). Like really specific fucking things. There is absolutely overlap there.
773This is a very serious accusation to make of a large swathe of posters. Accusations of being a kiwifarms poster are also nearly unfalsifiable, a scarlet letter forever on one's name forever, whether it's true or not. It would not shock me at all if, say, Raspy had a kiwifarms account and he's permabanned already. It is certainly possible for a kiwifarms guy to show up in fyad, I can't stop that before it happens and if I'm convinced it is happening, I will act on it. I take people posting on kiwifarms very seriously, but I need more to go on than this. In the past week alone, I panel permabanned someone who outed themselves there, despite having 0 posts, I deleted their paid ads, and I hand edited all of the posts quoting a particular user's old username to help prevent them from being doxxed. It is a site-wide concern, as the linkedin guy from the DIY shows, but someone doing it offsite is also really hard to prove and a really unfair accusation to throw around without clear evidence. I will continue to destroy anyone I think is posting on kiwifarms or something sensitive or any other offsite hellhole, but I also have to be mindful that it isn't something that someone can disprove once accused.
774
775Do you have specific posts in mind? Understood if you did not catalogue these. Criticizing you unfairly does not mean that someone is from kiwifarms, that is too far of an inference for me to make. I hope it goes without saying that anyone linking your social media or anything else offsite would get the hammer and quickly. I do remember criticism of your fundraising thread which you also revised based on feedback in the mod forum, it wasn't out of nowhere.
776
777Sitewide rules against criticizing mods is something that was policy until 2013, when Aatrek was found out. That is the worst case of a policy like that - an unapologetic pedophile holding a position of authority for years. I appreciate all the hard work done by everyone here a great deal, and I have no desire to enable harassment of you folks, but being a mod is always going to involve scrutiny beyond that of a regular user. Teams of folks in charge have a way of becoming insular and protecting their own, even when they shouldn't. We both trusted Bobbie's judgement after all, no one is immune to this effect. There are plenty of examples in forums history in which criticism of mods has lead to the right outcome. Accusing you of being Puerto Rican and owning a piano is like, ludicrously stupid, but if that's the best criticism someone can muster, it also probably means you're a pretty good mod. You are welcome to disagree but I think that is a small price to pay for insurance against Aatrek 2.0. We can delineate QCS as the place to do this rather than FYAD, but obviously that place has some issues as well, and it doesn't have the barrier to entry that FYAD does.
778Jeffrey of YOSPOS fucked around with this message at Dec 20, 2019 around 14:18
779
780 # ? Dec 20, 2019 14:15
781Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
782Ralp
783Aug 18, 2004
784
785by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
786Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:
787No bigotry in any form. This will not be taken lightly. You have been warned.
788Make fun of what people do, not who they are. If you cannot tell the difference between these things, don't post.
789Absolutely no subforum invasions.
790I'm interested in discussing the specifics of how these would be enforced in practice because I think they're good (and there's room for refining the wording sure) but I think it's the sort of thing that 10 different mods and 10 different posters would have 20 different ideas of what it all actually means in practice.
791
792I'm interested in this because it's one of the major questions I have about the endeavor of an fyad redesign: especially given the intense scrutiny it will be under, is this something that can actually work, or is it going to be designed by committee without a shared goal and subject to so many conflicting parameters that whoever agrees to mod the thing is just being unintentionally set up to expend a ton of time and effort and stress, and then fail.
793 # ? Dec 20, 2019 14:27
794Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
795Ralp
796Aug 18, 2004
797
798by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
799can someone fix my fucking avatar, this is what happens when you get unbanned from the panel
800 # ? Dec 20, 2019 14:28
801Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
802alnilam
803Nov 10, 2009
804
805
806
807Ralp posted:
808The third thing, rules that apply to a group of people, doesn't really make sense though. I understand the idea of fyad being a specific group of sinister trolls or whatever, and the insularity of the forum means that's not entirely nonsensical, but it's uh, not what fyad is. It's a forum on the internet (as the first half of that flag goes). When we sign up for the forums we don't pick a box that says I'm a gbs poster or fyad poster. So rules about what is/isn't ok to do in other forums, don't belong in the fyad rules — they would belong in that forum.
809
810Yeah this is true, although I don't think I saw anyone suggest that itt. The problem before was that when they went to shitstir in other forums people were like, afraid to mess with the FYAD bully crew, or even discouraged to deal with it properly by previous admins. If we're discarding the culture of impunity then I think everyone should be able to punish in their own forum accordingly, there's no need for fyad posters to be "marked"
811 # ? Dec 20, 2019 14:50
812Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
813Koalas March
814May 20, 2007
815
816	I'm heading to my second job rn, but Jeffrey if you want feel free to search my name in fyad and cross reference it with the thread in KF. I don't have the time, or frankly mental energy to catalog posts about me that are dumb and shitty at best and flat out abusive at worst. I get where you are coming from but it is such a gross insensitive thing to ask someone to whip out a binder full of receipts of racialized abuse hurled at them through the years.
817
818Anyway you got me, I'm just done with this. I'm dropping it.
819
820Just do whatever y'all want with fyad since that seems to be the plan anyway. good luck with the inevitable bullshit down the line days, weeks or years from now
821 # ? Dec 20, 2019 14:52
822Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
823fool of sound
824Oct 10, 2012
825
826Soiled Meat	I know you're a frequent target for both groups, and that's awful and I'm sorry about it, but I don't see how removing cosmetic effect from FYAD somehow discourages them from doing this if the new rules and moderation do not.
827 # ? Dec 20, 2019 15:02
828Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
829Burt Sexual
830Jan 26, 2006
831
832
833Aida Cuevas is my Ranchera Princess
834
835
836Switchblade Switcharoo	Jeffrey I think you’re on target, but whatever you do. Make sure you open it on a Tuesday.
837 # ? Dec 20, 2019 15:09
838Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
839Lightning Knight
840Feb 23, 2012
841
842Shoot First
843I think we’re proposing rules to delineate what FYAD is not without articulating what it should be.
844
845I am ambivalent to the a e s t h e t I c s of FYAD but if you don’t think there’s a fuck ton of crossover between FYAD and KF then I have a bridge to sell you.
846 # ? Dec 20, 2019 15:22
847Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
848graph
849Nov 21, 2006
850
851aaag peanuts
852
853
854Soiled Meat	
855Koalas March posted:
856Handing them their old stylesheet, 3 rules (same as old but we're going to enforce them this time guys, I promise!!) is a disaster waiting to happen and sends the wrong message. Both to fyad and the trans posters they've been harassing relentlessly.
857
858Koalas March posted:
859It send the message that the old forum is dead and gone and it integrates fyad with the rest of forums as a whole.
860
861yep. giving them back their playpen in the exact same state will be bad news
862
863i mean, i hope i'm wrong and the forums aesthetic doesn't matter at all
864 # ? Dec 20, 2019 15:46
865Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
866LITERALLY A BIRD
867Sep 26, 2008
868
869I knew you were trouble
870when you flew in
871
872Based on what Jeffrey has been saying, fyad is going to be losing a lot of its unique features anyway. Beecocking posts for example is a function tied uniquely to fyad's current forumsid, and since we are making an entirely new subforum in place of the old one those functions will not carry over. I am of the opinion letting the new fyad have its pink stylesheet and crazy signatures should not be a sticking point here since we are stripping literally everything else including its name. As Ralp said we aren't looking to make a new gray forum here, we are specifically making a new pink one.
873LITERALLY A BIRD fucked around with this message at Dec 20, 2019 around 22:00
874
875 # ? Dec 20, 2019 15:51
876Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
877Ralp
878Aug 18, 2004
879
880by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
881Lightning Knight posted:
882I think we’re proposing rules to delineate what FYAD is not without articulating what it should be.
883
884FYAD is the mean forum, for posting gross pictures and waging flame wars.
885 # ? Dec 20, 2019 16:36
886Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
887Cyrano4747
888Sep 25, 2006
889	For what it's worth I could give a fuck if they have a fancy style sheet or flags or sigs or whatever (although I do thing a flamethrower needs to be taken to the current flags - let them start over on that front).
890
891The issue is the substance, not the form.
892
893D&D could be a neon fuscia splash page with hypnotically rotating bernie sanders heads and all posts in 8 degree off-kilter comic sans and it wouldn't change the substance of what people are talking about. At the same time, the FYAD trans thread could be laid out by the typsetters for the New York Times and still be a reeking cesspit.
894 # ? Dec 20, 2019 16:38
895Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
896iospace
897Jan 18, 2038
898
899
900
901Fun Shoe	
902Cyrano4747 posted:
903D&D could be a neon fuscia splash page with hypnotically rotating bernie sanders heads and all posts in 8 degree off-kilter comic sans
904
905Mods please.
906 # ? Dec 20, 2019 17:32
907Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
908Ralp
909Aug 18, 2004
910
911by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
912LITERALLY A BIRD posted:
913I would agree with the not helldump don't use it as such phrasing.
914
915Helldump was a gimmick forum that existed as recently as over a decade ago so I suggest that this is meaningless, or maybe worse than meaningless because even among folks who remember it or have since gleaned anything about it, it's another one of those things that everyone is going to read and think they understand while each having a completely different understanding.
916 # ? Dec 20, 2019 17:44
917Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
918Cyrano4747
919Sep 25, 2006
920	
921Ralp posted:
922Helldump was a gimmick forum that existed as recently as over a decade ago so I suggest that this is meaningless, or maybe worse than meaningless because even among folks who remember it or have since gleaned anything about it, it's another one of those things that everyone is going to read and think they understand while each having a completely different understanding.
923
924The problem with heldump is that the very worst of what it embodied has become a fixed reference point for forums culture, to the point that 'heldumping' as a verb is something that many posters recognize.
925
926What heldump was or wasn't is besides the point - the larger issue is that it is a symbol of goon-on-goon bullshit that led to dumb drama and drove people off the site. Call out threads, cross-forum shit stirring, mock threads, etc. are broadly banned elsewhere on the general basis of "that's helldump bullshit, it was a mistake then, and we don't need it now."
927Cyrano4747 fucked around with this message at Dec 20, 2019 around 18:28
928
929 # ? Dec 20, 2019 18:18
930Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
931Jose
932Jul 24, 2007
933
934
935i really want to 6er ralp purely because i can rn but i'm aware it would be bad for this discourse. people have mostly said what i think so i'm largely staying out
936 # ? Dec 20, 2019 18:30
937Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
938Burt Sexual
939Jan 26, 2006
940
941
942Aida Cuevas is my Ranchera Princess
943
944
945Switchblade Switcharoo	I’m out of this thread and the gbs Fyad thread. Un bookmarking all concerning this.
946 # ? Dec 20, 2019 18:46
947Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
948Athanatos
949Jun 6, 2006
950
951It's a great trip.
952Ralp posted:
953Helldump was a gimmick forum that existed as recently as over a decade ago so I suggest that this is meaningless, or maybe worse than meaningless because even among folks who remember it or have since gleaned anything about it, it's another one of those things that everyone is going to read and think they understand while each having a completely different understanding.
954
955How would you word it? Something simple that shows that doxxing and deep diving into post history to dunk on people is not acceptable.
956
957Again, I dont think there is any perfect wording you are going to put into a stickied thread that locks down all discussion. It's going to be on the people who watch it to make sure it doesnt happen.
958 # ? Dec 20, 2019 18:58
959Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
960Ralp
961Aug 18, 2004
962
963by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
964Athanatos posted:
965How would you word it? Something simple that shows that doxxing and deep diving into post history to dunk on people is not acceptable.
966
967I'm just saying let's definitely avoid the word helldump but ok, for the former,
968the forum rules already posted:
969Harass and Sass: … Please do not post others' personal information (phone number, addresses, emails, etc.). Try to stay out of other peoples' personal lives as well.
970
971FYAD Freedoms: You cannot … harass others by posting their personal information … in FYAD.
972For the latter, uh, I don't understand what such a rule would solve nor how it could possibly be enforced nor why you would conflate these two things as if they were comparable. Like you know the "doxxing me by clicking the Post History button" catchphrase is a joke right?
973 # ? Dec 20, 2019 20:35
974Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
975Bookmark 12345Post Reply
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987«‹›5 »« Neo-FYAD Discussion › FYAD
988BookmarkPost Reply
989fool of sound
990Oct 10, 2012
991
992Soiled Meat	
993Facebook
994Twitter
995Share
996The behavior we want to stop with that kind of rule is 'stalking/harassing particular individuals/threads over extended periods' like they have with a few people, notably Koalas March. It's kinda the mock thread problem writ large: you run out of content so you keep finding littler, stupider things to pick at and blow out of proportion to keep the laughs coming. I think some good natured ribbing and light mockery is party of the forums, but it really needs to be transient. I don't think there's a hard and fast way of doing this, and I think whatever is decided won't stop the current crop of FYAD posters from consistently pushing the rules, because they've got away with it up until now. It really needs to be a mod team wide effort of high vigilance and zero tolerance for a while.
997 # ? Dec 20, 2019 21:22
998Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
999fool of sound
1000Oct 10, 2012
1001
1002Soiled Meat	I brought this up in the discord but imo we should probs have an anonymous mod account to play bad cop, at least until the biggest problem are beaten down or driven off.
1003 # ? Dec 20, 2019 21:55
1004Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1005Liquid Communism
1006Mar 9, 2004
1007
1008
1009Out here, everything hurts.
1010
1011
1012Fun Shoe	
1013graph posted:
1014something needs to be taken away. flags or sigs or both. of course it's their identity, that's why it'll sting
1015
1016I'm not so much thinking punishment as I am that the flags are an upload vector nobody but maybe Jeffrey has ability to act on and has been used to spam Simpsons child porn before when someone got butthurt.
1017 # ? Dec 20, 2019 22:32
1018Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1019Cyrano4747
1020Sep 25, 2006
1021	
1022fool of sound posted:
1023I brought this up in the discord but imo we should probs have an anonymous mod account to play bad cop, at least until the biggest problem are beaten down or driven off.
1024
1025Maybe use the robot? It's basically anonymous and as an admin account it should be able to do whatever the fuck.
1026
1027I don't know how eager the powers that be are to pass the keys to Mr. Roboto around though. Maybe just a FYAD-specific version of the QCS account.
1028 # ? Dec 20, 2019 22:35
1029Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1030alnilam
1031Nov 10, 2009
1032
1033
1034
1035I still think that if helldumping was something deemed to be toxic to the forums as a whole (and I agree with that notion), then digging into someone's post history to mock them should be off limits for the same reason. I get that FYAD is the mean and gross picture forum, but part of the point of this discussion is how to not let the mean part be damaging to the forums culture as a whole. If you want to mock people for making bad posts, I'm not a fan but fine go ahead, but don't dig up shit from more than a month ago imo.
1036 # ? Dec 21, 2019 12:10
1037Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1038fool of sound
1039Oct 10, 2012
1040
1041Soiled Meat	
1042alnilam posted:
1043If you want to mock people for making bad posts, I'm not a fan but fine go ahead, but don't dig up shit from more than a month ago imo.
1044
1045Yeah this is where I’m at.
1046 # ? Dec 21, 2019 12:13
1047Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1048Beer4TheBeerGod
1049Aug 23, 2004
1050
1051"I'm cisgender heterosexual white American male.
1052
1053Fuck you for telling me what "my part" is."
1054
1055- B4TBG on why they can't be criticized by minorities for being wrong because 
1056Exciting Lemon	
1057fool of sound posted:
1058I brought this up in the discord but imo we should probs have an anonymous mod account to play bad cop, at least until the biggest problem are beaten down or driven off.
1059
1060Please call it "Good Cop FYAD Cop"
1061 # ? Dec 21, 2019 12:28
1062Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1063Ralp
1064Aug 18, 2004
1065
1066by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1067forums poster manuel calvera posts in fyad, or for that matter posts something stupid in another forum, and someone in fyad mentions "lol this is the same guy who posted about his diaper fetish and how to make fake diaper poop with warm oatmeal" *posts quote from 2013* Sorry! The FYAD mod has specified that this quote has exceeded the one month statute of limitations. get real
1068 # ? Dec 21, 2019 15:46
1069Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1070Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1071Dec 31, 1969
1072
1073I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1074Floss Finder	
1075Ralp posted:
1076forums poster manuel calvera posts in fyad, or for that matter posts something stupid in another forum, and someone in fyad mentions "lol this is the same guy who posted about his diaper fetish and how to make fake diaper poop with warm oatmeal" *posts quote from 2013* Sorry! The FYAD mod has specified that this quote has exceeded the one month statute of limitations. get real
1077
1078I wish I could gas a thread, from my mind.
1079 # ? Dec 21, 2019 15:51
1080Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1081fool of sound
1082Oct 10, 2012
1083
1084Soiled Meat	
1085Ralp posted:
1086forums poster manuel calvera posts in fyad, or for that matter posts something stupid in another forum, and someone in fyad mentions "lol this is the same guy who posted about his diaper fetish and how to make fake diaper poop with warm oatmeal" *posts quote from 2013* Sorry! The FYAD mod has specified that this quote has exceeded the one month statute of limitations. get real
1087
1088It’s not so much the specific cut date as ‘don’t harass posters/threads forever’.
1089 # ? Dec 21, 2019 15:56
1090Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1091Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1092Dec 31, 1969
1093
1094I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1095Floss Finder	Yeah I think it would be a shame if that guy felt like he couldn't post about star wars in the movie forum without being harangued over ancient posts, but at the same time, people have long histories here and it isn't a crime to remember. That's what I'm getting at with the forums invasion thing, but enforcement in that case would have to come from the movie forum mod. I'm not about to institute mandatory minimums for remembering old posts that people have made.
1096 # ? Dec 21, 2019 16:02
1097Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1098Ralp
1099Aug 18, 2004
1100
1101by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1102so I don't forget. these were the IK rules for some years, I don't have anything to say about them right now though because I imagine iks won't make sense until new fyad stabilizes. but for the record
1103don't leak modqueue shit at all
1104don't queue up a bunch of dumb stuff. 6 hour probations are ok.
1105don't interfere with other forums. this includes probating people who didn't post in FYAD, or moving threads where they don't belong, or probating a moderator. probably some other stuff.
1106don't undo the actions of real mods/admins
1107please don't break tables in the lepers colony or put NWS images there
1108 # ? Dec 21, 2019 16:15
1109Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1110Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1111Dec 31, 1969
1112
1113I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1114Floss Finder	
1115Ralp posted:
1116so I don't forget. these were the IK rules for some years, I don't have anything to say about them right now though because I imagine iks won't make sense until new fyad stabilizes. but for the record
1117don't leak modqueue shit at all
1118don't queue up a bunch of dumb stuff. 6 hour probations are ok.
1119don't interfere with other forums. this includes probating people who didn't post in FYAD, or moving threads where they don't belong, or probating a moderator. probably some other stuff.
1120don't undo the actions of real mods/admins
1121please don't break tables in the lepers colony or put NWS images there
1122Yeah we never should have let these slip, they're good and ought to apply to all IKs, not just FYAD ones.
1123 # ? Dec 21, 2019 16:20
1124Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1125FluffieDuckie
1126May 11, 2005
1127
1128Ralp posted:
1129so I don't forget. these were the IK rules for some years, I don't have anything to say about them right now though because I imagine iks won't make sense until new fyad stabilizes. but for the record
1130don't leak modqueue shit at all
1131don't queue up a bunch of dumb stuff. 6 hour probations are ok.
1132don't interfere with other forums. this includes probating people who didn't post in FYAD, or moving threads where they don't belong, or probating a moderator. probably some other stuff.
1133don't undo the actions of real mods/admins
1134please don't break tables in the lepers colony or put NWS images there
1135
1136These are good. I'd maybe add in there not to spring their friends from longer probes by giving them 6ers.
1137 # ? Dec 21, 2019 17:34
1138Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1139Cyrano4747
1140Sep 25, 2006
1141	
1142FluffieDuckie posted:
1143These are good. I'd maybe add in there not to spring their friends from longer probes by giving them 6ers.
1144
1145I think that's covered by not fuckign with other mods actions.
1146
1147edit: still might be good to put in ". . . for example, jailbreaking a user from a longer probe with a sixer" because that's easily been the biggest IK problem we've had.
1148 # ? Dec 21, 2019 17:38
1149Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1150Burt Sexual
1151Jan 26, 2006
1152
1153
1154Aida Cuevas is my Ranchera Princess
1155
1156
1157Switchblade Switcharoo	Just want to pop in an say I find it fantastic that lowtax popped into the Fyad refugee camp simultaneously with me bowing out. He seems to be doing well given all the shit that he has going on.
1158 # ? Dec 21, 2019 22:15
1159Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1160Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1161Dec 31, 1969
1162
1163I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1164Floss Finder	Yeah lowtax reached out to me tonight about fyad - the rules he's asking for are no bigotry, nothing hateful, and "don't let mod sass get too personal". I think that is a reasonably vague line that the mod will have to draw the line on, but it shouldn't be too hard.
1165 # ? Dec 21, 2019 23:23
1166Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1167iospace
1168Jan 18, 2038
1169
1170
1171
1172Fun Shoe	I'm fine with intentionally vague rules, barring the whole bigotry one, natch. Why? Because with vague rules you can probate for clear violations of the spirit with it. With clearly defined rules, you know exactly what's going to happen: toeing the line with the intention of being an ass.
1173 # ? Dec 21, 2019 23:26
1174Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1175Burt Sexual
1176Jan 26, 2006
1177
1178
1179Aida Cuevas is my Ranchera Princess
1180
1181
1182Switchblade Switcharoo	
1183Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:
1184Yeah lowtax reached out to me tonight about fyad - the rules he's asking for are no bigotry, nothing hateful, and "don't let mod sass get too personal". I think that is a reasonably vague line that the mod will have to draw the line on, but it shouldn't be too hard.
1185
1186Can he put those in a bullet itemed list? I mean you can do your best but I’d think it best from him. If possible to lend credence, this will be a land shift. Idk how this is going to go down man. Wait, I do. Do it when he’s around btw like now.
1187 # ? Dec 21, 2019 23:34
1188Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1189Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1190Dec 31, 1969
1191
1192I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1193Floss Finder	That was more how he worded them to me, not how I'd state them in a rules thread - I think "too personal" is vague, specifically. The no bigotry rule will be extremely straightforward.
1194 # ? Dec 21, 2019 23:48
1195Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1196Burt Sexual
1197Jan 26, 2006
1198
1199
1200Aida Cuevas is my Ranchera Princess
1201
1202
1203Switchblade Switcharoo	I’m less worried about mod sass, a codified rule already, and more chasing down others in non Fyad forums tbh. The “ recent” rule seems good to me. Don’t go through months of posts for Christ sake you weenies.
1204
1205(Coming from a mod that was chased down)
1206 # ? Dec 21, 2019 23:58
1207Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1208Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1209Dec 31, 1969
1210
1211I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1212Floss Finder	To be clear I think shit about your kids is textbook "too personal", and KM owning a piano would be the same.
1213 # ? Dec 22, 2019 00:17
1214Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1215Lightning Knight
1216Feb 23, 2012
1217
1218Shoot First
1219Summary of some points I made in discord:
1220
1221Pog would be a good candidate for second fyad mod
1222
1223We need to clean house in the mod forum for our own security
1224
1225It should be an established expectation that fyad mods (and really all active mods) check the mod forum, post there occasionally, etc. So we avoid a repeat of Jack Daniels just kind of ignoring us for so long.
1226 # ? Dec 22, 2019 21:56
1227Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1228Cyrano4747
1229Sep 25, 2006
1230	.
1231Cyrano4747 fucked around with this message at Dec 22, 2019 around 23:56
1232
1233 # ? Dec 22, 2019 22:48
1234Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1235Lightning Knight
1236Feb 23, 2012
1237
1238Shoot First
1239Cyrano4747 posted:
1240I have misgivings about this, but admittedly only from what I've seen of him in QCS.
1241
1242Pog was a poor choice of QCS moderation partly because he decided to become The Voice of Good Moderation and start effectively speaking for people, and partly because he was only IK so he couldn’t ask us about anything.
1243
1244Also QCS has more fundamental issues with the way it’s currently set up and the fact that it has regulars or a “forum culture” is a failure imo.
1245
1246For FYAD, he’s basically ideal as a mod for them imo.
1247 # ? Dec 22, 2019 22:49
1248Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1249iospace
1250Jan 18, 2038
1251
1252
1253
1254Fun Shoe	Big thing to keep in mind: Outsiders will be watching like hawks. Expect a lot of reports. I personally feel that admins should review the reports after the mods have judged them, but that's me.
1255 # ? Dec 22, 2019 22:51
1256Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1257Burt Sexual
1258Jan 26, 2006
1259
1260
1261Aida Cuevas is my Ranchera Princess
1262
1263
1264Switchblade Switcharoo	.p
1265Burt Sexual fucked around with this message at Dec 22, 2019 around 23:09
1266
1267 # ? Dec 22, 2019 22:53
1268Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1269Cyrano4747
1270Sep 25, 2006
1271	.
1272Cyrano4747 fucked around with this message at Dec 22, 2019 around 23:57
1273
1274 # ? Dec 22, 2019 22:55
1275Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1276Burt Sexual
1277Jan 26, 2006
1278
1279
1280Aida Cuevas is my Ranchera Princess
1281
1282
1283Switchblade Switcharoo	.
1284Burt Sexual fucked around with this message at Dec 22, 2019 around 23:08
1285
1286 # ? Dec 22, 2019 22:59
1287Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1288Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1289Dec 31, 1969
1290
1291I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1292Floss Finder	FYAD is going to open on Tuesday
1293Jeffrey of YOSPOS fucked around with this message at Dec 23, 2019 around 00:19
1294
1295 # ? Dec 22, 2019 23:06
1296Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1297Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1298Dec 31, 1969
1299
1300I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1301Floss Finder	
1302iospace posted:
1303Big thing to keep in mind: Outsiders will be watching like hawks. Expect a lot of reports. I personally feel that admins should review the reports after the mods have judged them, but that's me.
1304My plan is certainly not to reopen fyad and forget about it - I will at least be paying attention and plan on supporting the new fyad mods directly.
1305 # ? Dec 22, 2019 23:13
1306Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1307Burt Sexual
1308Jan 26, 2006
1309
1310
1311Aida Cuevas is my Ranchera Princess
1312
1313
1314Switchblade Switcharoo	
1315Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:
1316My plan is certainly not to reopen fyad and forget about it - I will at least be paying attention and plan on supporting the new fyad mods directly.
1317
1318When qqcs is reopened, we should get some prior notice? Have we even talked about how that’s gonna be handled bc there will be dozens of threads opened...
1319
1320I’ll stay the fuck away from the keys unless requested for assistance.
1321 # ? Dec 22, 2019 23:19
1322Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1323Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1324Dec 31, 1969
1325
1326I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1327Floss Finder	
1328Burt Sexual posted:
1329When qqcs is reopened, we should get some prior notice? Have we even talked about how that’s gonna be handled bc there will be dozens of threads opened...
1330
1331I’ll stay the fuck away from the keys unless requested for assistance.
1332
1333Lowtax has taken a keen interest in FYAD reopening, and none at all on QCS. So.....after. That's all I got.
1334 # ? Dec 22, 2019 23:20
1335Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1336Burt Sexual
1337Jan 26, 2006
1338
1339
1340Aida Cuevas is my Ranchera Princess
1341
1342
1343Switchblade Switcharoo	
1344Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:
1345Lowtax has taken a keen interest in FYAD reopening, and none at all on QCS. So.....after. That's all I got.
1346
1347That’s wat I guessed, nbd.
1348 # ? Dec 22, 2019 23:22
1349Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1350Fedule
1351Mar 26, 2010
1352
1353
1354No one left uncured.
1355I got you.
1356Are we done issuing the permas that need issuing? Do we have a statement we can give to the many people still looking for one? I've told some people "sit tight, we're on it" and I would very much like to have something further to tell them when our solution hits v1.0, so to speak.
1357 # ? Dec 23, 2019 05:35
1358Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1359Party Plane Jones
1360Jul 1, 2007
1361
1362by Reene
1363Fun Shoe	as far as I’m aware there isn’t anybody that needed a perma outstanding, everybody else who didn’t reach the absolute shitbird criteria ate a ban and thirty. Would probably need to go back and look at the discussions from last week to double check though
1364 # ? Dec 23, 2019 07:10
1365Profile Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1366pog boyfriend
1367Jul 1, 2011
1368
1369
1370Lightning Knight posted:
1371Summary of some points I made in discord:
1372
1373Pog would be a good candidate for second fyad mod
1374
1375We need to clean house in the mod forum for our own security
1376
1377It should be an established expectation that fyad mods (and really all active mods) check the mod forum, post there occasionally, etc. So we avoid a repeat of Jack Daniels just kind of ignoring us for so long.
1378
1379hello, briefly glanced through this thread and saw this post. i have not really processed anything here nor do i have the time to until much later today but for posterity just chiming in to say that i have seen this post and intend to check the mod forum(and whatever this is)
1380 # ? Dec 23, 2019 16:14
1381Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1382Dash Rendar
1383Jan 9, 2007
1384
1385Han Solo, ha! If I'm around, you don't need that guy.
1386Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:
1387FYAD is going to open on Tuesday
1388
1389Wait for midnight and it can be a Christmas miracle!
1390 # ? Dec 23, 2019 16:18
1391Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1392pog boyfriend
1393Jul 1, 2011
1394
1395
1396after reviewing the posts, a common point of contention was that goonlulz was too specific and crossed over into harassment territory. this is something i personally have believed for months and have repeatedly called out other posters for in the past. not only do i agree with this rule, but one of the main things i wanted to do as a moderator was to specifically implement that, so i am glad we are on the same page on that. if we are making a new forumid(not sure if this is still the case, saw it in an earlier page..? mods???) i would like to request that specific megathreads be moved over to preserve the historicity of them. i am hardpressed to see why a thread for talking about anime, or coffee, or beer, should be purged and started anew. having those threads moved over would be a strong show of good faith if the argument is to make a new forumid.
1397 # ? Dec 23, 2019 18:08
1398Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1399Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1400Dec 31, 1969
1401
1402I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1403Floss Finder	Yeah I am fine with moving over some threads from the old one, mainly the thing I don't want is people bumping old threads and them getting lots of reports for stuff posted pre-closure. Better to have a relatively clean slate.
1404
1405All this started because night crew won the war so maybe that one should stay gone though. 
1406 # ? Dec 23, 2019 18:16
1407Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1408Bookmark 12345Post Reply
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1421BookmarkPost Reply
1422Cyrano4747
1423Sep 25, 2006
1424	
1425Facebook
1426Twitter
1427Share
1428pog boyfriend posted:
1429preserve the historicity of them. i am hardpressed to see why a thread for talking about anime, or coffee, or beer, should be purged and started anew. having those threads moved over would be a strong show of good faith if the argument is to make a new forumid.
1430
1431I think starting with a completely blank slate would make a powerful statement about how fucked shit was and that the place needs a fundamental reboot. We need Stunde Null, a "zero hour" of complete rupture where what was is in the past and what will be is being done right now.
1432 # ? Dec 23, 2019 20:30
1433Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1434pog boyfriend
1435Jul 1, 2011
1436
1437
1438Cyrano4747 posted:
1439I think starting with a completely blank slate would make a powerful statement about how fucked shit was and that the place needs a fundamental reboot. We need Stunde Null, a "zero hour" of complete rupture where what was is in the past and what will be is being done right now.
1440
1441it would be a powerful statement, one that would ultimately drive off almost every returning poster. the harmless decades old threads for crews and mundane posting are a stable throughline as fyad has changed constantly over the years. keeping them while changing everything else still maintains the same powerful impact without removing any reason for any returning poster to return. if someone comes back to 6 of the most beloved threads and nothing else, they still will notice the tens of thousands of missing threads
1442 # ? Dec 23, 2019 20:57
1443Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1444Koalas March
1445May 20, 2007
1446
1447	I think it's a bad idea int his case to cater to the old posters when in reality we should be making a new sub with new rules and if they want to participate in it they can. Like if we want an edgy type comedy forum that's cool and good but I think we're too worried about making sure the old posters are comfortable when we should be more inclined to open it up to new people because the problem was it was already full of cliques and we've seen what that does. Both then and today
1448 # ? Dec 23, 2019 21:06
1449Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1450Cyrano4747
1451Sep 25, 2006
1452	I'll also add that having ancient megathreads just breeds insularity. It's something I've been working in on my subs, trying to reboot big threads as often as possible. When a user sees a thread with 10k pages they just nope out as often as not. Even if the thread wants to be welcoming, by its very structure it isn't and you end up with the same dozen or so posters just having a conversation with each other rather than the forum as a whole.
1453
1454TFR's general bullshit chat thread is a great example. I got a LOT of pushback when I killed it and rebooted the thread monthly. This let me put in a new theme each month and gave new posters an easier entry point. And, in the 4 or 5 months since I've done that, I've seen a fucking TON of new posters in that thread. Lurkers I never knew were around. Entirely new posters who poked their heads in the sub and decided to say hi in the general chat thread, because that's the logical landing place for someone looking at a new community.
1455
1456By the same token the GBS OSHA thread just rebooted a while ago and I actually started following it. I'd read the old one a bit but when I saw the 1000+ pages of unread shit I just coudln't be bothered, and I always felt weird skipping to the end of it. Now that it was rebooted I'm actively following it and actively contributing.
1457
1458Starting an all new FYAD with all new threads will encourage new posters to come in. Maybe we lose a few of the old guard, but more importantly it won't effectively be a private subforum for a small clique of posters. We WANT new blood in FYAAD. We want it to be a growing, thriving subforum and not just a club house for the same small group of posters.
1459
1460I've heard the refrain that there are hardly any FYAD posters left a lot in this discussion, and this is part of how you fix that. If FYAD is that stagnant then it needs to be revitalized, otherwise why bother having it at all?
1461 # ? Dec 23, 2019 21:12
1462Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1463Lightning Knight
1464Feb 23, 2012
1465
1466Shoot First
1467I would propose a compromise of letting them remake old threads anew but with the original OP quoted as the OP. It preserves the connection to the original threads while making them more open to newcomers.
1468 # ? Dec 23, 2019 21:15
1469Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1470Koalas March
1471May 20, 2007
1472
1473	
1474Lightning Knight posted:
1475I would propose a compromise of letting them remake old threads anew but with the original OP quoted as the OP. It preserves the connection to the original threads while making them more open to newcomers.
1476
1477This seems like a great compromise tbh
1478 # ? Dec 23, 2019 21:18
1479Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1480Cyrano4747
1481Sep 25, 2006
1482	Yeah, that sounds solid. A lot of rebooted megathreads get some link or tie to the other ones. I think the milhist megathred over in A/T has something like 3 or 4 previous iterations linked in its OP.
1483 # ? Dec 23, 2019 21:19
1484Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1485Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1486Dec 31, 1969
1487
1488I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1489Floss Finder	Part of FYAD is that it is heavily curated. I realize that sounds like a joke in the face of the big glaring gap in that curation, but being pruned explicitly for quality by some metric is part of what makes it FYAD. My plan is to add to that metric, not get rid of it. They were always open to new posters but there was a rigorous acceptance process - at times they had newbie threads where you'd get a "sponsor" who would help you raise the standards of what you post until you make it or flame out. I'm sure they will be on board with getting new posters in fyad, it's something that has been discussed in the GBS FYAD thread and a bunch of people say they are going to try it out. It is pretty much the only forum on the internet that operates this way and it's interesting enough that I'd like to see it play out once more. I will encourage a mod or an IK to make a new newbie thread to try and handle the influx of new folks. Encouraging folks to make new threads instead of sticking to big megathreads is certainly part of this.
1490
1491That said I'm not attached to moving over, say, the massive coffee thread - a new thread about coffee would be fine and you can have garret's fail in the OP.
1492Jeffrey of YOSPOS fucked around with this message at Dec 23, 2019 around 21:27
1493
1494 # ? Dec 23, 2019 21:24
1495Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1496LITERALLY A BIRD
1497Sep 26, 2008
1498
1499I knew you were trouble
1500when you flew in
1501
1502Koalas March posted:
1503I think it's a bad idea int his case to cater to the old posters when in reality we should be making a new sub with new rules and if they want to participate in it they can. Like if we want an edgy type comedy forum that's cool and good but I think we're too worried about making sure the old posters are comfortable when we should be more inclined to open it up to new people because the problem was it was already full of cliques and we've seen what that does. Both then and today
1504
1505I agree with this and think LK's suggestion is good.
1506 # ? Dec 23, 2019 21:24
1507Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1508pog boyfriend
1509Jul 1, 2011
1510
1511
1512i think keeping the megathreads is an important show to existing posters that this forum is still fyad. my initial reaction to hearing that fyad was going to be rebooted was thinking "why would anyone want to post there" -- lurkers especially. purging everything and creating a new forum in its place in the ashes that has no real connection to what fyad is a great way to create a forum that will have an initial influx of people and no real staying power. there is no connection to fyad history, there is no pride in the forum, and there is no tangible difference between gbs, a forum that already exists.
1513
1514on the other hand, if the megathreads were still around... the gbs fyad refugee thread has been eye opening for me, as it showed to me the difference between fyad and gbs, but showed how many people around the forums really care about what we do and want us to exist. i honestly hope that even half the people wishing us well post in fyad, and i have said so many times in the past. i think a rebooted fyad with the megathreads would be enough to signal to the existing fyad diaspora that their home still exists, but the context surrounding it(and the newly mostly cleared out forum) will show those lurkers and people that have wanted fyad that this is a chance at being in the ground floor of the rebuilt fyad.
1515 # ? Dec 23, 2019 21:33
1516Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1517Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1518Dec 31, 1969
1519
1520I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1521Floss Finder	
1522pog boyfriend posted:
1523i think keeping the megathreads is an important show to existing posters that this forum is still fyad. my initial reaction to hearing that fyad was going to be rebooted was thinking "why would anyone want to post there" -- lurkers especially. purging everything and creating a new forum in its place in the ashes that has no real connection to what fyad is a great way to create a forum that will have an initial influx of people and no real staying power. there is no connection to fyad history, there is no pride in the forum, and there is no tangible difference between gbs, a forum that already exists.
1524
1525on the other hand, if the megathreads were still around... the gbs fyad refugee thread has been eye opening for me, as it showed to me the difference between fyad and gbs, but showed how many people around the forums really care about what we do and want us to exist. i honestly hope that even half the people wishing us well post in fyad, and i have said so many times in the past. i think a rebooted fyad with the megathreads would be enough to signal to the existing fyad diaspora that their home still exists, but the context surrounding it(and the newly mostly cleared out forum) will show those lurkers and people that have wanted fyad that this is a chance at being in the ground floor of the rebuilt fyad.
1526Yeah I think there is something to be said for a touch of the old. It's probably something to do sparingly but I'm hesitant to say none at all. I would personally like it if the new mods would do things to help these new folks find their footing and creating new threads that they can figure out the right way to post in is part of that. Threadnesday should return.
1527 # ? Dec 23, 2019 21:36
1528Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1529pog boyfriend
1530Jul 1, 2011
1531
1532
1533Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:
1534Yeah I think there is something to be said for a touch of the old. It's probably something to do sparingly but I'm hesitant to say none at all. I would personally like it if the new mods would do things to help these new folks find their footing and creating new threads that they can figure out the right way to post in is part of that. Threadnesday should return.
1535
1536as a poster i can honestly say threadnesday was a bit stressful, like i would come on and find out it is threadnesday and have to come up with a thread(something i am very bad at)... i would like to revamp a threadnesday however, to make it a bit less tense. maybe mixing threadnesday with the ik contest ..? post a thread for a chance to win. something like that. food for thought, anyway. you are probably right that we do not need to bring the thread where people post "got the coffees" and "hot one today" 2000 times, but at the least, day crew, night crew, and flags thread should be moved. if i had my wish the japanese horse thread would as well because it made some people really mad how broken the thread was due to being a decade old
1537 # ? Dec 23, 2019 21:40
1538Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1539Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1540Dec 31, 1969
1541
1542I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1543Floss Finder	the japanese horse one is actually the one I most want to keep around
1544 # ? Dec 23, 2019 21:46
1545Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1546FluffieDuckie
1547May 11, 2005
1548
1549Hi pog. Welcome!
1550
1551Regarding these mega-threads. How many are there and how clean are they? I mean as soon as we reopen the forum and leave a few threads there everyone’s going to dig through them and report every slur and say the mods obviously support slurs because we left these threads in open forums.
1552
1553Alternatively would it be possible to start to move a few favorite threads once things have settled down?
1554 # ? Dec 23, 2019 22:16
1555Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1556Junpei Hyde
1557Mar 15, 2013
1558
1559Never believe in lies	Im in favour of the OP quoting
1560 # ? Dec 23, 2019 23:15
1561Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1562pog boyfriend
1563Jul 1, 2011
1564
1565
1566FluffieDuckie posted:
1567Hi pog. Welcome!
1568
1569Regarding these mega-threads. How many are there and how clean are they? I mean as soon as we reopen the forum and leave a few threads there everyone’s going to dig through them and report every slur and say the mods obviously support slurs because we left these threads in open forums.
1570
1571Alternatively would it be possible to start to move a few favorite threads once things have settled down?
1572
1573these threads have been around for decades, i can not say they are entirely clean. however, a lot of fyad culture stems from these threads. if the goal is to make fyad, having the source of fyad culture which will inevitably be referenced available is better for newbies and veterans alike... and for lurkers who have always wanted to post in fyad, it would be a great signifier.
1574
1575i think “once things have settled down” would be too late. if we reopen a forum that is called fyad but other than the background has none of the things people love about fyad(except me) then it will just be a completely different forum with a new paint job.
1576
1577unlike the other forums, fyad has only a culture. the other forums have a culture and a topic(save for byob), something immediately obvious that signifies to users what will be posted there. for example, i will likely pop into the inevitable owl house thread when that show is made. i know nothing about the board culture there and will not have to...
1578
1579fyad is different, as the only difference it has is that it has a proud attitude and a desire to make people laugh first, as well as having zero recompense for disliked posters. this is what i love the most about fyad, and why i appear hostile to certain posters, people who come in the forum to post things that everyone else does not like or in the case of racists like anchoress, that everyone is uncomfortable with. take that attitude away and fyad is nothing.
1580
1581take it back to the byob example however... if we took the stylesheet of byob and replaced all the posters with ex helldumpers, the forum absolutely would not be byob. we can all see that, right? there were certain parts of fyad that i, and others, found odious(as jeffrey would attest), but i genuinely believe its core is good, something genuinely unique on the internet. it is not an elite exclusive invite only club, nobody vouched for me, people openly flamed me when i joined. i earned peoples respect.
1582
1583there is a problem of image where people for some reason believe this is not the case, and it is something i hope to address, but my goal here is to show the mod staff what fyad is like to an inside perspective... and as an insider, a new forum without these megathreads would be very bad. removed from this context, i personally would not even bother posting in the new forum were that to be the case. since i was chosen to mod this forum, i can only imagine you consider me to be a model of how you want fyad posters to behave. well, if the situation were different, i might have ended up as a league of legends thread poster
1584 # ? Dec 24, 2019 12:28
1585Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1586Cyrano4747
1587Sep 25, 2006
1588	Here’s my question: how likely are these thread to be referenced? I’m in the process of rebooting a mega thread right now because even though it has legit useful information in it it’s inaccessible as no one is going to read through it to find that stuff.
1589
1590I just find it hard to believe that someone is going to deep dive on a decade of FYAD posting. Not saying anything against FYAD with that bit it does have a much more chatty and conversational and fast moving style.
1591 # ? Dec 24, 2019 12:31
1592Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1593pog boyfriend
1594Jul 1, 2011
1595
1596
1597Cyrano4747 posted:
1598Here’s my question: how likely are these thread to be referenced? I’m in the process of rebooting a mega thread right now because even though it has legit useful information in it it’s inaccessible as no one is going to read through it to find that stuff.
1599
1600I just find it hard to believe that someone is going to deep dive on a decade of FYAD posting. Not saying anything against FYAD with that bit it does have a much more chatty and conversational and fast moving style.
1601
1602it happens often enough in the night crew thread, i have had my posts pulled up(and pulled up the posts of others). we also see it from time to time in the day crew thread, often in reference to arfjasons capri sun ketchup post but waynes 4 food theory gets brought up too. i can not speak for the beer thread as i was not really part of that thread, but from the crew threads alone i can say it does come up.
1603
1604E: and the japanese horse thread is an institution.
1605 # ? Dec 24, 2019 12:49
1606Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1607Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1608Dec 31, 1969
1609
1610I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1611Floss Finder	I really would like to open FYAD today, on the lord's most hallowed tuesday, but c-spam blew up yesterday and it's extremely christmas right now in my life. Maybe in new fyad things happen....on thursdays?
1612 # ? Dec 24, 2019 13:09
1613Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1614alnilam
1615Nov 10, 2009
1616
1617
1618
1619Boxing Day to symbolize the pugilistic posting attitude fyad is known for
1620 # ? Dec 24, 2019 13:10
1621Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1622iospace
1623Jan 18, 2038
1624
1625
1626
1627Fun Shoe	
1628alnilam posted:
1629Boxing Day to symbolize the pugilistic posting attitude fyad is known for
1630
1631
1632 # ? Dec 24, 2019 13:14
1633Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1634pog boyfriend
1635Jul 1, 2011
1636
1637
1638Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:
1639I really would like to open FYAD today, on the lord's most hallowed tuesday, but c-spam blew up yesterday and it's extremely christmas right now in my life. Maybe in new fyad things happen....on thursdays?
1640
1641the most elaborate threadnesday of all
1642 # ? Dec 24, 2019 13:17
1643Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1644Koalas March
1645May 20, 2007
1646
1647	"fyad only has a culture" yes, that culture was rotten. We're cutting away the rot and making room for new growth. Nature abhors a vacuum, something new and better can spring forth.
1648
1649I really don't understand why keeping the OPs isn't a valid compromise. Like someone said, who is personally going to comb through those threads and check for slurs etc? Because if they're not completely vetted, it's going to come down on us for okaying those threads crossing over to the new forum. And ultimately they'd be right.
1650
1651Furthermore, once again the focus seems to be on preserving some ineffable ideal of what the forum was, while simultaneously handwaving away and incidentally validating what it actually was. Which was bad. Which is why it was closed. And being renamed.
1652
1653The culture was toxic and it won't change if you hold onto it with a vice grip.
1654 # ? Dec 24, 2019 13:23
1655Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1656Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1657Dec 31, 1969
1658
1659I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1660Floss Finder	I think closing the forum for two weeks, removing the mod, banning a bunch of people, creating a new forumid and introducing new rules sends that message pretty clearly. Nods to the old in the form of a few old threads sticking around is not going to make or break that. The point of the exercise is not to destroy old fyad, but to cut away the rot while preserving what was good.
1661 # ? Dec 24, 2019 13:29
1662Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1663LITERALLY A BIRD
1664Sep 26, 2008
1665
1666I knew you were trouble
1667when you flew in
1668
1669Is transferring some of the old megathreads, keeping them locked, and then making new versions of them for people to post in under the new rules as suggested by LK an acceptable middle ground? The old crew can still have some reminders of home while we keep the message of THIS IS A NEW FYAD, FOLLOW THE NEW RULES.
1670 # ? Dec 24, 2019 13:48
1671Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1672pog boyfriend
1673Jul 1, 2011
1674
1675
1676LITERALLY A BIRD posted:
1677Is transferring some of the old megathreads, keeping them locked, and then making new versions of them for people to post in under the new rules as suggested by LK an acceptable middle ground? The old crew can still have some reminders of home while we keep the message of THIS IS A NEW FYAD, FOLLOW THE NEW RULES.
1678
1679this seems like a compromise for the sake of having a compromise. the new rules are in effect regardless of whether or not we have a new thread made, and the way people bring up old posts is more akin to "hey remember that post you made in 2017 about hunter x hunter(2011)" as a way of making the forum more readable for newbies/lurkers instead of making the same reference but then leaving the reader to figure out what people are talking about on their own.
1680 # ? Dec 24, 2019 14:05
1681Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1682Ralp
1683Aug 18, 2004
1684
1685by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1686Lightning Knight posted:
1687I would propose a compromise of letting them remake old threads anew but with the original OP quoted as the OP. It preserves the connection to the original threads while making them more open to newcomers.
1688
1689wow what a gracious concession to allow posters to do something that there is absolutely no reason they wouldn't be allowed regardless
1690 # ? Dec 24, 2019 19:31
1691Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1692fool of sound
1693Oct 10, 2012
1694
1695Soiled Meat	Ugh. Unlike removing cosmetic features I definately see the appeal of fresh start fyad and the potential pitfalls of bringing in old fyad threads that may not abide by the new rules. I also don't want to make what is already going to be a contentious and difficult change moreso, especially for pog and ralp or whoever, who will bear the brunt of it. We don't want to appear to lowtax or the fyad posters to be trying to just kill off fyad by replacing it with a new pink forum with no connection to the old. I think the compromise of bringing over a handful of the most beloved and least problematic threads is probably the best way forward if it will get the current candidate to agree to mod, especially since lowtax would rather like us to get fyad up and running soon.
1696 # ? Dec 25, 2019 00:19
1697Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1698Cyrano4747
1699Sep 25, 2006
1700	
1701fool of sound posted:
1702Ugh. Unlike removing cosmetic features I definately see the appeal of fresh start fyad and the potential pitfalls of bringing in old fyad threads that may not abide by the new rules. I also don't want to make what is already going to be a contentious and difficult change moreso, especially for pog and ralp or whoever, who will bear the brunt of it. We don't want to appear to lowtax or the fyad posters to be trying to just kill off fyad by replacing it with a new pink forum with no connection to the old. I think the compromise of bringing over a handful of the most beloved and least problematic threads is probably the best way forward if it will get the current candidate to agree to mod, especially since lowtax would rather like us to get fyad up and running soon.
1703
1704In that vein I think that we should target Jan 1 as the day to make some of these changes. It's a clean break point and I think shit has gone on long enough that it's sunk in how fucked the earlier behavior was.
1705 # ? Dec 25, 2019 11:52
1706Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1707Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1708Dec 31, 1969
1709
1710I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1711Floss Finder	
1712Cyrano4747 posted:
1713In that vein I think that we should target Jan 1 as the day to make some of these changes. It's a clean break point and I think shit has gone on long enough that it's sunk in how fucked the earlier behavior was.
1714Hah I feel we've waited too long already and really do intend to open FYAD on Thursday. Lowtax has been asking and it's been almost 2 weeks, it's time. I am much more free this week than next week. January 1st might be a good day for QCS but I'm going to be hosting guests that week and I don't want to explain to them why I'm ignoring them all day for the forums, so I don't know if that's viable.
1715 # ? Dec 25, 2019 12:25
1716Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1717Ralp
1718Aug 18, 2004
1719
1720by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1721Ralp posted:
1722or is it going to be designed by committee without a shared goal and subject to so many conflicting parameters that whoever agrees to mod the thing is just being unintentionally set up to expend a ton of time and effort and stress, and then fail.
1723
1724fucking surprise
1725 # ? Dec 31, 2019 04:13
1726Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1727FluffieDuckie
1728May 11, 2005
1729
1730Ralp posted:
1731fucking surprise
1732
1733Hi Ralp! I’m sorry for the unpleasantness 
1734 # ? Dec 31, 2019 17:58
1735Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1736graph
1737Nov 21, 2006
1738
1739aaag peanuts
1740
1741
1742Soiled Meat	it's over, rip in piss
1743 # ? Jan 6, 2020 18:48
1744Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1745Lightning Knight
1746Feb 23, 2012
1747
1748Shoot First
1749fuck fyad lol, good riddance
1750 # ? Jan 6, 2020 19:16
1751Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1752Koalas March
1753May 20, 2007
1754
1755	
1756Lightning Knight posted:
1757fuck fyad lol, good riddance
1758
1759
1760 # ? Jan 6, 2020 19:34
1761Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1762pog boyfriend
1763Jul 1, 2011
1764
1765
1766hey everyone. just hanging out here haha
1767 # ? Jan 6, 2020 19:40
1768Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1769nine-gear crow
1770Aug 10, 2013
1771
1772red bird	
1773pog boyfriend posted:
1774hey everyone. just hanging out here haha
1775
1776Congratulations on being the Last Mod of FYAD.
1777 # ? Jan 6, 2020 20:47
1778Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1779pog boyfriend
1780Jul 1, 2011
1781
1782
1783nine-gear crow posted:
1784Congratulations on being the Last Mod of FYAD.
1785
1786is this what this "battle royale" thing i have been hearing about is
1787 # ? Jan 6, 2020 21:06
1788Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1789Junpei Hyde
1790Mar 15, 2013
1791
1792Never believe in lies	can this be the unofficial mod shitpost corner
1793 # ? Jan 8, 2020 17:07
1794Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1795Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1796Dec 31, 1969
1797
1798I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1799Floss Finder	
1800Junpei Hyde posted:
1801can this be the unofficial mod shitpost corner
1802Maybe this should be the ex-mod forum. A place to commiserate on forums goings on and the tasks assigned to any moderator or administrator. No one has been more sympathetic during all of this than those who have held the title of mod or admin in the past. We can avoid specifics of present issues while laughing about the idea of moderating this place in perpetuity.
1803Jeffrey of YOSPOS fucked around with this message at Jan 8, 2020 around 17:57
1804
1805 # ? Jan 8, 2020 17:13
1806Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
1807Bookmark 12345Post Reply
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1821alnilam
1822Nov 10, 2009
1823
1824
1825
1826Facebook
1827Twitter
1828Share
1829pog boyfriend posted:
1830hey everyone. just hanging out here haha
1831
1832lol
1833
1834All things considered it seems like you gave it a good and serious try, 
1835 # ? Jan 8, 2020 17:35
1836Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1837Dash Rendar
1838Jan 9, 2007
1839
1840Han Solo, ha! If I'm around, you don't need that guy.
1841Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:
1842Maybe this should be the ex-mod forum.
1843
1844yeah!
1845
1846let pog and ralp stay.
1847 # ? Jan 8, 2020 22:27
1848Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1849DJ Fuckboy Supreme
1850Feb 10, 2011
1851
1852And when you stare long into the abyss, you become aggressively, terminally chill
1853
1854
1855ed balls
1856 # ? Jan 8, 2020 23:56
1857Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1858Gigi Galli
1859Sep 19, 2003
1860
1861WORLD COMPETITVE VAPING CHAMPION 2017/18
1862~~PHAT CLOUDS~~
1863NASIOC MASSIVE
1864~~MONSTER ENERGY~~
1865DJ Fuckboy Supreme posted:
1866ed balls
1867 # ? Jan 9, 2020 08:52
1868Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1869iospace
1870Jan 18, 2038
1871
1872
1873
1874Fun Shoe	
1875DJ Fuckboy Supreme posted:
1876ed balls
1877 # ? Jan 9, 2020 09:02
1878Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1879Junpei Hyde
1880Mar 15, 2013
1881
1882Never believe in lies	
1883DJ Fuckboy Supreme posted:
1884ed balls
1885 # ? Jan 9, 2020 13:48
1886Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1887graph
1888Nov 21, 2006
1889
1890aaag peanuts
1891
1892
1893Soiled Meat	
1894DJ Fuckboy Supreme posted:
1895ed balls
1896 # ? Jan 9, 2020 16:15
1897Profile Message Post History Rap SheetAlert Moderators   Quote
1898Jeffrey of YOSPOS
1899Dec 31, 1969
1900
1901I WILL MEDITATE AND THEN DESTROY YOU
1902Floss Finder	Gonna use this forum to test new stylesheets as well.
1903 # ? Jan 9, 2020 17:25
1904Profile Message Post History Rap SheetQuote
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1907 
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